interestrateripoff Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-28528824 Ministers and officials have been working on a policy that could bring major changes to England's student loan system, BBC Newsnight has learned. The plan could lead to higher tuition fee charges, and changes in loan terms and the way higher education works. At its core, the big idea is that universities should take on some of the risk that their own students repay less of their student debt than expected. Officials said they had the support of about "half a dozen" top universities. There is also one "vast" institutional investor which is interested. The officials said the idea was championed by David Willetts, the former universities minister. Mr Willetts told Newsnight: "why not give universities that wish it the opportunity of holding the loans belonging to their own graduates? So suddenly there's a direct connection between the university and the graduate." At the moment, students are loaned money by the Treasury for their fees and living costs. Lower-paid jobsOnce they have graduated - but only when their salary is more than £21,000 per year - they pay back a share of their income in repayments. After 30 years, outstanding debt is written off, so students who take lower-paid jobs repay less of their loan. The costs of the debt - currently assumed by officials to be between 30p and 40p in every £1 that it lends - are paid by the Treasury. Under the new plan, higher education institutions would, in future, buy that debt as students graduated. Officials said the price could vary from institution to institution - but the big idea is that institutions would profit if their students repaid more of their debt. Excellent lets put even more debt on the young to increase GDP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fully Detached Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 So students are going to be directly paying the university that has the right to award them their degree in 3-5 years. In the next rethink, you'll be able to skip the course completely and just buy a double first for about 60k. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCountOfNowhere Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 GDP - Osborne's Deflationary Ponzi ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I guess part of the idea is that Universities might be better at chasing the debt than the student loan company. We already have a situation that the university can withhold degrees certificates if they are owed money by the student. Since for many jobs (e.g. Teaching) a degree is required, perhaps the next stage is that an application for such a job requires a reference from the applicants university, which will be withheld if they are not paying their loan off? (I am not advocating this, I can just see it coming..) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel Of Highbridge Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I guess part of the idea is that Universities might be better at chasing the debt than the student loan company. We already have a situation that the university can withhold degrees certificates if they are owed money by the student. Since for many jobs (e.g. Teaching) a degree is required, perhaps the next stage is that an application for such a job requires a reference from the applicants university, which will be withheld if they are not paying their loan off? (I am not advocating this, I can just see it coming..) Might as well just bring back debtors prison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PricedOutNative Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Blimey, the complete lack of political voice of the 18->30 age group is amazing, the fact that they are so willing to put up and shut up is a very bad omen for the future… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted July 29, 2014 Author Share Posted July 29, 2014 Blimey, the complete lack of political voice of the 18->30 age group is amazing, the fact that they are so willing to put up and shut up is a very bad omen for the future… That's because they are highly trained consumers. The numbers don't matter as payment is in the future so the consequences are hidden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R K Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) "Tories look for suckers to take on their failed student loan system" * Studemt debt will go UP * Universities will go BUST * Market will be skewed * Tories can claim da deficit has gone DOWN Their mess will become apparent in 20 years time when they're drawing their gilt edged pensions, sitting in the Lords It's obvious what will happen here - The universities are being set up as victims. They'll be prey for investment banks who will sell them expensive complex swaps which will hide the losses on their own loan books which their governing bodies will find too tempting to not take up due to all their competition buying them. See Greece for details of what happens next when the fiddles/scams/hidden off b/sheet losses emerge in due course. You can read the spivs in this govt. like an open book. It would be amusing if not so serious. Edited July 29, 2014 by R K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EUBanana Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I guess universities probably should go bust, given there's a glut in the education industry. Assuming there's a market in education then that's what you'd expect to happen given the glut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bendy Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 "Tories look for suckers to take on their failed student loan system" * Studemt debt will go UP * Universities will go BUST * Market will be skewed * Tories can claim da deficit has gone DOWN Their mess will become apparent in 20 years time when they're drawing their gilt edged pensions, sitting in the Lords It's obvious what will happen here - The universities are being set up as victims. They'll be prey for investment banks who will sell them expensive complex swaps which will hide the losses on their own loan books which their governing bodies will find too tempting to not take up due to all their competition buying them. See Greece for details of what happens next when the fiddles/scams/hidden off b/sheet losses emerge in due course. You can read the spivs in this govt. like an open book. It would be amusing if not so serious. Which is why it doesn't matter what age you are, we all know 'they' will shaft 'us'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I guess universities probably should go bust, given there's a glut in the education industry. Assuming there's a market in education then that's what you'd expect to happen given the glut. Trouble with Universities going bust is that the Govt won't meet its target of 50% of young people being at Uni rather than on the unemployment statistics What will actually happen is that we will get a true free market and universities will get into financial difficulty "restructure" i.e. loads of redundancies and new staff on zero hour contracts (already happening at some Unis). some degrees will cost a lot less but the "student experience" will go down the toilet at many establishments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Ponzi scheme (n.): an investment swindle in which some early investors are paid off with money put up by later ones in order to encourage more and