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1929crash

James Foley: Journalism Or Propaganda?

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OK then

Have fun with grief consisting of child abuse rings and beheadings of western journalists or soldiers in the middle of the street in the capital city. To name the most graphic

Nice holocaust reference, took you a while to get it that card out explicitly

The Michael Foley execution video is now believed to be a hoax, and Foley himself is believed to have been working for the spooks and ISIS itself.

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The Michael Foley execution video is now believed to be a hoax, and Foley himself is believed to have been working for the spooks and ISIS itself.

I've no idea if this may be true or not, but your use of the lame passive voice would not even pass as an entry in Wikipedia. What do you believe, 19?

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I've no idea if this may be true or not, but your use of the lame passive voice would not even pass as an entry in Wikipedia. What do you believe, 19?

I didn't pay much attention to this matter until I heard/read that British police had warned that merely watching this video could constitute a terrorist act.

Somebody doesn't want people to look too closely was my first thought.

Then John Ward at the Slog published a piece arguing that it was a fake.

http://hat4uk.wordpress.com/2014/08/21/analysis-the-beheading-of-james-foley-is-a-fake-the-beheading-of-african-bank-accounts-isnt/

And then, lo and behold, the Telegraph, of all publications, came to a similar conclusion.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/journalists/bill-gardner/11054488/Foley-murder-video-may-have-been-staged.html

After that i came across numerous references to Foley's life as a spook, including this, from the Near Eastern Outlook.

http://journal-neo.org/2014/08/26/isis-brutal-beheading-a-windfall-for-rendon-media-group/

So, on the balance of probabilities, and bearing in mind that when one enters the world of the intelligence agncies one is entering "a wildreness of mirrors," I do not think the Foley beheading video is genuine.

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I didn't pay much attention to this matter until I heard/read that British police had warned that merely watching this video could constitute a terrorist act.

When I saw the video the day it was released my first thought was the knife was a little plastic toy thingy and far too small to do the job even if it were real. I didn't watch the actual beheading btw.

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I haven't watched the Foley video but have just taken a quick peek at a few stills of the knife.

If made from a decent steel it would be big enough to do the job. However, it's a piece of cheap, flimsy, stub-tang s**t; clearly made from butter-knife grade steel. It wouldn't take any kind of cutting edge at all. If Foley was beheaded it wasn't with that.

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I haven't watched the Foley video but have just taken a quick pick of a few stills of the knife.

If made from a decent steel it would be big enough to do the job. However, it's a piece of cheap, flimsy, stub-tang s**t; clearly made from butter-knife grade steel. It wouldn't take any kind of cutting edge at all. If Foley was beheaded it wasn't with that.

Well obviously you know a bit more about cutting heads off, than I do! :wacko:

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Rest assured, not people Mr Pin

I don't want your pies any more I have doubts about the contents! :wacko:

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So they did a vid pretending to execute him, and then they really did execute him? What's so weird about that? Maybe they did a dress rehearsal, and when it came to the final cut, they liked the earlier shots better. Maybe they were producing a threatening vid just to demand a ransom, and then for some reason he ended up actually getting executed anyway, so they cobbled together a scare video.

I know plenty of devious things go on, but 99% of the time, it's just the ordinary everyday explanations that are more likely.

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So they did a vid pretending to execute him, and then they really did execute him? What's so weird about that? Maybe they did a dress rehearsal, and when it came to the final cut, they liked the earlier shots better. Maybe they were producing a threatening vid just to demand a ransom, and then for some reason he ended up actually getting executed anyway, so they cobbled together a scare video.

I know plenty of devious things go on, but 99% of the time, it's just the ordinary everyday explanations that are more likely.

You have no place in HPC with that sort of thinking, oh Mr Pig of the Steppes!

Wash your porky mouth out with soap and report at 9:00am tomorrow for re-education!

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You have no place in HPC with that sort of thinking, oh Mr Pig of the Steppes!

Wash your porky mouth out with soap and report at 9:00am tomorrow for re-education!

And YOU! See me after assembly! :blink:

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I've no idea if this may be true or not, but your use of the lame passive voice would not even pass as an entry in Wikipedia. What do you believe, 19?

It's hilarious that he used it as a comeback to my post.

It's all a hoax guys, it's all OK, keep doing nothing and it will all just go away by itself

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So they did a vid pretending to execute him, and then they really did execute him? What's so weird about that? Maybe they did a dress rehearsal, and when it came to the final cut, they liked the earlier shots better. Maybe they were producing a threatening vid just to demand a ransom, and then for some reason he ended up actually getting executed anyway, so they cobbled together a scare video.

I know plenty of devious things go on, but 99% of the time, it's just the ordinary everyday explanations that are more likely.

I don't know if and when Foley was beheaded. I did wade in on this because I have an interest in outdoor pursuits (more so in the past than now) and some of the implements that go with them and do think it a little strange that a supposed, bloodthirsty and hardened jihadi is packing a blunt, comedy knife whose blade would plop out of its handle if he waved it around too much. Not the kind of thing to impress your Chechen comrades who've been slitting throats up and down the length of Eurasia for donkey's years.

The knife though is ooh so shiny and double-edged and so possibly looks well hardcore to the uninitiated watching vids on YT.

Like I said, I haven't watched the video and don't think it's that significant whether it's fake or not. Either way someone has staged a production with the intention of provoking a particular range of reactions. My opinion is if I, or others, react as we're supposed to, the terrorists whoever they are have had their way.

