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Scots Toffs Fear Salmond Mansion Tax

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Scotland has the chance to cleanse itself of these parasites.

Yep, all of the rich, successful or talented may soon be leaving Scotland.

Truely something to marvel at.

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Yep, all of the rich, successful or talented may soon be leaving Scotland.

Truely something to marvel at.

Yes an "elephant polo champion" just oozes wealth creation. What would scotland do without this "talent"? It won't be a "successful" country for sure. Because we know passing down an estate for hundreds of years and doing sweet f***k all has made scotland the marvel of prosperity it is today.....

You know sometimes I wonder how stupid people can be. But then I read some of the posts here and am reassured.

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Very difficult to get a balance here. You wouldn't want to tax so high that the castle was left empty. It's the land which is the important bit. But how much income could you get from the land?

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Very difficult to get a balance here. You wouldn't want to tax so high that the castle was left empty. It's the land which is the important bit. But how much income could you get from the land?

Well, you can start by getting rid of EU subsidies so the feckers actually start farming the land. then we will see how much can be made from the land and tax is accordingly.

Bringing in a good land value tax would not be a overnight one hit process, but a gradual and progressive one. first you pass a law allowing it and then you start by removing one tax at the time and collecting land value tax to replace it.

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Yep, all of the rich, successful or talented may soon be leaving Scotland.

Truely something to marvel at.

I was thinking more about casting off the poisonous aristocracy including the chance of removing the Queen as head of state, Unless of course you believe the Royal Family is the greatest example of meritocracy we have and is something to 'marvel at'?

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Well, you can start by getting rid of EU subsidies so the feckers actually start farming the land. then we will see how much can be made from the land and tax is accordingly.

Bringing in a good land value tax would not be a overnight one hit process, but a gradual and progressive one. first you pass a law allowing it and then you start by removing one tax at the time and collecting land value tax to replace it.

Totally agree. If there were three business men with three business ideas and you had money to invest. The idea is that you invest in the one that will give the greatest return. The same should go for land the person who can utilize the land the best should have it.

It is crazy that you can have two pieces of land next to each other. One is just scrub land doing nothing. The other has a hotel on it. Paying business tax wages which are taxed ect. Both pieces of land should be taxed the same.

But when it comes to the hundreds of acres up in scotland what can the land be used for other than running sheep.

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Yep, all of the rich, successful or talented may soon be leaving Scotland.

Truely something to marvel at.

Wealth is no measure of talent or intelligence. It is often a measure of immorality or psychopathy. The smartest most talent individuals I have met ( including some of the words best and brightest) have zero interest in money and are much more interested in challenges.

Just to prove my point the human being credited with saving more lives than anyone else in history Sir James Black died recently a couple of years ago with no great wealth to speak of.

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Well, you can start by getting rid of EU subsidies so the feckers actually start farming the land. then we will see how much can be made from the land and tax is accordingly.

Bringing in a good land value tax would not be a overnight one hit process, but a gradual and progressive one. first you pass a law allowing it and then you start by removing one tax at the time and collecting land value tax to replace it.

Never, ever, let them have a new tax. Remember Air Passenger Duty? Was a tenner when Broon brought it in I think, now can run a couple hundred quid. Think land value tax won't ever affect you? Just you wait.

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Never, ever, let them have a new tax. Remember Air Passenger Duty? Was a tenner when Broon brought it in I think, now can run a couple hundred quid. Think land value tax won't ever affect you? Just you wait.

It was introduced in 1994 together with other stealth taxes like insurance tax, landfill tax, vat on electricity etc.

Haven't you worked out they're both the same yet?

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Well, quite apt in the discussion on independence and landowners. That land used to be widely lived on until the landowners evicted them all so they could raise more profitable sheep. The people were left destitute living on the margins of the country. Some found an existence as fishermen, others crofters and many, many people were forced to emigrate in order to survive.

Highland clearances. The theft of common land.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highland_Clearances

Isn't that one of the ironies of this independence move - after independence large parts of Scotland will still be owned by a small number of land-owners such as Americans, Arabs and, yes, the English.

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Isn't that one of the ironies of this independence move - after independence large parts of Scotland will still be owned by a small number of land-owners such as Americans, Arabs and, yes, the English.

But if Scotland can write it's own laws this can be resolved. There really does need to be a land tax that makes people think how much land they really need.

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But if Scotland can write it's own laws this can be resolved. There really does need to be a land tax that makes people think how much land they really need.

Scotland will have a chance to show how good goverment can be done. Unfortunately, having deal with a number of scottish pollies in my past, I think the odds of this are 1000000 to 1. Damn shame.

