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justthisbloke

I've Just Been Smart-Metered

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which means I now have a slightly low res and retro device telling me that I'm using 1p per minute of 'leccy and 0p of gas.

Despite being a bit clunky, it does provide a decent range of data and some graphs - but it's a shame I can't plug it into a computer and really go to town with Excel (well, LibreOffice Calc).

<tinfoil hat> Presumably, all this info is being beamed to nPower HQ so they can tell the rozzers when I've powered up my cannabis farm / WMD manufacturing line / bitcoin mining rig. </tinfoil hat>

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Bad luck. Smart meters are another pointless new nosey piece of crap that have no good reason for existing. The existing ones do everything necessary for the purposes of electricity billing and that's all that's required. There's no point at all in telling me how much I'm using, if I didn't need to be using it then I wouldn't be. The electricity company has no need for anything like real-time knowledge of individual customers either (whatever load-relevent information they do need is probably more useful aggregated, which presumably they could just measure from the substation).

I believe they work on mobile phone networks (it had better be one-way only...), so it wouldn't work if they stuck one in my house anyway. Thank heavens.

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Just so everyone knows, electric/gas smart meters are 100% NOT compulsory and they can't make you have one. You are perfectly within your rights to refuse all requests for one to be installed.

I've already notified my provider.

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Meter fraud does still take place, so presumably the ability of these meters to be remotely monitored is desirable on the part of the suppliers. As ever the innovation benefits them more than the consumer as its hardly difficult to monitor your electric/gas consumption with a standard meter.

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It would make sense if prices changed due to loading - so you could schedule your high current activities (laundry) for slack periods thus saving you money and helping to level the grid load. People could dry their laundry when solar and wind are pumping out electrons on sunny windy days[1].

Under that scenario, though the important data flow would be that of spot / forward prices *to me* based on their knowledge of load centrally.

I suppose smart meters save the cost of reading the things - but I doubt it's cheaper.

[1] Sort of a joke - 'cos under those conditions you'd hang it on the line anyway!

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Agree with Riedquat - I already know to switch stuff off when I'm not using it, thanks. I was offered a smart meter, but they wanted me to take time off work for it to be fitted. Since they wouldn't come out at a time convenient to me, I politely declined their kind offer.

Apparently the whole roll-out is going to cost £11 Billion - what with that and all our lovely green energy taxes I doubt anyone'll be able to afford to use enough 'leccy to meter anyway...

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I suspect the data is sold on anonymously too. Smart metering allows better resolution on the particular streets of enery usage. E.g. a village which has old large homes, but are mostly empty a second homes, businesses that want to sell "stuff" to these occupiers don't know if people are living there. This new smart meter data illuminates this darkness as a meter reading is sent each day. See the next post.

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Solar, home insulators, etc may want to focus targeting their advertising on geographical areas that use the most energy. Energy providers sell data on to these types of businesses.

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Agree with Riedquat - I already know to switch stuff off when I'm not using it, thanks. I was offered a smart meter, but they wanted me to take time off work for it to be fitted. Since they wouldn't come out at a time convenient to me, I politely declined their kind offer.

Apparently the whole roll-out is going to cost £11 Billion - what with that and all our lovely green energy taxes I doubt anyone'll be able to afford to use enough 'leccy to meter anyway...

What's wrong with my old meter? :unsure:

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What's wrong with my old meter? :unsure:

Depends which old meter of yours we're talking about Pinny.

That 20K per Volt input impedance can be a bit of a drag if it's your Avo model 8 that we're on about...

;)

avo8.jpg

XYY

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Depends which old meter of yours we're talking about Pinny.

That 20K per Volt input impedance can be a bit of a drag if it's your Avo model 8 that we're on about...

;)

XYY

I have dreams about those! I want one!

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I have dreams about those! I want one!

There is still one in regular use at my previous employer's premises as there's still no better meter for seeing the "kick" of a capacitor charging or discharging than a needle-meter - especially when you have the leads the wrong way round. When that happens, the needle goes off-the-scale in the backwards direction, and the over-current trip pops.

When you hear that click, and see the spring-loaded push-button jump up, you know you were dealing with a highly-charged cap, and the Avo possibly just saved you from potential injury...!

