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Saving For a Space Ship

Imf Plotting To Stage “Credit Event” Forcing Greece Near Bankruptcy Using Brexit

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The International Monetary Fund has been caught, red handed, plotting to stage a “credit event” that forces Greece to the edge of bankruptcy, using the pretext of the Brexit referendum...

Article by Paul Mason

https://medium.com/mosquito-ridge/imf-plots-new-credit-event-for-greece-534b4b300318#.xtlkfof07

IMF transcript from Wikileaks

https://wikileaks.org/imf-internal-20160319/transcript/IMF%20Anticipates%20Greek%20Disaster.pdf

It is the transcript of a teleconference between the IMF’s chief negotiator, Poul Thomsen and Delia Velculescu, head of the IMF mission to Greece.

Released by Wikileaks, the discussion took place in Athens just before the IMF walked out of talks aimed at giving Greece the green light for the next stage of its bailout.

The situation is: the IMF does not believe the numbers being used by both Greece and Europe to do the next stage of the deal. It does not want to take part in the bailout. Meanwhile the EU cannot do the deal without the IMF because the German parliament won’t allow it.

As they bicker about the numbers, Thomsen and Velculescu are heard mulling whether to suppress the IMF’s next report on whether Greek debt is sustainable. Thats important because the IMF will only sign up to a deal that involves debt relief, and the Germans will not.

Then Thomsen drops the bombshell:

THOMSEN: What is going to bring it all to a decision point? In the past there has been only one time when the decision has been made and then that was
when they were about to run out of money seriously and to default
. Right?
VELCULESCU: Right!
THOMSEN: And possibly this is what is going to happen again. In that case, it drags on until July, and clearly the Europeans are not going to have any discussions for a month before the Brexits and so, at some stage they will want to take a break and then they want to start again after the European referendum.

Velculescu says they should try and do something in April. Thomsen replies:

THOMSEN: But that is not an
event
. That is not going to cause them to… That discussion can go on for a long time. And they are just leading them down the road… why are they leading them down the road? Because they are not close to the event, whatever it is.
VELCULESCU: I agree that we need an
event
, but I don’t know what that will be.

So let me decode. An “event” is a financial crisis bringing Greece close to default. Just like last year, when the banks closed, millions of people faced economic and psychological catastrophe.

Only this time, the IMF wants to inflict that catastrophe on a nation holding tens of thousands of refugees and tasked with one of the most complex and legally dubious international border policing missions in modern history.

The Greek government is furious: “we are not going to let the IMF play with fire,” a source told me.

But the issue is out of Greek hands. In the end, as Thomsen hints in the transcript, only the European Commission and above all the German government can decide to honour the terms of the deal it did to bail Greece out last July.

The transcript, though received with fury and incredulity in Greece, will drop like a bombshell into the Commission and the ECB. It is they who are holding E300bn+ of Greek debt.

It is the whole of Europe, in other words, that the IMF is conspiring to hit with the shock doctrine....

Edited by Saving For a Space Ship

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I had trouble downloading the transcript. The article itself is confusing, working off of a handful of comments that in themselves do not say anything without heavy interpretation.

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Whats the story on varoufakis?

Was he a plant? The MSM always took too much of a shine to him for my liking. Very strange. A 'renegade' who the globalists like. Something was up.

Richie Allen alludes to this at 27:30. Varoufakis was not to be trusted. He is advising Corbyn now. Which disturbs me further. I suggest it was NOT at Corbyns request.

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The Greek government is furious: “we are not going to let the IMF play with fire,” a source told me.

But the issue is out of Greek hands.

Indeed it seems to be out of their hands so what's the point of being "furious".

It's already been said many times but they had their chance last year and the outcome suggests they blew it - now it doesn't seem to matter much what their government thinks.

However now events (rather than negotiations) are needed to disguise the fact that sovereignty is lost.

Edited by billybong

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Guest BillyNI

There is no plot here. Your headline is pure bull. Show me the 'plot'.

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Whats the story on varoufakis?

Was he a plant? The MSM always took too much of a shine to him for my liking. Very strange. A 'renegade' who the globalists like. Something was up.

Richie Allen alludes to this at 27:30. Varoufakis was not to be trusted. He is advising Corbyn now. Which disturbs me further. I suggest it was NOT at Corbyns request.

Well apparently he's a master of game theory and is going to completely outwit the Germans. Check out the Big Fat Greek thread.

Seriously though, he could have been a plant. His strategy which seemed to me to be to tell it like it actually is and refuse to budge didn't seem like a masterstroke of negotiating theory to me, but maybe the plan was for him to move aside all along. I think maybe he's just one of those guys that thinks economics trumps politics.

There was an interview with him on "Hard Talk" which would have been good if the interviewer didn't believe that "Hard Talk" should mean asking difficult questions and refusing to be diverted on the answers, rather than just interrupting what the guy said at every opportunity.

Edit : Actually re-watched the interview, wasn't quite as bad a performance by the interviewer as I thought. Worth a watch.

Edited by Gigantic Purple Slug

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I found the article confusing as well.

However I do agree that even though Greece has been out of the headlines for quite a while (almost scarily quiet in the British media), nothing has been fixed and it has to come to a head sooner or later.

