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Gigantic Purple Slug

Old Skool Football

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Reading the BBCs piece on football grounds, I clicked on the Derby Man City link.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29706200

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdFwl11WUAg&feature=youtu.be&t=1m7s

What a fantastic pitch that was.

And up came the link to Derby Leeds. Hunter may have got a good punch in, but Lee owned him in the rematch (4:30).

Has the soul gone out of football ?

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I liked "old football" where everyone wore enormous shorts, in monochrome, you had a chain-smoking goalie, and all the spectators had flat caps, and ate pies!

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I liked "old football" where everyone wore enormous shorts, in monochrome, you had a chain-smoking goalie, and all the spectators had flat caps, and ate pies!

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Mr Beans, you have a wit! I have never seen that sketch before, but it was exactly what I was thinking.

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Well, less said about that, the better...

I believe I have a little bit of wit, MrBeans. I am "blessed" But not too much that you would notice!

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I believe I have a little bit of wit, MrBeans. I am "blessed" But not too much that you would notice!

You seem to be a good egg Mr P...

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The fact is that people like Greaves and Best could still show stunning skill even on those mud heaps

One wonders how modern 'star' players would cope if they had to turn out on them every week.

The likes of Best or Bobby Moore were typically an exception to the rule, and on the whole, those pitches were responsible for the long ball game, and I wouldn't have wanted to watch that every week. You'd see a passback, keeper pick it up, kick upfield, defender controls it, pass it back to their keeper, lump it, and the cycle would go on. In the early 90s, John Beck at Cambridge would grow the grass long down the wings, so you'd be forced to lump it. You'd also have a proper leather football and leather boots. Heading those balls have apparently contributed to several deaths in players later lives.

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The likes of Best or Bobby Moore were typically an exception to the rule, and on the whole, those pitches were responsible for the long ball game, and I wouldn't have wanted to watch that every week. You'd see a passback, keeper pick it up, kick upfield, defender controls it, pass it back to their keeper, lump it, and the cycle would go on. In the early 90s, John Beck at Cambridge would grow the grass long down the wings, so you'd be forced to lump it. You'd also have a proper leather football and leather boots. Heading those balls have apparently contributed to several deaths in players later lives.

Nah, if you watch the old games there's plenty of dribbling, passing going on even though the pitches were appalling.

Saying that, for Derby the pitch was worth an extra man, sapping the legs of the opposition and making it difficult to weight passes accurately - unless you were used to operating in a sea of sludge.

In one famous incident at the Baseball Ground an opposing player was sucked into a bog just outside the centre circle and had to be pulled free by his team mates.

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Nah, if you watch the old games there's plenty of dribbling, passing going on even though the pitches were appalling.

Saying that, for Derby the pitch was worth an extra man, sapping the legs of the opposition and making it difficult to weight passes accurately - unless you were used to operating in a sea of sludge.

In one famous incident at the Baseball Ground an opposing player was sucked into a bog just outside the centre circle and had to be pulled free by his team mates.

I'm sure that football did break out occasionally. I think I remember reading that Brian Clough actually got the fire brigade in to water the pitch, to make it even more boggy...we didn't didn't even qualify for two world cups in a row, during the 70s. On the whole, the introduction of foreigners has raised the bar of English football...be it with their skill on the pitch, or professionalism off it (do you hear about players now going to the pub before the game, or having a 20 a day habit any more)...

Admittedly it might have been a bit more interesting back then, where it could been its a bit more sterile nowadays.

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Nah, if you watch the old games there's plenty of dribbling, passing going on even though the pitches were appalling.

+1

There were a lot of destroyer type defenders about in the old days such as Ron Harris who would never have had a career in modern football but there were also lots of flair midfield players and class strikers who would still get a game ( George Best - Colin Bell, Stan Bowles, Tony Currie, Charlie George, Alan Hudson, Rodney Marsh, Frank Worthington etc) .

I don't see much shortage of route 1 football in the modern premier league which despite all the foreign players is still largely based about getting the ball forward quickly and springing the offside trap (not difficult if you are up against Wes Brown). If anything the modern game is more frenetic and played at a faster tempo than that of the 1970s.Personally a lot of it simply makes me yawn now.

The fact is English clubs dominated the European Cup in the late 1970s winning every year between 1976 and 1982 something their modern day Premier League counterparts have failed to emulate. They must have been doing something right

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+1

There were a lot of destroyer type defenders about in the old days such as Ron Harris who would never have had a career in modern football but there were also lots of flair midfield players and class strikers who would still get a game ( George Best - Colin Bell, Stan Bowles, Tony Currie, Charlie George, Alan Hudson, Rodney Marsh, Frank Worthington etc) .