bigger risks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-28528824 Excellent lets put even more debt on the young to increase GDP. Their choice to borrow vastly for a crap return. I wonder what other market does that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCountOfNowhere Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Who will the young students be voting for at the next eleciton: http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/harriet-harman/10-broken-lib-dem-promise_b_3925441.html "1. Tuition Fees Nick Clegg campaigned on a promise to scrap tuition fees if they got into power, and every Liberal Democrat MP pledged to vote against future tuition fee increases. But once in government, Nick Clegg and his MPs voted to treble tuition fees to £9,000," Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshmellow Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Going to university right now is no different from paying 30k in Sainsburys to buy a bit of paper. Hopefully the government does introduce this and the majority of people will actually realise this and stop going, because let's face it university is never going to go back to what it should be because nobody has the balls to stand up to the morons shouting 'racist' etc. University should be cut back to only the elite going, A levels should be got rid of as well It's just as bad everywhere in the West. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nnails Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 As i kid i remember watching the tv with dad and watching two brains explain to iraq super committy why he granted export license for the gun. My dad had personal interest as he worked as craine drive and he though he moved the gun one day in the forge he worked in. He though he was idiot then and think he is an even bigger idiot now. my advise to the kids now. if by some miracle you can get job that looks ok dont bother with uni. to much debt for little return Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Goggles Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 It's obvious what will happen here - The universities are being set up as victims. They'll be prey for investment banks who will sell them expensive complex swaps which will hide the losses on their own loan books which their governing bodies will find too tempting to not take up due to all their competition buying them. See Greece for details of what happens next when the fiddles/scams/hidden off b/sheet losses emerge in due course. You can read the spivs in this govt. like an open book. It would be amusing if not so serious. Yes, it's so obvious. 1. Investment banks package up the debt into some kind of "off-balance sheet" vehicle. 2. Universities raise fees so high that the majority of students will not be able to pay it back within a working lifetime and default. 3. Fund will get into trouble and the tax payer will bail it out - only after the bankers and the vice chancellors have fed from the trough. That's how the system works. It's socialism, Jim, but not as we know it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R K Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) Yes, it's so obvious. 1. Investment banks package up the debt into some kind of "off-balance sheet" vehicle. 2. Universities raise fees so high that the majority of students will not be able to pay it back within a working lifetime and default. 3. Fund will get into trouble and the tax payer will bail it out - only after the bankers and the vice chancellors have fed from the trough. That's how the system works. It's socialism, Jim, but not as we know it. Is that you Mr Willets? There's another likely consequence too: Assuming not everyone will want to study law or bankstering, and fewer kids go to Uni 'cause it isn't financially viable, then instead of 1/2 of them deferring work for 3-4 years then swanning off to Vietnam, Aus or wherever for a year and starting work in their mid-twenties, they're going to be starting work at 18. Which is fine, except that govt. is raising the retirement date at every opportunity into their 70s. That wasn't so bad if they started work later, retire later, work similar number of years. But if you're working from 18 and retiring at say 72 or later they're paying twice over. No tertiary education and work til you drop. Nice one 2 brains! Edited July 29, 2014 by R K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bankstersparadise Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Blimey, the complete lack of political voice of the 18->30 age group is amazing, the fact that they are so willing to put up and shut up is a very bad omen for the future… What has this got to do with the 18-30s? Most of them are out of the university system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PricedOutNative Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 What has this got to do with the 18-30s? Most of them are out of the university system? Having to pay for Uni when their parents not only got it free but many got paid, going into jobs where the decent retirement scheme has closed to new members, having to pay way too much to live somewhere, being heavily taxed to pay for an older generation that enjoy a better standard of living than they will enjoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 What has this got to do with the 18-30s? Most of them are out of the university system? They'd have been the cohort protesting the changes most vigorously 5 years ago. I don't believe their mood is any more acquiescent than it was then. Clearly, a political opportunity for Labour to exploit, but what of Cleggsy Bear? Whether he chooses to endorse the idea or condemn it in all likelihood he'll be publicly embarrassed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btl_hater Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 What has this got to do with the 18-30s? Most of them are out of the university system? Bingo- exactly the reason why politicians get away with this sort of stuff- the people they are screwing over can't even vote to do anything about it! The perfect crime! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPin Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Trouble with Universities going bust is that the Govt won't meet its target of 50% of young people being at Uni rather than on the unemployment statistics What will actually happen is that we will get a true free market and universities will get into financial difficulty "restructure" i.e. loads of redundancies and new staff on zero hour contracts (already happening at some Unis). some degrees will cost a lot less but the "student experience" will go down the toilet at many establishments. When the original "student loans" arrived, one of my colleagues thought it was "borrrowing to pay your own dole" for 3 years! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nnails Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 When the original "student loans" arrived, one of my colleagues thought it was "borrrowing to pay your own dole" for 3 years! as a person who just missed out on the loans. i have to admit i agree with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habeas Domus Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 "borrowing to pay your own dole" for 3 years! don't give them ideas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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