Bloo Loo Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Problem is she can change her mind at any time after that, so should you keep stopping and asking if it's ok? auto "ask for consent" feature...great idea for windows 10. whose voice should we use?...Sean Bean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turned Out Nice Again Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 is rape a major problem in the UK in 2015? who says so? who's to say what proportion of failed prosecutions (including those that don't even get to court) are false accusations? why are sex differences, not least the submissive sexual nature of the majority of women, not taken into consideration when men are accused of exploiting them? who's exploiting who? why are women always denied agency and excused accountability as adults? what happened to innocent until proven guilty and Blackstone's formulation? why are the 4 well-established circumstances under which women are likely to make false accusations never discussed? http://www.inside-man.co.uk/2014/07/28/why-do-women-make-false-rape-allegations/ ... from the comments to the above: 'NAME REDACTED January 8, 2015 at 12:28 pm - Reply A false rape allegation has such a devestating impact and one that will always haunt me. I seperated from my wife due to her adultery. She had a relationship for a number of years and when I complained my wife complained that I raped her on the day I walked out of the house 8mths previously. My ex cried rape before, when I found out my child wasn’t mine 8 yrs after child was born, claiming the father raped her and child may not be mine. She didn’t pursue that complaint with Police. She later withdrew complaint against me. Problem was because Im a Police Officer, I was placed on restricted duties and investigated for a year which was embarrassing and devestating. I presented evidence to show that it could never have happened and handed over phones showing hundreds of txts showing that ex didn’t want marriage to end and how much she loved me and that I was never an abusive or violent husband. It come back from PPS insufficient evidence to prosecute and wouldn’t pursue action against ex . As it stands legally the case is unproven and for me as the victim I’m left feeling abused, cheated, violated and there is nothing that can be done to completely clear my name. [Comment edited for legal reasons]' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Generation Game Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 I actually sense a ******ing huge business idea..... An anti-rape alarm (with fitted clock) that must be fired by the woman every 10 seconds during sexual liaison, so that both parties (and neighbours / passers-by) are aware of consent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Generation Game Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Clickbait. The article has nothing to do with the headline. What the 'new' guidelines actually say is that a woman who is too intoxicated or frightened to say no is incapable of giving consent. They always say that you should pick up women in places like libraries rather than bars. Not only are they less likely to be intoxicated but being in a library suggests a higher level of cognitive reasoning. This should stand you in good stead when it comes to consent (although if the man has to prove consent then it becomes moot). Still doesn't get over the point of fear and coercion though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 is rape a major problem in the UK in 2015? who says so? It is for victims snip why are sex differences, not least the submissive sexual nature of the majority of women, not taken into consideration when men are accused of exploiting them? who's exploiting who? Exploitation has nothing to do with crime why are women always denied agency and excused accountability as adults?They arent what happened to innocent until proven guilty and Blackstone's formulation?nothing, unless you are a celeb or dead why are the 4 well-established circumstances under which women are likely to make false accusations never discussed? they are being discussed here by some of us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 It may be 'just' changing the guidance - but its going to result telling many women they have been raped - even if the women in question doesn't think they have (see Ched Evans case) And then even if she still doesn't think she has been raped - they may decide to go ahead with the charge anyway. Its 'increasing rape convictions' by the back door - pardon the pun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 It may be 'just' changing the guidance - but its going to result telling many women they have been raped - even if the women in question doesn't think they have (see Ched Evans case) And then even if she still doesn't think she has been raped - they may decide to go ahead with the charge anyway. Its 'increasing rape convictions' by the back door - pardon the pun. nah, its just telling Police forces to ask the question...it is intended to avoid a court case where the guy has a defence right from the off. I still wouldnt use it until court though...what the prosecution doesnt know, they cant prepare for. As for if she doesnt think shes been raped, well, that is extremely rare where the woman was conscious...in date rape though, she may not know who, where, when or how often. and it applies to men too ccc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Its 'nudging' - pure and simple. They are being asked to ask the question and the details will be passed onto the CPS. If they then deem fit ? Its wham - bloke taken from his work canteen on charge of rape. It shouldn't work that way. Can you imagine someone being dragged from their work under a charge if assault - when you can't even remember anyone hitting you and didn't even mention it to the police or anyone else ? Sorry - you are a good poster and make a lot of sense - however on this subject I think you are sticking up for things that down deep you know are wrong. This whole desperation to jail men for rape and lower the level of 'proof' required (today all it takes in certain cases is "I can't remember after all) Is ******ing totally completely totally beyond doubt ******ed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 But yes I see you do agree that this should not be used until court - so fair enough for that anyway !! ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitevanman Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 It may be 'just' changing the guidance - but its going to result telling many women they have been raped - even if the women in question doesn't think they have (see Ched Evans case) And then even if she still doesn't think she has been raped - they may decide to go ahead with the charge anyway. Its 'increasing rape convictions' by the back door - pardon the pun. The oft quoted figure of 1 in 4 women being raped in their lifetime is arrived at in a similar way. Women's studies researchers ask women about their sexual history to determine whether or not they've been raped. It turns out if a women doesn't remember consenting then she's been raped. If women are asked the direct question 'have you ever been raped?' The figure is very much lower. Still, apparently we live in a rape culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHF Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 How do I get out of it? