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m0nk3ee

Scottish Bill On Land Reform

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Good to see this in the main stream media.

I have to admit to swearing at some of the people on there who thought that they were doing us a favour by owning vast swathes of land.

Another argument seemed to be that it was the end of democracy if there rights to own their property and keep it for their own use were infringed upon in any way. I think they simply wanted to keep that which they had not earned and use it for speculation, but didn't have the guts to say so in public.

One of the most interesting aspects was that they seemed to be talking about forcing them to sell the land to the community if the landowner blocked economic developments. They gave an example in Fife of the community buying a stretch of the shoreline to ensure that it was used as the community wanted. They had decided to leave it as it was for now so that they could enjoy the wildlife. That area had had a lot of houses build recently and so in that case it probably isn't a bad thing.

Another argument I picked up on was that many of the sporting estates claimed that the land could not be used for anything else. This seems a totally spurious argument to me. With good development (housing, services and industry) I am sure that the population could survive further north than the Lothian's.

There was also a comment about a desire to allow individuals to purchase as little as 1/3 of an acre and allow them to build on it. I assume the 'build' would be a house but unfortunately it didn't link it into reduced planning regulation discussion.

Scotland is absolutely moving in the right direction as far as I am concerned and the quicker other the Tucktards in Westminster realise it the better.

Edited by doahh

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The land was stolen centuries ago by whoever had the biggest stick. And mostly been passed down from there. While most start with nothing, a privileged class has ensured their offspring enjoy the same lordly positions as those long-ago murderers and thieves. Nothing to do with individual effort or need or the merit of the use they want to put it to - they 'own' land just because they were born lucky.

Land reform is a prerequisite for a fair society. The country should belong to all of us, and who your parents were should have no bearing on your access to land. And we shouldn't allow modern-day oligarchs to set themselves up in the place of the old feudal lords, either.

Either no-one should be born with a silver spoon in their mouth, or everyone should. I'd tear down a million years of history if it ensured that the next generation starts life more fairly than the preceding ones ever did.

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The land was stolen centuries ago by whoever had the biggest stick. And mostly been passed down from there. While most start with nothing, a privileged class has ensured their offspring enjoy the same lordly positions as those long-ago murderers and thieves. Nothing to do with individual effort or need or the merit of the use they want to put it to - they 'own' land just because they were born lucky.

Land reform is a prerequisite for a fair society. The country should belong to all of us, and who your parents were should have no bearing on your access to land. And we shouldn't allow modern-day oligarchs to set themselves up in the place of the old feudal lords, either.

Either no-one should be born with a silver spoon in their mouth, or everyone should. I'd tear down a million years of history if it ensured that the next generation starts life more fairly than the preceding ones ever did.

who decides who gets which bit?

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What decides. Economic efficiency, via a user fee for exclusive rights to non-produced land and natural resources.

tell me more about how that works - are the rights auctioned off? How often are the rights to any particular piece of land available? If I have a piece, what condition do I get it in and what condition must I leave it in at the end of the term?

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tell me more about how that works - are the rights auctioned off? How often are the rights to any particular piece of land available? If I have a piece, what condition do I get it in and what condition must I leave it in at the end of the term?

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I watched it and it does set out one view of LVT nice and clearly, but it didn't answer my questions

Setting the rental value - if not by auction, then by who / what?

How often does any particular piece of land become available? / How often is its rental value assessed?

If I have a piece, what condition do I get it in and what condition must I leave it in at the end of the term?

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I watched it and it does set out one view of LVT nice and clearly, but it didn't answer my questions

Setting the rental value - if not by auction, then by who / what? Any market value mechanism ideally adjusted to site premium as outlined (derived e.g. from rental prices, sales prices, adapted council tax data, sizes, even self valuations while retaining an option to purchase at that valuation etc).

How often does any particular piece of land become available?

/ How often is its rental value assessed? Annually

If I have a piece, what condition do I get it in and what condition must I leave it in at the end of the term?

The other questions don't relate to anything said as far as I can tell.

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what mechanism is there for removing an incumbent and what mechanism is there for protecting a tenancy?

if a land renter has a year before she might be moved on (by the rent being put up too much), how does that enable her to undertake some valuable service that requires considerable investment (like a power station for instance), or more than a year to come to fruition (an orchard for instance)?

what happens if someone is prepared to pay double the market rent for a particular piece of land? is that extra money turned away by the community?

is the land open to bids from international land renters?

is land used for mining (for instance) rented at a different rate depending on where the mined resources go (i.e. domestic use or international use)?

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My opinion. Others will disagree.

what mechanism is there for removing an incumbent and what mechanism is there for protecting a tenancy?

Probably the same or similar mechanisms as exist now in both cases.

if a land renter has a year before she might be moved on (by the rent being put up too much), how does that enable her to undertake some valuable service that requires considerable investment (like a power station for instance), or more than a year to come to fruition (an orchard for instance)?

If net economic contribution is founded as -ve via rent-seeking it's best for someone else to make more efficient use of the land. Neither power stations nor orchards tend to be sited in areas of great residential or commerical value so they're probably not good examples. In the case of more applicable ventures none would be advised to establish today or tomorrow on a zero cash, business loan or contingency basis, but as priorities were directed away from property speculation and into productive enterprise I expect real businesses would benefit from greater focus on business investment - be that agriculture or industry.

what happens if someone is prepared to pay double the market rent for a particular piece of land? is that extra money turned away by the community?

If someone is prepared to pay twice the market price that's the market price. If necessary the system could be entirely cemented as pro wealth creation rather than wealth extractive, with land prices of zero. A potential buyer would be wise to consider such a possibility if playing games. Ownership and property rights are still intact, but their beneficiaries compensate for exclusive use of them rather than the other way round like now. If you're working up to suggesting LVT wouldn't be a solution to rich/poor and all social inequities you're correct. But instead of agglomeration being entirely capitalised into land this would be used as public revenue for greater wider community benefit.

is the land open to bids from international land renters?

Choices on trade flows are above my pay grade but as is international and domestic owners would have a LVT liability. I guess whether society decided to continue appraising property investment as just-exports in national accounts terms, or whether it decided to skew that in any particular direction might be up for debate. I doubt it would be necessary because capital and investment choices are always relative.

is land used for mining (for instance) rented at a different rate depending on where the mined resources go (i.e. domestic use or international use)?

Any non-produced value in the land is definitionally a value factor. Any genuine competitive concerns are unlikely to be founded in economic viability terms unless the only rationale for the enterprise's existence was extracting others' input.

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