Ah, the joys of working on three-phase inverters and motor-drives. Working on stuff like that also teaches you the dodgy art of "floating your 'scope" too - a most satisfyingly dangerous practice ..!

;)

XYY

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An Avo Meter is an object of beauty. I feel an EBay search coming on! I have a Maplin multimeter, but tt is all digital! But does proper RMS for AC.

I also have a Post Office Detector No.4.

http://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/showthread.php?t=71948

Avos are items of beauty - and each of the cosmetic facelifts they got over the years fitted their times perfectly.

That detector number 4 got my juices flowing a bit - so old-school that it comes with assorted shunts and multipliers...! I used them in physics at school and also when doing my C&G 224, but every meter that I've used in the real world had them built in via a big selector-switch. Can I come to yours some day and touch your number four...? ;)

Nice to see a link to UK Vintage Radio too - I lurk there rather a lot... :)

XYY

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Avos are items of beauty - and each of the cosmetic facelifts they got over the years fitted their times perfectly.

That detector number 4 got my juices flowing a bit - so old-school that it comes with assorted shunts and multipliers...! I used them in physics at school and also when doing my C&G 224, but every meter that I've used in the real world had them built in via a big selector-switch. Can I come to yours some day and touch your number four...? ;)

Nice to see a link to UK Vintage Radio too - I lurk there rather a lot... :)

XYY

I am your man for vintage electronics! I was using Detector No.4 on my C&G Telecoms course as an apprentice! Er, a long time ago!

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I have an AVO 8 too! And you can't have it!

Come near it and I will use my Wee Megger!

Have you got a proper megger in a wooden box, with a winding handle? -_-

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Ah, the joys of working on three-phase inverters and motor-drives. Working on stuff like that also teaches you the dodgy art of "floating your 'scope" too - a most satisfyingly dangerous practice ..!

;)

XYY

So you have 'slipped the surly bonds of earth'. Not advisable without rubber soles!

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So you have 'slipped the surly bonds of earth'. Not advisable without rubber soles!

I have indeed - wearing nowt but a pair of Jesus sandles...!

They did buy us a battery-powered 'scope for site work - but back in the workshop we all fitted a switch to the mains plug of our 'scopes that got rid of that tiresome green and yellow connection...!

;)

XYY

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I'd quite like one.

Bad luck. Smart meters are another pointless new nosey piece of crap that have no good reason for existing.

Disagree. The main advantage to consumers that I can see is that you get away from stupid 'estimated' bills and meter readings. For instance, in the place I live at the moment, when I set up my account with the utility company 'computer said no' and insisted we pay £90 a month for the number of people in our house. We used nowhere near that and built up £300 credit in short order, currently paying £10 a month. I'd rather be billed at the end of the month for exactly what I've used.

Don't see the issue with them knowing information in real time about what is being used. What can they do with that info? Could be useful for the national grid to more accurately estimate demand too (don't know if that sort of sharing arrangement is in place?).

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I'd quite like one.

Disagree. The main advantage to consumers that I can see is that you get away from stupid 'estimated' bills and meter readings. For instance, in the place I live at the moment, when I set up my account with the utility company 'computer said no' and insisted we pay £90 a month for the number of people in our house. We used nowhere near that and built up £300 credit in short order, currently paying £10 a month. I'd rather be billed at the end of the month for exactly what I've used.

Don't see the issue with them knowing information in real time about what is being used. What can they do with that info? Could be useful for the national grid to more accurately estimate demand too (don't know if that sort of sharing arrangement is in place?).

What could they do with that info? I could work out precisely when you are in, and find how you live your life - and then clean out your house. Are you absolutely certain these companies will keep the data secure and the paths that deliver it secure....I'm not sure at all.

As to knowledge about demand - they know that when you start pulling the power. Faster than the meter can transmit the data and have it analysed at the far end.

This rollout is completely wasteful, will be hacked to bits in 10 years and is likely to need complete replacement alarmingly regularly.

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Don't see the issue with them knowing information in real time about what is being used. What can they do with that info?

It'll enable dynamic pricing. Not to the consumer's advantage, needless to say.

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Surely if the estimates are too high, you take a meter reading and submit it to get a new bill! Not that difficult.

Smart Meters another pointless expense on the back of being green. These are not for the benefit of customers. Data collection (abuse); prying; remote disconnections.. dynamic pricing (higher bills).

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