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/sex/11321513/Sex-advice-I-regret-a-one-night-stand.-How-do-I-move-on.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 But yes I see you do agree that this should not be used until court - so fair enough for that anyway !! ^^ Ive asked before, but you havent answered, when should a man be questioned in a rape accusation case? Never by the sound of it. Or are posters saying a quiet word and a gentlemanly nod in the right place is the right procedure to investigate a rape?...which, if you were the PM or some other important figure is the exact accusation levelled against investigators of people suspected of being in a high level peadophile ring, The level of proof is the same. simply asking the question changes nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 How do I get out of it? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/sex/11321513/Sex-advice-I-regret-a-one-night-stand.-How-do-I-move-on.html she cant...however, the entitlement cultured lady might think that reality can be changed somehow. If she decides to make a claim for rape, its horrible for the innocent man, but the guidance says he should be asked how he came to think he had consent, which seems to be a fair question to ask. I wouldnt answer any questions without my lawyer present. With or without guidance, the circumstances will decide on a word v word case. And if the woman is found to have made a malicious allegation, such is the stigma attached to the charge, whether innocent or not, she should face a similar sentence that the man would have suffered. The wimmins lobby will obviously say this is unfair...I say, grow up and accept some people are just evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oracle Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Its 'increasing rape convictions' by the back door - pardon the pun. does..."well she did it up the @rse as well" work as defence? i guess dna test or whatever would confirm that the complainant is a bit kinky to say the least?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 does..."well she did it up the @rse as well" work as defence? it might well do...seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinAndPlatonic Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 "Bit of a theme going at the moment.." http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?/topic/203004-50-of-female-inmates-should-not-be-in-prison/ Seems women can do no wrong..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecrashingisles Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 This thread is not complete without this song: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPin Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Having decriminalised male homosexuality, the UK now seems well on its way to criminalising male heterosexuality. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11375667/Men-must-prove-a-woman-said-Yes-under-tough-new-rape-rules.html How does this make sense in a country where the most popular book amongst female readers is a thousand-page rape fantasy? I'm more a a tiny yellow "post-it! note "rape fantasy" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 Does a swab from a wet minge prior to intercourse count instead of a consent form? I am quite sure both would be equally of putting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkins Posted January 29, 2015 Share Posted January 29, 2015 To all the posters who think the odds are stacked against men in rape accusations: what do you think the proportion of rape claims resulting in a conviction is? 60%? 80%? http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/100000-assaults-1000-rapists-sentenced-shockingly-low-conviction-rates-revealed-8446058.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Generation Game Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Does a swab from a wet minge prior to intercourse count instead of a consent form? I am quite sure both would be equally of putting. Doubtful, as supposedly that happens as a way to prevent damage (so could quite easily happen pre-rape). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Ive asked before, but you havent answered, when should a man be questioned in a rape accusation case? Never by the sound of it. Or are posters saying a quiet word and a gentlemanly nod in the right place is the right procedure to investigate a rape?...which, if you were the PM or some other important figure is the exact accusation levelled against investigators of people suspected of being in a high level peadophile ring, The level of proof is the same. simply asking the question changes nothing. A man should be questioned if a women claims it and there is reasonable evidence to back up the claim. Pretty simple really. The same would apply for any other 'personal' crime. (Obviously if the crime had not been reported by the women in question but the police had witnessed it- yes as well). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 To all the posters who think the odds are stacked against men in rape accusations: what do you think the proportion of rape claims resulting in a conviction is? 60%? 80%? http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/100000-assaults-1000-rapists-sentenced-shockingly-low-conviction-rates-revealed-8446058.html Considering this crime is usually one persons word against another's - for something that happened behind closed doors - that has no real evidence as to its credibility ? I am franlky surprised the stats ate quite so high as 10% or whatever figure that is oft quoted. And that's not to say lots of men don't get away with it. However that's not the point. Its about a conviction - and in the vast majority of cases - a conviction should be nigh on impossible to achieve. Unless we just want to start picking and choosing how we find different crimes 'proven' or not.... Oh well - too late for that. Already happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkins Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Considering this crime is usually one persons word against another's - for something that happened behind closed doors - that has no real evidence as to its credibility ? I am franlky surprised the stats ate quite so high as 10% or whatever figure that is oft quoted. Have you ever served on a jury (for any type of case, not just rape)? Real life is not like CSI. Plenty of cases are decided on one person's word against another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 MP's fears over new guidelines on rape: How do you prove consent was given, he asks A politically correct DPP, rape and the worrying question: how DO men prove consent, asks SARAH VINEThe Mail has two headlines asking the same question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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