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Indeed it seems to be out of their hands so what's the point of being "furious".

It's already been said many times but they had their chance last year and the outcome suggests they blew it - now it doesn't seem to matter much what their government thinks.

However now events (rather than negotiations) are needed to disguise the fact that sovereignty is lost.

sovereignty as far as the greeks were concerned has always been lost.

the only choice they have is whether they wish to become a protectorate/vassal state of:

1) german driven EU

2)Russia

presently,german driven EU will also consist of turkey, which i think will rankle a bit with the greeks.

I see them opting for 2)..which the EU will not be at all happy about.

Edited by oracle

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sovereignty as far as the greeks were concerned has always been lost.

Quite likely but the events last year pretty much sealed the loss.

So enough from them with the "government furious" already.

Edited by billybong

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Well apparently he's a master of game theory and is going to completely outwit the Germans. Check out the Big Fat Greek thread.

Seriously though, he could have been a plant. His strategy which seemed to me to be to tell it like it actually is and refuse to budge didn't seem like a masterstroke of negotiating theory to me, but maybe the plan was for him to move aside all along. I think maybe he's just one of those guys that thinks economics trumps politics.

There was an interview with him on "Hard Talk" which would have been good if the interviewer didn't believe that "Hard Talk" should mean asking difficult questions and refusing to be diverted on the answers, rather than just interrupting what the guy said at every opportunity.

Edit : Actually re-watched the interview, wasn't quite as bad a performance by the interviewer as I thought. Worth a watch.

Ey man, glad you've-watched it. Simon Sakur ain't perfect but he is a G. One of the most trusted interviewers internationally.

The Varoufakis "Plant" angle is far fetched IMO: Listen to him explaining his stances in The Long Read Guardian and his blog throughout the crisis. Never a plant as he so spectacularly fell out with his PM to the point where the Troika essentially wouldn't talk until he went. When the deal went through he hated it and still does.

Edited by Tapori

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I am really confused by this. My interpretation of transcript is that potential default event would force Germany to agree with IMF terms more favourable to Greece sooner rather than drag it out.

But that seems like a good thing? What am I missing?

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I am really confused by this. My interpretation of transcript is that potential default event would force Germany to agree with IMF terms more favourable to Greece sooner rather than drag it out.

But that seems like a good thing? What am I missing?

Germany no like big time as germany would be taking the biggest hit is my guess (the biggest hit bit)

Would agree it`s a good thing,but then you have the possibility that Spain and Portugal might think we will have a bit of that another concern for the Germans ? ...Greece must been seen to being made an example of to keep the others inline is my take on the whole schrade

Edited by long time lurking

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Germany no like big time as germany would be taking the biggest hit is my guess (the biggest hit bit)

Would agree it`s a good thing,but then you have the possibility that Spain and Portugal might think we will have a bit of that another concern for the Germans ? ...Greece must been seen to being made an example of to keep the others inline is my take on the whole schrade

It's just the first post in this thread and links from it appear to suggest it's IMF suggestion is a definite negative thing for Greece. But appears to be the opposite of how I interpret the transcript. Hopefully it will become clear eventually. I'll have to watch both BBC and RT and pick an opinion that makes at least some sense.

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It's just the first post in this thread and links from it appear to suggest it's IMF suggestion is a definite negative thing for Greece. But appears to be the opposite of how I interpret the transcript. Hopefully it will become clear eventually. I'll have to watch both BBC and RT and pick an opinion that makes at least some sense.

I know what you mean the truth is somewhere in the middle

Another take on it here http://www.nytimes.c...iness&smtyp=cur seems like the IMF thinks debt relief is the best option in this version

Edited by long time lurking

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It's amazing that less than a year after the "negotiations" the bailout has become an issue again. Although the Greek bailout referendum resulted in a No vote (for the then bailout terms) the Greek government continued negotiations and (from memory and some google/bing research) subsequently reached an agreement that was supposed to last about 3 years. It did appear then that a solution had been arrived at that would last a considerable time (even if the underlying problems hadn't been resolved) - but now apparently not. Back to square one.

It's as well to remember in the Brexit referendum that all is not what it seems when events to do with the eu are reported and promised (for example consider Cameron's "negotiations"). From the continuation and re-emergence of the Greek saga It confirms that the whole thing is a total unreliable hotch potch.

Edited by billybong

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I know what you mean the truth is some in the middle

Another take on it here http://www.nytimes.c...iness&smtyp=cur seems like the IMF thinks debt relief is the best option in this version

IMF have been on the hook for 6 years for something they regasrd as an internal EU issue.

They wasn't out. They want to force an excit for the Greek situation - write stuff down or bankrupt Greece. Your choice.

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It seems that only the IMF are being honest, Greece needs to default.

The EU don't want German bondholders to have a haircut.

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IMF have been on the hook for 6 years for something they regasrd as an internal EU issue.

They wasn't out. They want to force an excit for the Greek situation - write stuff down or bankrupt Greece. Your choice.

That was Mr Strauss Khan`s line at the beginning (better for them to default and start a fresh) just before he had his diplomatic immunity removed by the USA just hours before he allegedly raped the chamber maid ...unfortunate timing to say the least

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