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Michael Mosley Horizon...should I Eat Meat?

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http://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2014/aug/18/horizon-should-i-eat-meat-big-health-dilemma-tv-review-new-tricks

He of the 5/2 diet.

Well he was a self confessed carnivore that had hoped to give red meat the all clear. But after a month of increasing his red meat intake from 75g to 130g (the average for the top quartile of British men - (about four rashers of bacon a day equivalent)) his results were not encouraging

* blood pressure rose from 118 (top reading) to 141.

* fat ratio from a lean 15% to 17.5% (still good) but the 3kg of fat gained was all on his lower trunk.

*cholesterol 6.2 to 6.8mg.

Quite big changes over a short period.

Meanwhile a study of several hundred thousand 7th day Adventists that were vegetarians over 7 day Adventists that weren't (but still had little red meat) showed a 3 year longevity gain for the veggies. Seen as a key study because it irons out class differentials.

Moseley, despite his love of red meat, concluded that he would cut his red meat down and have a few red meat free days.

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His main conclusion was to cut out the processed stuff and to generally cut down overall too.

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"But after a month of increasing his red meat intake from 75g to 130g (the average for the top quartile of British men - (about four rashers of bacon a day equivalent"

That sounds low to me. My breakfast this morning included four rashers of bacon and a 125g beefburger and there's still lunch and dinner to go.

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the average for the top quartile of British men

So that's not the boundary for the top quartile, that's the average within that. So less than one in five British men eat more red meat than 4 rashers of bacon a day. Hard to believe.

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I found the amounts of 75g that they put out as an example to be somewhat tiny! However I do tend to have veggie weeks rather than just days (the missus has gone veggie/vegan as well so I’m learning all sorts of new cooking though TBH if buying meat/animal derivative vegan substitutes such as ‘butter’ there is one hell on a lot of chemical crap in them IMO).

Agree with ccc that the premise is mostly cut out the processed crap. Was interested in the white meat thingy that could be a health issue and will read more into that. What I didn’t like is that he didn’t go into greater details of what else he was doing while doing this trial. Would have been more interesting if he just did maybe 3 or 4 blocks of 2 weeks (all with increased meat intake but one sedentary, one fasting, one heavy exercise, one with only healthy side dishes etc.) Seemed a bit of a one size fits all study TBH and not his best episode of ‘science’.

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Eat whatever you like eating but don't go overboard on it. Since that's all that anyone ever needs to know (and it's common sense anyway) I've never worked out what quite what the point of these articles is.

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Eat whatever you like eating but don't go overboard on it. Since that's all that anyone ever needs to know (and it's common sense anyway) I've never worked out what quite what the point of these articles is.

Indeed - said moderation to the missus while the programme was on and I was supping my 7th pint of cider :)

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Eat whatever you like eating but don't go overboard on it. Since that's all that anyone ever needs to know (and it's common sense anyway) I've never worked out what quite what the point of these articles is.

Yes, we tend to fancy what we need.

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i didnt see the show, but Mrs Loo said it poo pood the paleo ideas.

Then I saw the trailer...it showed what I wouldnt call meat...sausages and burgers....quite a lot of non meat in those items.

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Eat whatever you like eating but don't go overboard on it. Since that's all that anyone ever needs to know (and it's common sense anyway) I've never worked out what quite what the point of these articles is.

I would generally agree with that - and used to be quite vehement about it - however the more you find out about the stuff in many foods - the more I think there must be links between this and all the ailments people ate getting in their droves today. Along with lots if other factors of course.

The burd loves pickles - got a big jar of them yesterday - I had a look at the ingredients - 3 different types of preservative ffs. In pickles !!!

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QED

Last time I touch processed/cured meat.

Colonoscopy for polyps etc ought to be routine screening, especially for men in their 50s, along with prostate checks.

Health service biased completely towards screening women's diseases.

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I would generally agree with that - and used to be quite vehement about it - however the more you find out about the stuff in many foods - the more I think there must be links between this and all the ailments people ate getting in their droves today. Along with lots if other factors of course.

The burd loves pickles - got a big jar of them yesterday - I had a look at the ingredients - 3 different types of preservative ffs. In pickles !!!

The programme did give me pause for thought about my own vegetarianism. I do very occasionally eat red meat............a bacon sandwich down to 10p at Tesco is just too much to resist for a signed up member of the HPC skinteratti, and then there's eating at other people's houses.......so I'm probably a dozen times a year meat eater. However, the Governement nutritionalists were coming down hard on vegetarians...not getting our B12 amongst other things.

Perhaps have to eat red meat a little more often.