I don't see much shortage of route 1 football in the modern premier league which despite all the foreign players is still largely based about getting the ball forward quickly and springing the offside trap (not difficult if you are up against Wes Brown). If anything the modern game is more frenetic and played at a faster tempo than that of the 1970s. Personally a lot of it simply makes me yawn now.

I share your lack of enthusiasm for the modern game. Seems to me like teams seem to cancel each other out.

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I share your lack of enthusiasm for the modern game. Seems to me like teams seem to cancel each other out.

I personally prefer the quality of the modern game vs the old. You could have Wenger, Bergkamp, Henry, Cantona, Fabregas, Hazard, Zola and so on...Interestingly, no English names, but they are responsible for dragging the English game forward..

..its the money that seems to be ruining the modern game, where the fans are milked (so to speak)...the blueprint is the German model, where the fans own the majority of the club, rather than some oil bloke... You could also argue that football has become too accessible..too many games on tele whereas in ye olden days, all you would have is match of the day once a week...

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I personally prefer the quality of the modern game vs the old. You could have Wenger, Bergkamp, Henry, Cantona, Fabregas, Hazard, Zola and so on...Interestingly, no English names, but they are responsible for dragging the English game forward..

..its the money that seems to be ruining the modern game, where the fans are milked (so to speak)...the blueprint is the German model, where the fans own the majority of the club, rather than some oil bloke... You could also argue that football has become too accessible..too many games on tele whereas in ye olden days, all you would have is match of the day once a week...

People like Bergkamp and Zola were the finished article long before they came to the Premier league.

It did not produce them.

I still don't see how importing French, Spanish or Dutch talent has made 'English' football better

Given that only 5 teams have ever won the Premier League in its entire history then most of the games outside the elite group are the equivalent of World Champion boxers being paired with punch drunk fairground stiffs. In its entire 21 year history Premier League teams have only won the top European competition on four occasions which is hardly a sign of dominance. Moreover, there are worrying signs that the very best foreign players are already starting to shun it so English teams are left with a lot late 20s and early 30s second raters coasting from week to week on enormous salaries.

Oh and before anyone comes back and says that other European Leagues are equally uncompetitive I would ask the question how often have English teams won the Europa Cup since 2000, a competition designed to measure the quality of the also rans in European League football ? The answer is only two Liverpool and Chelsea who would really have preferred to have been in the Europeans Champions League. It is a bit of a sad record compared to the dominance of English club football in the UEFA cup the 1970s

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UEFA_Cup_and_Europa_League_finals

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People like Bergkamp and Zola were the finished article long before they came to the Premier league.

It did not produce them.

I still don't see how importing French, Spanish or Dutch talent has made 'English' football better

The football world has moved on from the 60s, 70s and 80s, and as a nation, we haven't..but are starting to..Look at Burnley, who have, more or less have a completely British side, and look where they are in the premier league...

Henry was languishing at Juve...it was English football that made him...much like Cantona was journeying around France, and so on..Bergkamp wasn't really doing anything special at Inter, from what I remember.... Just think if you had a bunch of academy players who had a 1st team player come and show them whats what, and you could either a. learn from Steve Hodge or b. learn from Thierry Henry...who would you choose? Having those foreign players (who are usually more skilled than their British counterparts), raises the game of the players around you..

The big thing during the week, we had the rabona from Erik Lamela during the Tottenham Europa league match...I bet they'll be loads and loads of kids up and down this country trying to copy him..Would a British player try anything like that? Of course not.. Why don't British players play abroad? Because the money is too good here, and they aren't good enough..

Its precisely this influence that will improve our football in this country...there's no surprise that we haven't won the world cup in 50 years (or the Euros).. Why is it that premier league clubs are trying to emulate Barcelona's La Masia academy...Interestingly, St George's Park is now quite envied around the world.

Thankfully we are starting to move on, and in the next ten years, we'll be having the quality that may have a chance of winning the WC..

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The big thing during the week, we had the rabona from Erik Lamela during the Tottenham Europa league match...I bet they'll be loads and loads of kids up and down this country trying to copy him..Would a British player try anything like that? Of course not..

I think it's an insult to British players to say something like that.