A curious thing, and yes this is my response to some of Marshmellow's posts, the people who claim to be opposed to the objectives of the terrorists often seem bang on board with trying to big up the terrorists and shout at us to be as scared as possible of them. I'm curious to know how this isn't playing into the terrorists' hands?

Maybe the homegrown jihadi threat will develop to a point where it threatens our liberties and values, maybe not. If it does it'd be grim and messy but freedom isn't always free and all that. What's more of a risk in the short term though is chucking those liberties and values away without even so much as a fight because people who claim to be defending those liberties and values are demanding that we must trash them to be safe.

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http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/listeningpost/2014/08/james-foley-journalism-propaganda-201483065818452844.html

James Foley: Journalism or propaganda?
We examine the ethical challenges of reporting the murder of the American journalist by IS.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/journalists/bill-gardner/11054488/Foley-murder-video-may-have-been-staged.html

The video of James Foley’s execution may have been staged, with the actual murder taking place off-camera, it has emerged.

Forensic analysis of the footage of the journalist’s death has suggested that the British jihadist in the film may have been the frontman rather than the killer.

The clip, which apparently depicts Mr Foley’s brutal beheading, has been widely seen as a propaganda coup for Islamic State miltant group.

Fake / Real / Black Op?

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Who knows

One thing is for sure Foley has spent his time hanging round some very hot areas over the past few years including Afghanistan, Libya and Syria.

As has been mentioned elsewhere next to the diplomatic service I would say that journalism and the media is one of the most popular forms of cover for 'spooks' so the idea that he may had another 'intelligence' job on the side is not beyond the realms of possibility

There is a rather strange story in the Daily Mail today claiming that Foleys one time jailer, Abu Ubaida Almaghribi, has been killed by ISIS because he was suspected of working for MI6

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2738805/ISIS-beheads-terror-chief-guarded-U-S-journalist-James-Foley-s-prison-accusing-spying-M6.html

It does make you wonder what has been going on in Syria particularly as only a year or so ago there were comcerted attempts to railroad the British Parliament and people into sanctioning air strikes against Assad

Of course, it should be remembered that the media is being flooded with disinformation on all sides so it is impossible to tell what is the precise truth. Half the time I expect the intelligence agencies dont know either since one suspects that in the Middle East they are working with some fairly unreliable 'assets'.

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I have an interest in outdoor pursuits (more so in the past than now) and some of the implements that go with them

Useful to know, keep in touch.

You have no place in HPC with that sort of thinking, oh Mr Pig of the Steppes!

I'm not really from the Steppes, but I am a little bit feral

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Question for all the middle east experts here: how do 250 POWs allow themselves to be herded off to a mass grave to be shot? Surely with their sheer number they could have put up one last stand and taken a few of the war criminals out with them? I don't understand why people don't fight to the last or how more than 6 people can be controlled by one man with a gun.

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I don't understand why people don't fight to the last or how more than 6 people can be controlled by one man with a gun.

The one who makes the move will be the one who's definitely shot. Even if you know that you're doomed in the not too distant future you've still probably got your basic instincts functioning that'll make it hard to do anything that could very probably get you killed right now.

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The one who makes the move will be the one who's definitely shot. Even if you know that you're doomed in the not too distant future you've still probably got your basic instincts functioning that'll make it hard to do anything that could very probably get you killed right now.

So out of all 250 of them, not one had any fight left?

I don't know how I'd react facing almost certain death, and I hope never to find out, but I like to think I'd go out like a lion rather than a sheep. I'd rather have three bullets to the chest than one to the back of the head. You only die once.

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From Solzhenitsyn's The Gulag Archipelago

“And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?... The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”

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I heard from a good source, a while ago, that there is an intention to redraw the borders of the middle-east countries more in line with where similar ethnic groups and tribes actually reside. It didn't surprise me to hear Paddy Ashdown knocking this idea around all of a sudden,

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I heard from a good source, a while ago, that there is an intention to redraw the borders of the middle-east countries more in line with where similar ethnic groups and tribes actually reside. It didn't surprise me to hear Paddy Ashdown knocking this idea around all of a sudden,

A blood-drinking lizard in a 90 year old Henry Kissinger suit was wheeled out last year to mumble that Syria would be much happier carved up into dainty, bite-sized chunks...

Former secretary of state eyes breaking up of current-day Syria into “more or less autonomous regions”

though obviously allowing all the Shia people to get together into a bigger than bite-sized chunk, controlling 60% of the world's oil wouldn't be in their best interest at all

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Who knows

One thing is for sure Foley has spent his time hanging round some very hot areas over the past few years including Afghanistan, Libya and Syria.

As has been mentioned elsewhere next to the diplomatic service I would say that journalism and the media is one of the most popular forms of cover for 'spooks' so the idea that he may had another 'intelligence' job on the side is not beyond the realms of possibility

There is a rather strange story in the Daily Mail today claiming that Foleys one time jailer, Abu Ubaida Almaghribi, has been killed by ISIS because he was suspected of working for MI6

Here's another character in a similar, though somewhat more openly hawkish, vein...

Matthew VanDyke is an American documentary filmmaker, revolutionary, and former journalist. He gained notoriety during the Libyan Civil War as a foreign fighter on the side of the uprising and as a prisoner of war.
As a journalist and documentary filmmaker, VanDyke traveled throughout North Africa and the Middle East by motorcycle from 2007–2011. His experiences and observations during these four years led him to join the Libyan Civil War as a rebel fighter. VanDyke has publicly announced his support of revolutions in the Arab world, and stated his intention to assist them using a variety of means, including participating as an armed combatant.

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