A lot of meat eaters are in denial too. I often wondered how people survive on meat twice a day...... they don't....the landlady where I stay for breaks informed me she had had a colostomy in the last couple of years. I bet she doesn't connect that to the fact they never have a meat free day. I used to worry about the effect of going to B and B and being completely f**ked up bowel wise. These days I ask for a vegetarian breakfast.

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I would generally agree with that - and used to be quite vehement about it - however the more you find out about the stuff in many foods - the more I think there must be links between this and all the ailments people ate getting in their droves today. Along with lots if other factors of course.

The burd loves pickles - got a big jar of them yesterday - I had a look at the ingredients - 3 different types of preservative ffs. In pickles !!!

I think that that's the part about going overboard on it. It's rather easy to eat too much of what you really like. Perhaps I should add in tink about what you really like - people might eat loads of processed rubbish and find it not too bad and it fills them up, but does anyone really actually enjoy it?

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Yes, we tend to fancy what we need.

:huh:

I'm sure that'll ease the mind of many a heroin addict, not to mention all the poor, out of control lard arses for whom the last thing they need is yet another quarterpounder with cheese, however much they might just 'fancy' one.

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I think that that's the part about going overboard on it. It's rather easy to eat too much of what you really like. Perhaps I should add in tink about what you really like - people might eat loads of processed rubbish and find it not too bad and it fills them up, but does anyone really actually enjoy it?

I quite enjoy some processed stuff.

Chorizo , black pudding , a nice sausage. All very enjoyable.

I do think there is something in the eating just to be filled up angle. Bread for example - since more or less giving it up a few years ago - its very obvious now to me that most just eat it to fill a space - total habit. You don't really realise until you stop it though.

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I quite enjoy some processed stuff.

Chorizo , black pudding , a nice sausage. All very enjoyable.

I do think there is something in the eating just to be filled up angle. Bread for example - since more or less giving it up a few years ago - its very obvious now to me that most just eat it to fill a space - total habit. You don't really realise until you stop it though.

Im trying to give up bread...but just what do you do for a quick lunch?..a sandwich is so easy.

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:huh:

I'm sure that'll ease the mind of many a heroin addict, not to mention all the poor, out of control lard arses for whom the last thing they need is yet another quarterpounder with cheese, however much they might just 'fancy' one.

Bruce is clearly a lard ****, albeit a brown one

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I'm reducing the amount of meat I eat after watching Dr. Neil Bernard's (actual medical doctor) lectures on the seventh day adventist studies that others have mentioned here. But instead of meat I'm eating fruits vegetables, beans ect...not masses of pasta or bread.

Anecdotally any veggies I've known have been in better health/slimmer than non-veggies, but this might be due to wider lifestyle choices than simply not eating meat.

I still think I'll eat meat on average once a day, maybe a bit less, but it'll be good quality meat, not 'mystery meat'.

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I couldn't afford to eat red meat every day anyway. By the time you try to fit some fish in and beans and lentils it's self-moderating.

Do paleo eaters have good quality red meat every day? Because I wouldn't have thought that was realistic either.

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:huh:

I'm sure that'll ease the mind of many a heroin addict, not to mention all the poor, out of control lard arses for whom the last thing they need is yet another quarterpounder with cheese, however much they might just 'fancy' one.

What I meant was the way we sometimes fancy something that, presumably, our body needs. For example, once in a while I might fancy some spinach, normally I wouldn't touch spinach, but if my body thinks it's low on whatever spinach contains, my appetite dictates that I eat some spinach, which is just about edible with plenty of butter.

Bruce is clearly a lard ****, albeit a brown one

15 stone 6'2" and very brown :lol:.

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QED

Last time I touch processed/cured meat.

Colonoscopy for polyps etc ought to be routine screening, especially for men in their 50s, along with prostate checks.

Health service biased completely towards screening women's diseases.

I'm 35 and have an operation next week to have a polyp removed. Given the bowel problems over the last 18 months I suspect that I have had it for a couple of years.

It's still taken two months to get an appointment for the removal. Hopefully it's nothing more serious, but then things happen.

I was surprised that the doctor didn't give me a routine screen for cholesterol and blood pressure. I guess if you're not a boomer you have to pay to have it done privately.

IMO the private health system in Ireland is far superior to the 'free' NHS in the UK.

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Im trying to give up bread...but just what do you do for a quick lunch?..a sandwich is so easy.

True - every shop for lunch is just crammed with wheat and dairy. You will find other stuff - I was very surprised at how easy it was to give up. A few weeks - and you probably will barely miss it. (I to occasionally have flat bread with a curry etc.. Though)

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