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Oh and before anyone comes back and says that other European Leagues are equally uncompetitive I would ask the question how often have English teams won the Europa Cup since 2000, a competition designed to measure the quality of the also rans in European League football ? The answer is only two Liverpool and Chelsea who would really have preferred to have been in the Europeans Champions League. It is a bit of a sad record compared to the dominance of English club football in the UEFA cup the 1970s

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UEFA_Cup_and_Europa_League_finals

The Europa league is a complete waste of time for English clubs, more a burden than anything else. If you win it then the prize is £5 million, each place in the Premier league gets you £1.2 million. It's simply not worth the effort as a long run in the Europa league seriously effects your premier league chances.

Unless you win or come second in the Europa league then a single premier league place is worth more.

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Given that only 5 teams have ever won the Premier League in its entire history then most of the games outside the elite group are the equivalent of World Champion boxers being paired with punch drunk fairground stiffs. In its entire 21 year history Premier League teams have only won the top European competition on four occasions which is hardly a sign of dominance. Moreover, there are worrying signs that the very best foreign players are already starting to shun it so English teams are left with a lot late 20s and early 30s second raters coasting from week to week on enormous salaries.

Oh and before anyone comes back and says that other European Leagues are equally uncompetitive I would ask the question how often have English teams won the Europa Cup since 2000, a competition designed to measure the quality of the also rans in European League football ? The answer is only two Liverpool and Chelsea who would really have preferred to have been in the Europeans Champions League. It is a bit of a sad record compared to the dominance of English club football in the UEFA cup the 1970s

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UEFA_Cup_and_Europa_League_finals

In the twenty years before the premier league, you only had 7 different winners of the football league first division...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_football_champions

As for the Europa league, for some clubs its almost a nuisance, as Gilf pointed out, its much like the league cup...many, if not most, do not play their full strength squad, unless they get to the tail of of it, where they could possibly win the whole thing....There can be a lot of traveling involved...Azerbaijan, or some remote Russian city...not really helpful in a premier league campaign...

Recently you've also had a few "lesser" teams compete (which is of course good)...the likes of Birmingham, Millwall, Hull, Bolton, Ipswich, Fulham, MIddlesbro' etc..so the quality has thinned out a bit more.. Playing the premier league is much more lucrative, and that champions league spot is worth a lot lot more...

As for foreign players, there are two clubs that dominate with the best foreigners - Real and Barca...all other clubs in Europe are a stepping stone. It then comes down to who pays the most, and do you have a chance of winning stuff? ...and at the moment, England does, so you get the better foreigners here...Yes, you do get the journeyman, but you did "in the old days"..even more so than today, as its a results business now, and a manager can easily be sacked only after a few games...

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I liked "old football" where everyone wore enormous shorts, in monochrome, you had a chain-smoking goalie, and all the spectators had flat caps, and ate pies!

Times change ...

YorkshireTerriers_4.jpg

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Just been reading this of Samuel Eto'o

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2808467/Burnley-1-3-Everton-Samuel-Eto-o-scores-twice-Toffees-signs-improvement-Turf-Moor.html


‘I like Samuel when he is in that type of form,’ said Martinez, who saw Romelu Lukaku atone for the mistake that gifted Burnley a goal by scoring Everton’s second.

‘He can play anywhere. He brings real know-how and experience. Sometimes, you want to develop young players.

'But he can give them a lot of aspects technically, tactically and physically. There’s few people who can teach things like Samuel due to his experience.

'Everyone will speak about the goals but I was so pleased with the performance he had, his role off the ball and the way he worked hard for the team.

‘He has set real standards and I’m really pleased. He has played two games in a week, but his performance was a real example. What an incredible professional to have in a dressing room full of young players.’

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Cloughie calling out the BBC for 'lecturing' the viewer.

Legend.

Clough knew that football was first and foremost about entertainment.

Funnily enough, Mouriniho, who is probably the closest we have today to Clough in terms of being able to play the media and stir up controversy seems to me to have a more "win at all costs" strategy than playing entertaining football. Is this a reflection of the modern game ?

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Legend.

Clough knew that football was first and foremost about entertainment.

Funnily enough, Mouriniho, who is probably the closest we have today to Clough in terms of being able to play the media and stir up controversy seems to me to have a more "win at all costs" strategy than playing entertaining football. Is this a reflection of the modern game ?

If football is not as entertaining as it was then why is it more popular than ever?

On top of better pitches fitness and skill levels have also improved. Changes to the backpass, offside, and advantge laws have also made it a much more free-flowing game.

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Times change ...

Crikey! I'll not be buying that strip for my nephew!

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