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pipllman

9 Irrefutable Reasons Why Property Is Still A Viable Investment

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I am not sure who she is trying to convince. Maybe herself.

Headlines here, details in the link below

1. Rents are predicted to continue to rise.

2. Continued rise in urban renting population

3. More babies being born than houses been built

4. More new Buy-to-Let mortgage products and an increasingly competitive market place

5. Property still the preferred choice for pensions

6. People are living longer

7. Interest rate rises will remain well below previous "normal" levels

8. Lack of coherent housing policy by successive Governments

9. Buy to sell, property trading, and holiday lets are not affected by the tax changes

http://www.propertytribes.com/irrefutable-reasons-why-property-still-viable-investment-landlord-t-127621548.html

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I am not sure who she is trying to convince. Maybe herself.

Headlines here, details in the link below

1. Rents are predicted to continue to rise.

2. Continued rise in urban renting population

3. More babies being born than houses been built

4. More new Buy-to-Let mortgage products and an increasingly competitive market place

5. Property still the preferred choice for pensions

6. People are living longer

7. Interest rate rises will remain well below previous "normal" levels

8. Lack of coherent housing policy by successive Governments

9. Buy to sell, property trading, and holiday lets are not affected by the tax changes

http://www.propertytribes.com/irrefutable-reasons-why-property-still-viable-investment-landlord-t-127621548.html

I guess the only difference to 2008 is the # 7. The base rate may as well remain very low, but it's because we iz fecked and cant be made much lower than now, in stark contrast to 7 years ago.

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I am loving Fergus' views on it

"Residential Property is the only game in town!"

Particularly around his view of fair taxation

"The Exit strategy for PSL needs to be a 10% tax as is Entrepreneurial Relief, and not standard rates of 18% or 28% and as with Farming if it is passed to a Family Member (or trust) then there is neither GCT nor is there Entrepreneurial Relief to be paid as long as the house is to remain rented out for say ten years!

If you sell after 7 years you pay the remaining three years at 1% making 3% total."

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Got to like #3. Even if you're in the "build more" camp surely a "1 house per person" policy will give a rather significant oversupply, got to wonder about someone who can't spot that.

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Actually, I can't argue with this comment apart from the very significant strike-through'd bit (from propertytribes):-

A significant proportion of renters do not want to buy a property and they choose to rent, not because they can't get a mortgage or properties prices are so high, but because they feel it's a better and more flexible option to the commitment of taking on a mortgage. No repair bills, no concerns over property prices or interest rates, the ability to live in a City apartment this year and a cottage by the sea next year, flexibility to work anywhere and move on at almost a moment's notice. Renting has become a lifestyle choice for a significant proportion of our tenants. It suits their lifestyle and their investments are elsewhere.

That describes me, but I WOULD buy if prices were at least 50% lower (i.e. I will never buy in the UK).

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8. Lack of coherent housing policy by successive Governments

Successive Governments have failed to address the U.K.'s housing crisis and the current Conservative Government is not addressing the issue with any coherent policy.

If anything, their recent landlord tax changes will cause some landlords to exit the sector, reducing the rental stock in the PRS and potentially increasing rents!

There has not been a coherent social house building plan for years and this has created a huge back log of housing demand that could take decades to address and resolve.

They would spin this as landlords providing a service. It's really an admission that they profit from sucking the blood out of a sick animal.

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I am not sure who she is trying to convince. Maybe herself.

Headlines here, details in the link below

1. Rents are predicted to continue to rise.

2. Continued rise in urban renting population

3. More babies being born than houses been built

4. More new Buy-to-Let mortgage products and an increasingly competitive market place

5. Property still the preferred choice for pensions

6. People are living longer

7. Interest rate rises will remain well below previous "normal" levels

8. Lack of coherent housing policy by successive Governments

9. Buy to sell, property trading, and holiday lets are not affected by the tax changes

http://www.propertytribes.com/irrefutable-reasons-why-property-still-viable-investment-landlord-t-127621548.html

Do these tools know what irrefutable even means, lets go through the points

1 - Since when is a prediction irrefutable evidence (of any other than a prediction having been made)

2 - Once again this isn't guaranteed

3 - Yes but those babies don't need houses quite yet, so the government still has time to get ass in gear

4 - Basel III

5 - Bet the number of people with a private or work pension outnumbers BTL LLs

6 - Yes but for how long will the trend go on

7 - Once again a prediction

8 - True but if they panic about home ownership who knows what they'll do

9 - Do they mean flipping?

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1. Rents are predicted to continue to rise.

Rents are controlled by wages and housing benefit. Housing benefits are being targeted by the government, and wages aren't really rising if you take away all the daft bonuses that go into determining the "average" salary. Why are rents predicted to rise? Does this translate to "we hope we can make tenants pay more, without voiding properties?"

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Do these tools know what irrefutable even means, lets go through the points

1 - Since when is a prediction irrefutable evidence (of any other than a prediction having been made)

2 - Once again this isn't guaranteed

3 - Yes but those babies don't need houses quite yet, so the government still has time to get ass in gear

4 - Basel III

5 - Bet the number of people with a private or work pension outnumbers BTL LLs

6 - Yes but for how long will the trend go on

7 - Once again a prediction

8 - True but if they panic about home ownership who knows what they'll do

9 - Do they mean flipping?

