Assume The Opposite Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 My interpretation of the bail in legislation (2013) puts depositors under £85k at the top of the list and are 'protected'. The BoE I believe has discretion and could change the boundaries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 £85,000 is jack all against house prices around here. Let the house prices take it for once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bendy Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 90% of my house is still full of beans and noodles from the last bunker creation days of 2007/8! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evetsm Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Your right it's not. He also said this in the article: "He pointed out that a saver was covered only up to £85,000 per bank under the Financial Services Compensation Scheme which is effectively unfunded and that the Government has said it will not rescue banks in future, hence his suggestion that some money should be held in physical cash" its always funded as long as they don't run out of ink, paper, presses and computer keystrokes. This is the absolute faceplant aspect of this system, you can never have a systemic default. Sure, the currency will go to hell, but never fear they threaten you with violence and incarceration if you don't use the currency. This will end like France 1789. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Are stocks and shares safe? They can't appropriate shares in a company can they (unless it is a bank, as I suppose they would go for shareholders first)? The way I see it is that nothing is really safe. At the end of the day a desperate government could change laws, appropriate anything, from cash in a bank account to a percentage of your property. The only things that I think are going to be safe or which people will pile into are things outside the system. Gold isn't safe since a government can make it illegal to hold gold and confiscate it, the same with cash. Anything solid can be appropriated fairly easily. These are its strengths and weaknesses. This is why I think bitcoin or some form of digital currency will have its day. Anything that can bypass the system has a value. Bitcoin may just be virtual money but its value is in bypassing government and the laws. It probably won't be Bitcoin as there are still some flaws and it can still be tracked but some sort of virtual currency such as Bytecoin may do the job. I don`t think anything internet based can "bypass the system", you bypass the system when you talk to people face to face, use cash or gold, barter etc.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
council dweller Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 "bottle of water £1000....." Oh yes. But not quite yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 its always funded as long as they don't run out of ink, paper, presses and computer keystrokes. This is the absolute faceplant aspect of this system, you can never have a systemic default. Sure, the currency will go to hell, but never fear they threaten you with violence and incarceration if you don't use the currency. This will end like France 1789. It's not, but has been force-ably done this time. Helped by a new-age modern-guy politically-correct "think-of-the-victims" nonsense-thinking on one side, and extreme coarse HPI entitlement that knows every penny of houses bought ages ago and 'now worth £3.5million' on the other. Why day after day I only see HPI. http://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=49425628&sale=47856128&country=england US banking system has $Trillions in reserves for savers.. (imo) liquidity may be an issue in other markets. If and when the time comes for a market turn.. when banks are more in the clear (?) and risks spread out to wider market? To understand the danger of deflation you need to pose the right question. It is not whether governments have the power to print money. It is: "When do the benefits of printing money exceed the costs?" If political authorities could benefit only from printing/expanding debt, and not be harmed, they would obviously print more money in higher denominations than they do. Expansion/stimulus defeated demand for low-leverage money. Following the stock market crash in 1929, currency grew by 16 percent annually until 1933. This was a contributing factor to the shrinkage of the overall money supply. Deflation happened in spite of the fact that the Fed, by the account its chief economist, "embarked on a policy of easy money which it pursued through the depression." The Fed kept the monetary base expanding at a 4 percent annual rate from 1929 through 1933, yet the overall money supply collapsed, partly because of strong demand for no-leverage money. A common feature of economic slumps is credit revulsion. When the music stops the attitude of lenders hardens. Banks slash credit and call loans even to good customers. They are driven to do this, in part, because of growing demands to hold cash. When the public raises its demands for currency, the banks have no choice but to shrink. Each time commercial banks obtain currency refills for their customers, they must reduce their reserve accounts with the central bank. If customers suddenly prefer low-leverage money - cash - the banks are obliged by the logic of leverage to reduce their lending. A dollar in the banking system can be leveraged 10:1. A dollar in a mattress is not leveraged at all. When deflation lowers interest rates, the loss of real income by holding cash may not be significant compared to the risk of losing your capital due to default or banks or other institutions. When.. [....] almost an invisible 0.515 percent.. those who chose to hold cash were not throwing away high-interest income. Watch the growth of currency as a crucial sign the economy is headed for a deflationary contraction. Northshore looked into non-leverage money/cash today (people taking cash out - imo). Difficult for me to tell whether any reaction yet. Guess it depends where you think the ELB is, One chart from a few. