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Brexit Referendum Poll - In Or Out?


warpig
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Here's a question. If the vote is narrow, as in the Scottish referendum will we get further restrictions on Europe.

Surely it's hard to say that people in the UK support the EU if 45% vote to leave?

So you would assume, but past experience suggests the Eurocrats simply don't give a damn what the plebs think.

Which is precisely why the EU is getting restive.

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It's to do with this comment and the single quote I posted above doesn't do the concern justice - "These changes mean that Members States may find their interests overruled by other Member State more frequently than they had before."

As I said, it took a while to pull all the information together and I agreed in the end, it is a concern.

So you don't think your earlier comment is true? Implying in the future we cannot leave without permission.

Posted Today, 10:21 AM

As I understand it, the laws change March 2017 and getting out of the EU will require the support of the majority of EU members.

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Boris Johnson last week conceded a vote to Leave 'might' cost jobs and at his latest campaign event today the Prime Minister will say 'nothing is more important than protecting people's financial security'.

That sounds very like Boris is setting them up for Dave to hit them.

There's just as good a case for arguing that staying in the eu will cost some people jobs/job quality especially if the external eu borders are opened up without control and especially amongst those British people having to compete with more cheap labour.

Edited by billybong
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Not according to Cameron today. The "economy" trumps democracy and self-determination, says the PM of a (nominally) parliamentary democracy:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3485478/David-Cameron-blasts-Boris-claiming-job-losses-price-worth-paying-Brexit-warning-important-people-s-financial-security.html

That's just the sheer financial greed of the "1%" Dave.

You can see why Dave's "deal" with the eu was such a feeble one.

Dave would sell Britain down the river for a fistful of fiat.

Edited by billybong
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I think that`s a good enough reason alone to justify leaving

I`m for out but it would be a different story if i could see change on the horizon ,as it stand now there`s not even a chance of that happening for the reasons you state above

I think the EU as it`s stands is doomed to fail at some point if there is no change ,i would be all for a united states of europe in the same way the USA works ,fully democratic political and fiscal union but there is no chance on earth this will happen sa it`s a union of have`s and have not`s with the have`s making the rules,then trampling over the smaller states purely to further their vested interests

I see this opinion a lot. The EU is a mess. We need change - after all how could it possibly be worse?

Most people who I hear uttering that are boomers who have lived through 70 years of peace throughout most of Europe. Sadly most of their parents are no longer around to explain exactly how it could be worse.

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This argument about doing it to protect us from banksters is absolutely laughable. It's sovereignty that does the protecting, the very sovereignty people want to give up to be protected. You're not going to get security or liberty doing that...

Of course it is... which is why our govt spunks all our money on pumping up property prices to keep our banks solvent - and leaves the EU to fund our world leading Science research programs. If we quit the EU we can kiss all that goodbye - according to all the scientists at least.

Still at least once we are out of the EU our govt will be able to action our wish to no longer be protected by the Human Rights act and, if we can't afford a visa to holiday on the continent, we can get back to paddling around in sewage on our shitty beaches that will no longer need to meet European standards.

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I'm amazed that 7 people are going to vote to stay IN the EU. My fears have been realised! Why are you being submissive to Fräulein Merkel?

As far as I'm concerned voting OUT on June 23rd is about self determination, not about a financial outcome. I'll vote OUT whatever the cost.

I am curious... Why are you happy for someone who wasn't born in Britain, who's first language isn't English and most importantly, for someone who wasn't elected by the British public, to determine British law and values?

Well, there's another vote for in.... and i don't give a flying fig about "Fräulein Merkel".

If you think the the EU is the biggest restriction on your self-determination, you're deluded. Sort our own country out first.

I am curious, why do you think being born in Britain, and speaking English, is a pre-requisite to determining GOOD laws?

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I could write an essay on why you're so wide of the mark, but I'll just point out your most significant formal fallacies for now - The EU Commission wasn't elected by the public, let alone the British public, which means they're a non democratic government and can't be voted out of their position. They overthrew/blackmailed the non-subservient Italian and Greek democratically elected leaders and yet you think it's propaganda. Are you mad? The Euro Zone is collapsing. Has that escaped your observational prowess?

I've lived all over the world and there isn't a country I'd rather live in than Britain, but I want it for British people and British values.

So, you've lived all over the world but the UK, a UK in the EU, is better than all others..... and you want to change that country? Sorry, does not compute....

Edited by AThirdWay
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It's not my self determination, it's Britain's self determination and the reason we can't determine what's best for Britain, is because EU laws prevent us from taking stock of our own country. We CAN'T sort out our own country whilst we're a member of the EU, that's the point!

One size does not fit all. Do you dress your dad or tell him what he can eat and say based on all other dads or is it better to let him decide these things for himself? Decisions are ALWAYS more appropriate the more local the decision. I have no idea why you'd even ask the question...

