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fru-gal

Could The Benefit Cap Be Reduced To £20K?

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Just seen this here; https://speye.wordpress.com/2015/06/15/dear-social-housing-pack-up-go-home-youre-history/

And quotes from the BBC discussion he is referring to;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-32931604?ns_mchannel=social&ns_source=twitter&ns_campaign=bbc_live&ns_linkname=%5bParliamentary%20reform%2611:39%5d&ns_fee=0#post_557e95554400004400dab457(scroll down to 13:00)

Comment by Allegra Stratton of the BBC;

We have reported on Newsnight that £5bn of cuts to tax credits are in the mix. One source now tells me the pot of money in the firing line might be £8bn and affect both child tax credits and working tax credits. There is also a growing view that one way to address the debate about EU migrants coming to Britain and getting in work benefits... Is just to limit in work benefits. That way there would be no discrimination against non-Brits because the Brits would be restricted too.

Another idea being looked at is to take the benefit cap down from the £23,000 it is headed for right now, to below £20,000. If you could get £15bn out of welfare, then you would be softening the impact of cuts on other government departments.

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http://blog.cix.co.uk/gmorgan/2013/09/15/the-impact-of-a-20000-benefit-cap/

Interesting that this is what people on this forum have been saying for a while;

We have reported on Newsnight that £5bn of cuts to tax credits are in the mix. One source now tells me the pot of money in the firing line might be £8bn and affect both child tax credits and working tax credits. There is also a growing view that one way to address the debate about EU migrants coming to Britain and getting in work benefits... Is just to limit in work benefits. That way there would be no discrimination against non-Brits because the Brits would be restricted too.
Edited by fru-gal

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'Another idea being looked at is to take the benefit cap down from the £23,000 it is headed for right now, to below £20,000. If you could get £15bn out of welfare, then you would be softening the impact of cuts on other government departments.'

Hmm What Would Gidion Do?

Cut more public sector workers, who are unionised and strike.

Or ...

Make some 16h dosser who did not bother to vote, and will not get another chance, which they probably will not take anyhow, for 5 years, work an extra 15 hours a week?

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20k in benefits still seems a lot to be able to claim for someone who works who 37.5hrs a week and does not get get paid that.

budget could be very interesting this year. as the poster says it could be one of true effective ways to stop mass uncontrolled immigration from eastern euorpe

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I wouldn't be surprised if they removed wtc from the benefit cap current exemption.

Not sure how this will affect the necessary low end jobs?

Having said that, they do have some kind key worker housing in HA flats IIRC.

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20k in benefits still seems a lot to be able to claim for someone who works who 37.5hrs a week and does not get get paid that.

That's presumably after tax, in which case 20k is a ******load of money to take home for doing nothing. If i could get that for being a layabout, I'd effectively have been working for less than minimum wage in my last job in the UK.

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That's presumably after tax, in which case 20k is a ******load of money to take home for doing nothing. If i could get that for being a layabout, I'd effectively have been working for less than minimum wage in my last job in the UK.

I don't think they're talking about shovelling £20k into someone's bank account for doing nothing, more likely they mean that benefits will be stopped when their earnings reach £20k. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

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That's presumably after tax, in which case 20k is a ******load of money to take home for doing nothing. If i could get that for being a layabout, I'd effectively have been working for less than minimum wage in my last job in the UK.

And there are no transport costs etc. Although you would spend more on heating unless you spent all day in the library or are very resistant to the cold.

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And there are no transport costs etc. Although you would spend more on heating unless you spent all day in the library or are very resistant to the cold.

Or sat in Wetherspoons.

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I don't think they're talking about shovelling £20k into someone's bank account for doing nothing, more likely they mean that benefits will be stopped when their earnings reach £20k. Correct me if I'm wrong though

Yep you are wrong and at this moment in time the cap is £26k the cap covers the total amount of benefits any one claimant can receive

Working tax credits at this point in time is not covered by the cap the same as any claimant who is in receipt of a disability allowances

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The 23k figure is somewhat unrepresentative as it is basically taken from a recipient of housing benefit living somewhere in inner London where average rents are sky-high or £1500+ per month. Once again we see London used as the "typical" case where it's politically expedient. I'm sure trougher MPs who have large BTL portfolios don't care though, since they can rent their properties to bright-eyed bushy-tailed foreigners wanna-be spivs working in the City for silly money. This is more about financially ethnically cleansing London of the unemployed and redistributing them to the provinces, freeing up the rentals for up and coming City types.