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Just to say I'm not sat on cash-out-of-the-system (other than small amount in £ and $). After bubble-on-bubble, my savings in the financial system (including savings accounts/ISA), in trust banks can better handle a HPC now, with a shock bonfire-of-the-boomers/btlers (wealth) to come. Although the appetite for it is lacking on all sides at the moment, it seems to me. So maybe another 10 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 I did this around 2008. I didn't trust the banks - still don't. But not any more. it's not worth the hassle. Their excuse at the time for making withdrawing cash difficult was 'money laundering regulations'. And the government has shown that it will step in to save any bank no matter the rights and wrongs. Far easier to continue stealing my money with inflation. The irony is that due to the housing crisis I don't actually have a home of my own to put a safe in or secure with locks. Any cash under the mattress is at the mercy of my housemates and any of their guests. I've had one housemate rifle through my laptop before, and I'm fairly sure they also stole from me. The police couldn't do anything, of course. Gold is too expensive, too difficult to sell, and you can't eat it, so it's of no use as a hedge against total collapse. Stockpiling food only works if you have a shed or a cellar. So I guess I'm betting everything on the system surviving. Saying that, if I lose my house deposit due to bank or government action I will be spending my last days protesting as loud as I can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Bottle of water. That will be £1,000 please. Banker lend me a few grand to see me through the next week. My debts pay the wages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 The thing with money, property and gold.....anybody does and they can and will steal it.....anything is owned only until it is no longer owned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justthisbloke Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Mrs JTB thinks my self sufficient garden, my woodburner, my food stash, etc are a hedge against the apocalypse. The truth is that it's my shares and bonds that are the hedge against an unlikely event - continued financial "normality". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
council dweller Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Yeah, things look pretty normal to me especially as I remember the 26% inflation in the 70`s, 0% inflation (roughly) in japan (from 1989 to 2004 when I left) Okay I`m only watching Aldi prices which are the same as 2 years ago. ....and I never buy bottled water, there are artesian wells that supply the village from the surrounding chalk hills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 Yeah, things look pretty normal to me especially as I remember the 26% inflation in the 70`s, 0% inflation (roughly) in japan (from 1989 to 2004 when I left) Okay I`m only watching Aldi prices which are the same as 2 years ago. ....and I never buy bottled water, there are artesian wells that supply the village from the surrounding chalk hills. Love the way they are selling aldi and lidl as discounters putting them in the same category as pound shops, promoting them as inferior when they are not......no they are not discounters they are selling foods at the right price, the rest are over charging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
council dweller Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Well? Is it time to put an extra fiver under your mattress? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverfinger Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I did this around 2008. I didn't trust the banks - still don't. I started to convert everything into gold and silver bullion end of 2006. The crisis started 2007, still going on. Never looked back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erat_forte Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 (edited) There are people alive today who will remember the days when a gold sovereign was the £1 coin. "bottle of water £1000....." Oh yes. But not quite yet. Edited June 29, 2015 by erat_forte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 They wanted me to spend my little bit of cash on buying a whole heap of debt.......they said it would make me feel richer....I declined their very kindly offer....keep the debt for yourself, might need it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCountOfNowhere Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 They wanted me to spend my little bit of cash on buying a whole heap of debt.......they said it would make me feel richer....I declined their very kindly offer....keep the debt for yourself, might need it. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCountOfNowhere Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 How do boomers sell £1 million pound terraces in Walthamstow if non-homeowners with savings have their savings appropriated via hyperinflation? And somehow I don't think even the government could entice these same savers into getting out huge amounts of debt credit to buy a house when it means 90% of their earnings are going to pay the mortgage just to keep this whole edifice in place and the boomers in their no-effort, winning position. Simple answer. They don't. It's all just a big scam to bail out the banks. When the idiot buyers have dried up, IMHO, the bankers will collapse the prices. The banks need to lend. The own the houses and those tasty 40% deposits...I mean, come on, are [people really that stupid they cant see this coming. N.B. The idiot buyers have dried up..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noallegiance Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 N.B. The idiot buyers have dried up..... Not round here they haven't! I am not conversant with that many people on this planet. I know three who have bought in the last 3 months. Two in the last 3 weeks. In my tiny world that's quite the percentage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Not round here they haven't! I am not conversant with that many people on this planet. I know three who have bought in the last 3 months. Two in the last 3 weeks. In my tiny world that's quite the percentage. Why should you worry.....let them buy anything at any price, no skin off your nose......soon enough they will get to find out the true value of value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noallegiance Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Why should you worry.....let them buy anything at any price, no skin off your nose......soon enough they will get to find out the true value of value. Hey I'm not worried. Just Catchphrasin' it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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