Another Led Zep Lawsuit..... Stairway To Court

[MrPin]

I agree - except LedZep are more show biz and weird, which I enjoy. The Who and Rolling Stones are just upmarket from Status Quo.

The only interesting thing Jagger did was Performance.

We're probably not real rockers.

Spandex pants, and stack heeled boots would not be a good thing on a man of my, er "maturity"!

[SpectrumFX]

I agree it doesn't matter but I'm sure many of the samples of legit. Bonham got his influence from the same place a lot of black americans people got it from - it's very "gospel" (think black christian church choirs). Have a listen too that Bonham uses a lot of echo effects on his drums which works really well.

There`s a good bit in the "It Might get Loud" documentary where Page talks about getting that full echoy drum sound.

[stormymonday_2011]

I agree it doesn't matter but I'm sure many of the samples of legit. Bonham got his influence from the same place a lot of black americans people got it from - it's very "gospel" (think black christian church choirs). Have a listen too that Bonham uses a lot of echo effects on his drums which works really well.

If you want to see great drumming made to look ridiculously easy look no further than Ray Baduc

Now there is guy who can play

[chronyx]

If you want to see great drumming made to look ridiculously easy look no further than Ray Baduc

Now there is guy who can play

That was awesome!

[happy_renting]

*** Breaking News ***

Pachelbel Sues Every Composer of the Past 400 Years

[okaycuckoo]

Rolf Harris did a good cover version of it.

He flexed a long bendy thing between his palms. The kids in the audience screamed.

[thecrashingisles]

He flexed a long bendy thing between his palms. The kids in the audience screamed.

[okaycuckoo]

I did laugh back in the day - thought it was adult humour. Edit: if he wasn't off his head, it's even more weird.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NMzuQFHJVU

[Frank Hovis]

Hmm I disagree really. Yes some kids out there today can play amazingly well. But it's almost always a technical amazing, not a factor X amazing. Page had a very special feel for playing, as did the other "guitar heros" at the time. What they played often wasn't technically difficult to play, but that wasn't the point. The talent was in creating something out of nothing i.e. the pentatonic scale.

Clapton is probably the simplest player in existence, yet his solos were out of this world IMO. And there's no kid that can play like him. It's all vibrato, timing and phrasing. I think you've either got it or you haven't.

I don't agree with the last bit, 10,000 hours of practice will get you there. I read the Smiths biography and all Johnny Marr was ever doing from an early age was playing guitar, that's the way you get the technique right.

I'll chuck in Peter Green as a great player, that easy effortless and as you say simple style. It does sound better than the hundred-things-going-on-at-the-same-time technical virtuousity of an Eddie Van Halen.

[cica]

I don't agree with the last bit, 10,000 hours of practice will get you there. I read the Smiths biography and all Johnny Marr was ever doing from an early age was playing guitar, that's the way you get the technique right.

I'll chuck in Peter Green as a great player, that easy effortless and as you say simple style. It does sound better than the hundred-things-going-on-at-the-same-time technical virtuousity of an Eddie Van Halen.

You can't seriously talk about Johnny Marr when talking about guitarists. He was a good sound producer for a songwriter, not a instrumentalist of any merit.

[stormymonday_2011]

Hmm I disagree really. Yes some kids out there today can play amazingly well. But it's almost always a technical amazing, not a factor X amazing. Page had a very special feel for playing, as did the other "guitar heros" at the time. What they played often wasn't technically difficult to play, but that wasn't the point. The talent was in creating something out of nothing i.e. the pentatonic scale.

Clapton is probably the simplest player in existence, yet his solos were out of this world IMO. And there's no kid that can play like him. It's all vibrato, timing and phrasing. I think you've either got it or you haven't.

Some of Page's playing with Zep had a scratchy almost punk feel to it

Well displayed on this live clip of Communication Breakdown from 1969

Always used to amuse me in the 1970s when some New Wave fans used to slag off Led Zep, Deep Purple and Black Sabbath for being overblown rockers

I liked to point out that Communication Breakdown (2.29), Fireball (3.24) and Paranoid(2.53) were all played faster and were shorter in length than Anarchy in the UK (3.31) which was almost Pomp Rock by comparison.

Page was a major session player in London in the 1960s and appeared uncredited on a lot of the Pop hits of that era.

He would not have been offered those jobs if he had been no bloody good.

[stormymonday_2011]

I don't agree with the last bit, 10,000 hours of practice will get you there. I read the Smiths biography and all Johnny Marr was ever doing from an early age was playing guitar, that's the way you get the technique right.

I'll chuck in Peter Green as a great player, that easy effortless and as you say simple style. It does sound better than the hundred-things-going-on-at-the-same-time technical virtuousity of an Eddie Van Halen.

The other Green, Mick (no relation), was always one of my favourites .

Here he is tearing it up with Lemmy on a classic punk style cover of Blue Suede shoes

Huge influence on British guitarists such as Wilko Johnson and the true godfather of the stripped down British punk guitar style

I actually put Page in the same bunch as Mick Green, Keith Richards, Steve Marriott (much underrated), Pete Townsend, Wilko Johnson etc who played the guitar primarily as a rhythm instrument rather than going in for over blown fret wrangling beloved of so many. Page did not normally go in for extended, overblown and self indulgent solos with Zep. It is one of the reasons why I quite like Led Zeps style of playing even if they did blag a lot their tunes.