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A common fallacy.

The level of 'talent' or 'intelligence' in a society reflects the structure of society, the opportunities it creates.

But if the opportunities aren't there in the first place my point would stand.

Wealth is no measure of talent or intelligence. It is often a measure of immorality or psychopathy. The smartest most talent individuals I have met ( including some of the words best and brightest) have zero interest in money and are much more interested in challenges.

I never said it was, my statement was rich, (or) successful or talented.

I'd thought you'd be backing the 'Yes' to the hilt, as it'll allow you to rid yourself of those pesky yellows and allow the blues to really show us what they're Madoff.

There's probably something to be said for that but I suspect it'll be a disaster for Scotland and the Ruk will end up with some of the fallout.

...Unless of course you believe the Royal Family is the greatest example of meritocracy we have and is something to 'marvel at'?

President Anthony Charles Lynton Bliar.

'Nuff said.

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What opportunities? I know people really talented smart qualified people working minimum wage in poundland( England and Scotland). The best and brightest who have no real ties here are all gone or leaving the UK altogether, the ones I know who remain its due to personal reasons. What opportunities for kids too? they have an insurmountable task facing them. Every "talented or smart" person I know given a decent chance is fleeing these islands for better opportunities overseas. I cannot see anything changing in this respect too many vested interests protecting there own.

Scotland needs to strike out and do something, this isnt anti english or based on the old differences and stupid tribal shit. The idea of independence is based on people looking to any opportunity to escape a crooked elitist system, many people north know the UK is done for and are prepared to risk it all to at least try.

Scotland if it says yes knows there will be hard times but there is energy and enthusiasm there. England is at the moment in a very negative place and it is scarey for my english friends who have no potential "out".

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True. But if you get structures correct, it is amazing the regeneration that can take place in extremely short periods of time. Witness Japan and Germany after the Second World War, or more recently the incredible rise of China from an impoverished peasant economy.

Yes, IF you get the structures right it is possible to grow very quickly from a low base, depending upon your starting point you might be able to catch up with an advanced economy in maybe 20 years give or take. Although who wants to nuke their economy in the first place.

But my point was that I seriously doubt the Scots will get the structure right, and the Chinese or (east) Germany also show us what happens when you get the structure wrong.

Often taking place with the fact that many of their 'best' people had been killed in war or internal oppression.

I think the point that matters there is whether the "best" were killed at the same rate as everyone else or if there is a selection process that means they die at a much higher rate, obviously it's going to be much harder to recover from a Cambodian type situation than a Germany type one.

If Scotland did go down the toilet then the ones most able to escape would be the "best".

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Isn't that one of the ironies of this independence move - after independence large parts of Scotland will still be owned by a small number of land-owners such as Americans, Arabs and, yes, the English.

..unless he does a Mugabe land grab on top of his Ojukwu oil grab...... :rolleyes:

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Well, this leads neatly to my point.

IF they get the structures right as you say. No doubt there will be a period of adjustment. Just as in the economic cycle itself, resources become reallocated.

But if we're not talking about whether Scotland is viable, or whether it can run itself economically better/worse or the same then THE WHOLE POINT is about self determination. And with that I couple the idea of responsibility. It is YOUR government. It is up to you to engage and change things. London is too distant and a scapegoat as well as being a block on any sort of progress and change that people more locally and wedded to Scotland would want to implement. And I would extrapolate that postion to all regions and countries of the UK.

In the end it could be wrong, but it is THEIR decision. Ask people in any former (failing) British colony and they will typically tell you that despite the problems, they don't want the British back running their country.

...yeah..and remember a lot of these British were Scots....... :rolleyes:

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Well, this leads neatly to my point.

IF they get the structures right as you say. No doubt there will be a period of adjustment. Just as in the economic cycle itself, resources become reallocated.

But if we're not talking about whether Scotland is viable, or whether it can run itself economically better/worse or the same then THE WHOLE POINT is about self determination. And with that I couple the idea of responsibility. It is YOUR government. It is up to you to engage and change things. London is too distant and a scapegoat as well as being a block on any sort of progress and change that people more locally and wedded to Scotland would want to implement. And I would extrapolate that postion to all regions and countries of the UK.

In the end it could be wrong, but it is THEIR decision. Ask people in any former (failing) British colony and they will typically tell you that despite the problems, they don't want the British back running their country.

That's a completely new point, not an extension of any of the previous ones.

Ultimately if self-determination trumps everything then there's nothing to discuss. Even if independence leads to mass starvation that's a price worth paying if it means replacing corrupt westminster politicians with corrupt edinburgh ones.

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