Well, there's another vote for in.... and i don't give a flying fig about "Fräulein Merkel".

If you think the the EU is the biggest restriction on your self-determination, you're deluded. Sort our own country out first.

I am curious, why do you think being born in Britain, and speaking English, is a pre-requisite to determining GOOD laws?

Edited by warpig
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Your question hardly grades as English. I live in the UK, but I have lived around the world and yes I would like the British to be fully in charge of Britain. Does that compute?

So, you've lived all over the world but the UK, a UK in the EU, is better than all others..... and you want to change that country? Sorry, does not compute....

Edited by warpig
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It's not my self determination, it's Britain's self determination and the reason we can't determine what's best for Britain, is because EU laws prevent us from taking stock of our own country.

Do you really believe that? You really think that without meddling from those unelected bureaucrats in Brussels, our elected leaders would implement better laws that would enhance the lives of everyone here? Or do think they would do exactly what they are doing right now - lining their pockets and the pockets of their chums and screw the consequences to the proud British folk who voted them in?

My suspicion is that it will be business as usual - apart from them having to find something else to get the prols all worked up about and ensure that the pitchfork wielding mobs don't turn up at their doors.

Edited by repetitive bleats
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I see this opinion a lot. The EU is a mess. We need change - after all how could it possibly be worse?

Most people who I hear uttering that are boomers who have lived through 70 years of peace throughout most of Europe. Sadly most of their parents are no longer around to explain exactly how it could be worse.

I`m a long way off boomer ,and all i see, is it getting worse from where i`m sitting i see the EU circling the plug hole,i think the boomers know what their parents went through to preserve our sovereignty,and are now witnessing it being stole back piece by piece by the very same people their parents fought against in two wars

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It's not my self determination, it's Britain's self determination and the reason we can't determine what's best for Britain, is because EU laws prevent us from taking stock of our own country. We CAN'T sort out our own country whilst we're a member of the EU, that's the point!

One size does not fit all. Do you dress your dad or tell him what he can eat and say based on all other dads or is it better to let him decide these things for himself? Decisions are ALWAYS more appropriate the more local the decision. I have no idea why you'd even ask the question...

Well... I suppose I could put a bow around the jam jar we keep his ashes in.....

We do not determine how our country is run, nor have we ever. Do you think we WANT house prices at 5-6x average earnings? Do you think we WANT our savings/pensions stolen from us by QE and ZIRP? Sort our own country out first mate!

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Sorry I don't follow. What have I said that made you think I might have changed my mind?

I wasn't sure what you meant by "As I said, it took a while to pull all the information together and I agreed in the end, it is a concern."

Re the rule change March 2017, is your position 1 or 2?

1. It means a member state like us cannot leave unless the other states agree to let us.

2. You are just concerned that negotiations about anything will be harder for us

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Your question hardly grades as English. I live in the UK, but I have lived around the world and yes I would like the British to be fully in charge of Britain. Does that compute?

Apologies. It appears my grammar was so atrociously bad that you were unable to address my point. Let me put it another way....

Out of all the countries you have lived in across the globe, you have came to the conclusion that the UK is the best (I assume your living in Scotland then?).

You now want to risk the BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD, in your opinion, by exposing it to massive political upheaval. That is nonsensical.

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All the same but the ones in westminster are democratically elected they are voted in and they can be voted out it`s not perfect but it`s a million miles better than European commissioners version of democracy

I don't remember voting for Michelle Mone to determine the direction of our 'democracy'.....

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In short YES. Leaving the EU is not a panacea, but it's a critical first step to righting all the wrongs.

Do you really believe that? You really think that without meddling from those unelected bureaucrats in Brussels, our elected leaders would implement better laws that would enhance the lives of everyone here? Or do think they would do exactly what they are doing right now - lining their pockets and the pockets of their chums and screw the consequences to the proud British folk who voted them in?

My suspicion is that it will be business as usual - apart from them having to find something else to get the prols all worked up about and ensure that the pitchfork wielding mobs don't turn up at their doors.

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We can't sort the country out whilst we're in the EU. Why do you keep saying that?

Well... I suppose I could put a bow around the jam jar we keep his ashes in.....

We do not determine how our country is run, nor have we ever. Do you think we WANT house prices at 5-6x average earnings? Do you think we WANT our savings/pensions stolen from us by QE and ZIRP? Sort our own country out first mate!

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Well... I suppose I could put a bow around the jam jar we keep his ashes in.....

We do not determine how our country is run, nor have we ever. Do you think we WANT house prices at 5-6x average earnings? Do you think we WANT our savings/pensions stolen from us by QE and ZIRP? Sort our own country out first mate!

Ah i see so that's all going to change if we stay in the EU ? i know it`s not going to change if we leave

BTW ECB just lowered interest rates to 0% and increased QE from £60 bil to £80 bil per month

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