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workingpoor

Uk Property Investors Set For A Refund From Spanish Banks

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36299927

Tens of thousands of British investors who lost money when the Spanish property market collapsed could be in line for a major payout.

Spain's supreme court has ruled that banks should pay back all deposits lost by those who bought off-plan apartments.

Seems no-one is allowed to realise a loss.

Edited by workingpoor

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Buying off plan the money should be held on account and only handed over on completion. Although once more investing appears to be a loss free adventure.

Bit like a rental deposit..

Put in a safe place and arbitrated by a third party.......

Of course the question is will the Spanish banks comply...

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What does buy off-plan mean in this context?

I think it means when you put a deposit down on a (yet to be built) Golfing bungalow you saw on a fantastic looking artist's impression at a foreign property investing seminar, drinking posh coffee & hob nobbing with other "Savvy Investors" ?

Lot's of exaggeration of "rental income"

And for the really savvy types the opportunity to denominate the Mortgage in Swiss Francs!!

Bet this all traces back to 2007.

Edited by workingpoor

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Buying off plan the money should be held on account and only handed over on completion. Although once more investing appears to be a loss free adventure.

Offplan prices usually cheaper than surrounding market values - but can still be total bubble prices in a mad bubble - because of all the risks of buying offplan. Often the money/deposit churned into the cost of building those developments. Getting it started. Men on site, foundation, first and second stages. Spreading and sharing the risks away from the developer. Delays to build. Change in market conditions.

Another buyer bailout? All this follows on from the quest for innocence - the anti-HPC view (and why there's been no HPC here and still wider masses in love with HPI++++) - that people are incapable of making their own decisions. That prices get bid up by victims, and other people have to carry it, with no losses for the mad-gainerz chasers allowed.

Buyers always want their money back if delays/problems, but happy as anything if prices go up, and don't expect developers to come chasing them for the profit in a rising market.

So the banks in Spain are on the hook for other businesses (property developers) who ran their accounts with them? Suggests to me they'll have to do something similar for all companies who do their business banking with them. Chased mad-gainz investing with a company that goes under / hibernation? Aww get your investment back from the bank / shareholders. Hope banks get it overturned.

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So say it is 50,000 investors and given 7+ years of punitive interest rate £20k per head that is £1B loss to Spanish banks. Chump change to Santander but enough to tip some of the Cajas into state bailout/bailin?

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Offplan prices usually cheaper than surrounding market values - but can still be total bubble prices in a mad bubble - because of all the risks of buying offplan. Often the money/deposit churned into the cost of building those developments. Getting it started. Men on site, foundation, first and second stages. Spreading and sharing the risks away from the developer. Delays to build. Change in market conditions.

Another buyer bailout? All this follows on from the quest for innocence - the anti-HPC view (and why there's been no HPC here and still wider masses in love with HPI++++) - that people are incapable of making their own decisions. That prices get bid up by victims, and other people have to carry it, with no losses for the mad-gainerz chasers allowed.

Buyers always want their money back if delays/problems, but happy as anything if prices go up, and don't expect developers to come chasing them for the profit in a rising market.

So the banks in Spain are on the hook for other businesses (property developers) who ran their accounts with them? Suggests to me they'll have to do something similar for all companies who do their business banking with them. Chased mad-gainz investing with a company that goes under / hibernation? Aww get your investment back from the bank / shareholders. Hope banks get it overturned.

Spanish banks were the recipients of a $52bn bailout from EU taxpayers in 2012. Principal among them Bankia, on which half the funds were lavished, just a year after it had been made public. Some idea of the rampant criminality at work in the Spanish banking industry may be gleaned from the Wall Street Journal article below. You are seriously misguided if you think these people are in any way deserving of our sympathies.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/for-spains-banks-a-bigger-test-is-ahead-1414434235

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Spanish banks were the recipients of a $52bn bailout from EU taxpayers in 2012. Principal among them Bankia, on which half the funds were lavished, just a year after it had been made public. Some idea of the rampant criminality at work in the Spanish banking industry may be gleaned from the Wall Street Journal article below. You are seriously misguided if you think these people are in any way deserving of our sympathies.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/for-spains-banks-a-bigger-test-is-ahead-1414434235

You think I don't know that...?

In the UK I want strong banks to handle correction (inc HPC).

Seems to me too many individuals - even on the mad-gainz long wave HPI side - will find any reason to blame the banks, for anything in the market.

Yet also we have a situation where even hpcers can't let it go.... - can't look forward.

Seemingly they will take anyone calling out their 'injustice' (offplan buyers) as meaning the banks should pay up for it. Always the banks, no matter what. It seems to me they would prefer another HPI doubling rather than any HPC so they can keep up their anti-bank positions.

"Bailout for him, bailout for her, protect the HPI with bailouts for everyone... always the banks to blame for everything!"

Whereas I know senior people who've qualified post crunch - who have had positions in the restructuring of banks (temporary assignments) - who are entirely innocent, and renting and saving vs the HPI protection / innocence / blame banks / more HPI. I'm no friend to boom 1.0 bankers, but got to look forward.

Washington Post

comment left on article (circa 2010-11)

Throughout my career, I have had criminals sit in front of me and in most instances they offered attempted to rationalize their behavior. Often, they would use the same excuse the Ritters are using --- they would claim that their wrongful behavior was justified by someone else's wrongful behavior.

Yes, it's the bank's fault that these people had to commit fraud and to live in a million dollar house they're not paying for.

It's a tough job, but someone has to do it.

Not one bank held a gun to anybody's head and forced him/her to take on a mortgage s/he could not afford.

I'm sick of people blaming the System for problems with their personal finances. May be if you bother to learn a little math and compounding interests, and read the fine lines a little more carefully before signing, you would be in a better shape. The One Percent didn't force you to sign in the dotted line.

How many people were FORCED go buy homes they couldn't afford? NONE.

HOw many WILLINGLY bought homes they couldn't afford? More than none.

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