TheCountOfNowhere Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 ( Or should be be locked up for fraud. ) Market has peaked and turned. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799937 Just as: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799942 " Thousands set to cash in pension pots next year"Perfect. Crash cancelled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmasterspank Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 6 months is a long time for the market without a fix. I expect bridging measures at autumn statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 ( Or should be be locked up for fraud. ) Market has peaked and turned. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799937 Just as: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799942 "Thousands set to cash in pension pots next year"Perfect. Crash cancelled. Im a bit concerned of a stock market crash as all these Institutions look for cash and sell up portfolios. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmasterspank Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 With an election in 2015! I'd put money on further interference to keep things ticking over until April. He'd probably liked to have moved the pension thing earlier but was constrained by the tax year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiled Canadian Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I was musing as to how many "amateur" landlords there are who are actually having a good time of it. Granted you see lots of message board postings from people bragging about their mega portfolio's but anecdotally how many BTL landlords do you know who think its making them money. I know three people who have a BTL property, of this albeit limited sample, one openly admits its was a mistake and that the property is costing them money and the other two generally comment that they'd like to sell and get their equity back (they all bought c. 2007). All three complain about the hassle and unexpected expenses of voids/boilers etc. If this is the nature of the chat down the golf club etc. then we might not see the stampede into BTL from the 55+ pensioners that we might expect. Also bear in mind that everyone releasing their pension early will receive advice from and adviser who will be keen to turn their new found windfall into some type of investment product yielding a commission or fees. I'm confident that these chaps will pointing out the downsides of BTL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lifes a game Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 The biggest fall is 0.7% against the 18.4% gain. so London still got a yearly gain of 17.7% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Foxtons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I was musing as to how many "amateur" landlords there are who are actually having a good time of it. Granted you see lots of message board postings from people bragging about their mega portfolio's but anecdotally how many BTL landlords do you know who think its making them money. I know three people who have a BTL property, of this albeit limited sample, one openly admits its was a mistake and that the property is costing them money and the other two generally comment that they'd like to sell and get their equity back (they all bought c. 2007). All three complain about the hassle and unexpected expenses of voids/boilers etc. If this is the nature of the chat down the golf club etc. then we might not see the stampede into BTL from the 55+ pensioners that we might expect. Also bear in mind that everyone releasing their pension early will receive advice from and adviser who will be keen to turn their new found windfall into some type of investment product yielding a commission or fees. I'm confident that these chaps will pointing out the downsides of BTL. Unless they get a kickback from the BTL specialist/Lender/Estate agent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starla Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 ( Or should be be locked up for fraud. ) Market has peaked and turned. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799937 Just as: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799942 "Thousands set to cash in pension pots next year"Perfect. Crash cancelled. Once sentiment turns and it's mainstream that people aren starting to lose money on property and it's not always a one way bet, most people won't touch it with a long stick. The last people that will gamble their money on it are pensioners with their pension pots. I don't think anyone could be that stupid, can they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmasterspank Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Once sentiment turns and it's mainstream that people aren starting to lose money on property and it's not always a one way bet, most people won't touch it with a long stick. The last people that will gamble their money on it are pensioners with their pension pots. I don't think anyone could be that stupid, can they? Of course they will! Many of them will look at it as a place to pass on to their children when they die. I know my parents have been talking about it! I've had arguments about the profitability of BTL before, and I reckon you can still eek out a return if your getting +6% RY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ultra Fox Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 ( Or should be be locked up for fraud. ) Market has peaked and turned. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799937 Just as: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799942 "Thousands set to cash in pension pots next year"Perfect. Crash cancelled. ttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799942 That picture makes me feel a bit sick. Not sure why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Of course they will! Many of them will look at it as a place to pass on to their children when they die. I know my parents have been talking about it! I've had arguments about the profitability of BTL before, and I reckon you can still eek out a return if your getting +6% RY. My kids will probably have to make do with the cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmasterspank Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Yeah, and that's another avenue. Give cash family member who will use a deposit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygivenup Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 A pal has six BTL's all bought on IO mortgages all 2006-8 he is self employed so he has to declare them. His point is that in X number of years he will have six houses that will all be worth more than he paid and he will sell some to pay off others and even if the net result is that he only ends up with one, it will be one more than me, which in his eyes means that in his retirement he will have some form of income, which I will not. I have lost count of the number of times that we have shall we say, agreed to disagree because as he points out I can not be sure that the end result will be to his advantage or not. We will only know in about 15-20 years time if he was a astute investor or a t1t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Yeah, and that's another avenue. Give cash family member who will use a deposit. Or a house each, if that's what they want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 A pal has six BTL's all bought on IO mortgages all 2006-8 he is self employed so he has to declare them. His point is that in X number of years he will have six houses that will all be worth more than he paid and he will sell some to pay off others and even if the net result is that he only ends up with one, it will be one more than me, which in his eyes means that in his retirement he will have some form of income, which I will not. I have lost count of the number of times that we have shall we say, agreed to disagree because as he points out I can not be sure that the end result will be to his advantage or not. We will only know in about 15-20 years time if he was a astute investor or a t1t. All BTLs have to declare them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 All BTLs have to declare them. Surely they only have to declare any taxable income? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybernoid Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 all bought on IO mortgages all 2006-8 …. His point is that in X number of years he will have six houses that will all be worth more than he paid Quite an assumption. Presumably the average monthly income is about the same or less than the average combined cost of interest payments, maintenance, letting agent fees etc? All the examples Ive seen are essentially break even more or less, at these emergency interest rate levels. With buy to let, you hope for capital appreciation that more than makes up for the cost of buying/selling, opportunity cost of tied up deposit, cost of your time dealing with agents etc etc etc. Quite the gamble, particularly considering when he bought. Theres plenty of better things to do with six BTL deposits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 One interesting thing that huth does offer viewers - is what a house looks like when its not had much maintenance over 25 years. They are a total mess. Maintenance on 6 btl places over 25 years each ? That's easily 6 figures without even trying. Have you pointed this put to your pal and if so what was his response ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Knimbies who say No Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 (edited) BTL is in the main a play on rising prices while the rent hopefully covers the day to day expenses. Unless you are a slumlord or bought a long time ago the chances are you will not be making a good yield. Hopefully we'll be hearing a bit more about the cost side risks of BTL once the West Brom BS case is resolved one way or another in the coming months. Edited October 28, 2014 by Joan of The Tower Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygivenup Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 All the houses were what I refer to as ex-council houses, he does not use an agent, as far as I am aware very little was required in the way of deposits, he says he has to decorate top to bottom in between lets takes him, his mum and one of the kids a couple of days. I agree that for some BTL wizards the maintenance cost, agent fees, etc will mean that there is very little return, and remember were up north so they didn't cost him half a million each. I agree with the majority of this site, but we are friends so we are not going to fall out over it and as he says we will see in a few years who was right and who was wrong. I would be very surprised if he was doing all this for no return at all I have known him from school and have always considered him a very straight forward honest individual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 (edited) Surely they only have to declare any taxable income? and losses...dont forget the losses. and the expenses...dont want to be paying that interest without claiming your full relief. Edited October 28, 2014 by Bloo Loo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northerner Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 ttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-29799942 That picture makes me feel a bit sick. Not sure why. Now apologise, or there will be more (revealing!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygivenup Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I know its nuts isn't it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Knimbies who say No Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 All the houses were what I refer to as ex-council houses, he does not use an agent, as far as I am aware very little was required in the way of deposits, he says he has to decorate top to bottom in between lets takes him, his mum and one of the kids a couple of days. I agree that for some BTL wizards the maintenance cost, agent fees, etc will mean that there is very little return, and remember were up north so they didn't cost him half a million each. I agree with the majority of this site, but we are friends so we are not going to fall out over it and as he says we will see in a few years who was right and who was wrong. I would be very surprised if he was doing all this for no return at all I have known him from school and have always considered him a very straight forward honest individual. I forgot the other essential for making BTL fly- valuing your own time at zero. What's the average tenancy duration, 2 years? To be simplistic, 75 such tenancies between 6 flats over 25 years, that's 450 days of redecorating in total, 1.75 working years approximately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.