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I'm all in favour of reductions purely for justices' sake , but I hope they make it more CI like, so you get less but you don't get held to the fire to get it, as you are.

IMO all rigid means testing does is reward professional scroungers at the expensive of the genuine. not to mention creating benefit traps.

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The benefit cap means nothing unless they include tax credits and people working.Its very easy to avoid.Most of the big claims also have a child down on disability/PIP/DLA for behaviour usually.

Seems like they really do want to make as much of the £12 billion as possible from tax credits though.We will have to see if they dare to go through with it and face down the massive backlash.

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The benefit cap means nothing unless they include tax credits and people working.Its very easy to avoid.Most of the big claims also have a child down on disability/PIP/DLA for behaviour usually.

Seems like they really do want to make as much of the £12 billion as possible from tax credits though.We will have to see if they dare to go through with it and face down the massive backlash.

What massive backlash? People voted Tory and they knew the Tories were going to massively slash welfare, they said it before the election. Besides, they have 5 years to undo any damage so better get all the crap stuff over and done with at the beginning of their term.

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I wouldn't be surprised if they removed wtc from the benefit cap current exemption.

I have seen this mentioned here before. I don't know if you are aware but if you get tax credits and housing/council tax benefit together then you pretty much lose what you are getting in tax credits out of your HB/ctb. Yes, you might end up keeping a few pencecin the pound.

When I was on both of these at the same time I realised I was jumping through hoops with the local authority to get HB and ctb and constantly getting the benefits stopped and having malicious investigations started. So I simply stopped claiming HB and ctb and kept more CTC and WTC. So I think you'll find that because of this tax credits are in the benefit cap already by default. Please correct me if I am drastically wrong.

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The added bonus was I gained about four extra weeks a year where I could concentrate on running and building the business instead of arguing with local authority over genuine business expenses.

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I have seen this mentioned here before. I don't know if you are aware but if you get tax credits and housing/council tax benefit together then you pretty much lose what you are getting in tax credits out of your HB/ctb. Yes, you might end up keeping a few pencecin the pound.

When I was on both of these at the same time I realised I was jumping through hoops with the local authority to get HB and ctb and constantly getting the benefits stopped and having malicious investigations started. So I simply stopped claiming HB and ctb and kept more CTC and WTC. So I think you'll find that because of this tax credits are in the benefit cap already by default. Please correct me if I am drastically wrong.

I don't understand. The current benefit cap is £26k so you can get a combination of housing benefit, tax credits, child benefit etc up to £26k. If you are getting wtc, then the cap does not apply so you would get your income from work + any benefits you are entitled to.

Not sure why your council were giving you a either or choice. Sounds like someone was dobbing you in as you can be entitled to CTC/WTC and housing benefit/CTB, none of these are mutually exclusive. Either that or your council doesn't know what the ****** they are doing.

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What massive backlash? People voted Tory and they knew the Tories were going to massively slash welfare, they said it before the election. Besides, they have 5 years to undo any damage so better get all the crap stuff over and done with at the beginning of their term.

The massive backlash is that many people - utterly wrongly - think that Tax Credits are neither "benefits" nor "welfare". These people thought they were voting in favour of cutting other people's benefits but never their own massive amounts that they rake in. Because they are "in work" (but only doing 16 hours with a massive load of Tax Credits taking their income high above others who work a full 40hr week with no Tax Credits) they think they aren't "on benefits".

The backlash will be when the general population learn that they are, in fact, "on benefits" and they have, in fact, voted to reduce their own income and they will, in fact, have to work to increase their income. They won't like reality.

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20k in benefits still seems a lot to be able to claim for someone who works who 37.5hrs a week and does not get get paid that.

budget could be very interesting this year. as the poster says it could be one of true effective ways to stop mass uncontrolled immigration from eastern euorpe

Correct !

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