6 is about the most reasonable argument for me too. Not only are some people living quite a long time and accumulating eye watering balance sheet wealth (often assisted by public sector retirement Ponzi schemes), but the Government is assisting them to pass it on tax free to the next generation. We might see quite a few property portfolios held within rich families in the future, even if it is just the family house the kids inherit.

Edited by crashmonitor

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I am not sure who she is trying to convince. Maybe herself.

Yes - seems like post-hoc rationalisation to me...

I think her irrefutable reasons seem fine, until they're not. At which point property won't still be a valid investment. The point of 'until they're not' is not well defined, and could be relatively soon (although I'd guess at least 12 months before anything actually happens). But when it does actually happen (whatever 'it' is) it will be too late to do anything about it.

[and #3 is stupid unless you also state that 'people who currently live in houses are continuing to die', but the births outnumber the deaths by a bit]

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#11. Robbie Fowler (ex-footballer) now runs a property consultancy , with a published book and a DVD - says you can't fail to score with properdee. Irrefutable.

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Actually, I can't argue with this comment apart from the very significant strike-through'd bit (from propertytribes):-

That describes me, but I WOULD buy if prices were at least 50% lower (i.e. I will never buy in the UK).

Thats just a hand-wringing rationalisation based upon no facts I can recall ever seeing.

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Thats just a hand-wringing rationalisation based upon no facts I can recall ever seeing.

I was just agreeing with a comment - basically I'm happy not to buy - happy because prices are just so stupidly, ridiculously, bizarrely way beyond anything I consider anything near reasonable value for money. It's not even a dilemma for me. I prefer the freedom and liquidity of renting (in uncertain times). Others may disagree and think "if you can buy, you should buy, no matter what you think of value".

Edited by canbuywontbuy

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I was just agreeing with a comment - basically I'm happy not to buy - happy because prices are just so stupidly, ridiculously, bizarrely way beyond anything I consider anything near reasonable value for money. It's not even a dilemma for me. I prefer the freedom and liquidity of renting (in uncertain times). Others may disagree and think "if you can buy, you should buy, no matter what you think of value".

Sorry, the comment you quoted, not yours.

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Interestingly regarding point 1 it is those that can best afford rents who can command a lower rate as landlords rationalise the risk. So with housing benefit a target these forecasts really don't count for much.

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This fleeting landlord seems to have packed it in...

Bought this place at auction (untenanted) october last year for £78k

http://auctioneertemplates.eigroup.co.uk/LotDetails.aspx?LotID=757067&a=95&c=top

Shoved a tenant in, and a couple of months later decided to auction it off with a guide of £90k

Didnt sell at 90k, so guide reduced to £80k. Didnt sell again, now back on at £75k.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-35984019.html

Surprised actually. While its in a horrible position in a horrible town, at the moment, just like during 2006/7 even horrible houses in horrible places did catch the tail end of the bubble so long as they were within 25 miles or so of Cambridge. Its a horrible commute to Cambridge, but thanks to the rigidity of the Cambridge greenbelt and dire housing stock in cambridge rented out to rich students via chinese investors, people buy these places.

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I'd rather eat my own kidneys than live in Chatteris (apologies to Chatteris). It's one of those, you know, Fennish places. I sort of like the Fens - but the settlements are grim.

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I'd rather eat my own kidneys than live in Chatteris (apologies to Chatteris). It's one of those, you know, Fennish places. I sort of like the Fens - but the settlements are grim.

Even Tesco's had second thoughts.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-31365003

Even the Eastern Europeans seem to head for March or Wisbech and give Chatteris a miss, so it must be bad :lol:

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The thing I find strange is she says more babies being born than houses. when the average couple have 1.8 children below replacement rate. however for every two babies born we have one immigrant coming into the country.

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Under 2 or maybe she could have made it 10 it's surprising she didn't mention net migration at about 300,000 a year all of which need accommodation immediately.

She could have said that despite promises government has failed to control it and she could have predicted they'll continue to fail to control it - in support of her argument (accepted that it's the level of credit that mainly determines house prices but she doesn't mention that directly either of course).

It's just a surprise net migration wasn't mentioned at all in the context of population (and you never know but the government might keep its promise this time round).

Edited by billybong

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The thing I find strange is she says more babies being born than houses. when the average couple have 1.8 children below replacement rate. however for every two babies born we have one immigrant coming into the country.

For the time being, even with below replacement level births, i think the birth rate exceeds the death rate...till the boomers start poping their clogs en masse at least. Different in Germany where there wasnt much of a baby boom.

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For the time being, even with below replacement level births, i think the birth rate exceeds the death rate...till the boomers start poping their clogs en masse at least. Different in Germany where there wasnt much of a baby boom.

I think there are two reasons for the low deaths in this country. one people are living longer two people are moving to Spain to die.

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Lets add some more realistic facts that support the argument to the list

#10 They dont print land anymore

#11 House prices double every 2 years

#12 George Osborne has got our back.

What's that - Its all bullsh*t? Then I guess landlords are f*cked.

This list is about the need to attract more fools so they can get out of the sinking ship. 9/9 for effort there.

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