[dances with sheeple]

Some of Page's playing with Zep had a scratchy almost punk feel to it

Well displayed on this live clip of Communication Breakdown from 1969

Always used to amuse me in the 1970s when some New Wave fans used to slag off Led Zep, Deep Prtple and Black Sabbath for being overblown rockers

I liked to point out that Communication Breakdown (2.29), Fireball (3.24) and Paranoid(2.53) were all played faster and were shorter in length than Anarchy in the UK (3.31) which was almost Pomp Rock by comparison.

Page was a major session player in London in the 1960s and appeared uncredited on a lot of the Pop hits of that era.

He would not have been offered those jobs if he had been no bloody good.

He is bloody good, and one of the most influential rock guitarists of all time, and that clip is great, I have always liked it, but there are sloppy bits here and there when he is bending strings on the solos for example, something you probably wouldn`t get at a Satriani gig? The rhythm work is brilliant, and would make a more useful learning study than his solo IMO. The immense amount of development there has been in guitar playing, and the massive online presence of lessons and tips would mean that what he is doing there wouldn`t be as impressive to a young audience of guitar players today as it would probably have been to that audience sitting there?

The earlier clip, Madison Square Garden was it? where he has a twin neck guitar and a singer doing his best impression of a Greek God for the minions watching, and then he just runs up and down a pentatonic scale for a few minutes (with one or two moments which nearly take of into brilliance) looks underwhelming today where the bar for being blown away is so much higher? Blackmore was considered nearly a God in the very early 80`s, but just another guitarist doing the rounds by the early 90`s, because the explosion of technique in the 80`s lifted the bar so much higher for what an audience could expect to hear?

I get the point that it is really about expression and emotion, but IMO Page is not being particularly expressive or emotive in either clip, he is just someone who obviously knows his way around a guitar neck.

[stormymonday_2011]

He is bloody good, and one of the most influential rock guitarists of all time, and that clip is great, I have always liked it, but there are sloppy bits here and there when he is bending strings on the solos for example, something you probably wouldn`t get at a Satriani gig? The rhythm work is brilliant, and would make a more useful learning study than his solo IMO. The immense amount of development there has been in guitar playing, and the massive online presence of lessons and tips would mean that what he is doing there wouldn`t be as impressive to a young audience of guitar players today as it would probably have been to that audience sitting there?

The earlier clip, Madison Square Garden was it? where he has a twin neck guitar and a singer doing his best impression of a Greek God for the minions watching, and then he just runs up and down a pentatonic scale for a few minutes (with one or two moments which nearly take of into brilliance) looks underwhelming today where the bar for being blown away is so much higher? Blackmore was considered nearly a God in the very early 80`s, but just another guitarist doing the rounds by the early 90`s, because the explosion of technique in the 80`s lifted the bar so much higher for what an audience could expect to hear?

I get the point that it is really about expression and emotion, but IMO Page is not being particularly expressive or emotive in either clip, he is just someone who obviously knows his way around a guitar neck.

Horses for courses I think

Page was the best guitarist for the Led Zep sound. Ditto for Plant on vocals and Bonham on Drums.

it is the combination that worked making the sum greater than the parts particularly on the early albums

I am not sure technique is the be all and end all for producing interesting music. Keith Moon was far from being a perfect drummer but without him the Who have never sounded the same. In some ways technical brilliance and perfection is a form of death for all art.

Anyway i am old fashioned enough to think that electric guitarists should remember that the origins of their instrument was in the rhythm section of big jazz bands

[MrPin]

I don't agree with the last bit, 10,000 hours of practice will get you there. I read the Smiths biography and all Johnny Marr was ever doing from an early age was playing guitar, that's the way you get the technique right.

I'll chuck in Peter Green as a great player, that easy effortless and as you say simple style. It does sound better than the hundred-things-going-on-at-the-same-time technical virtuousity of an Eddie Van Halen.

Mr Marr plays the guitar nice!

[Liquid Goldfish]

I agree - except LedZep are more show biz and weird, which I enjoy. The Who and Rolling Stones are just upmarket from Status Quo.

The only interesting thing Jagger did was Performance.

We're probably not real rockers.

Anyway, I've been having another go at Led Zep but I just don't get what they're trying to do. The songs just sound like a big mish mash of things. I think it's probably because I like classical msuic and I'm yearning for some sort of structure and development - they don't seem like coherent pieces of music in the way that Deep Purple's music does - a mish mash is OK for me as long as it goes somewhere and there is a proper resolution.

[SpectrumFX]

Anyway, I've been having another go at Led Zep but I just don't get what they're trying to do. The songs just sound like a big mish mash of things. I think it's probably because I like classical msuic and I'm yearning for some sort of structure and development - they don't seem like coherent pieces of music in the way that Deep Purple's music does - a mish mash is OK for me as long as it goes somewhere and there is a proper resolution.

To be fair Stairway has some very obvious structure and development. From Chamber music to heavy metal all in one song!

The main thing about Zep is the simple contrast between the power and heavyness that comes from Bonham and John Paul jones (there's also plenty of development in the bass playing if you listen out for it) and the lighter acoustic guitar moments.

If you want to get a better idea of what the point of it all was check out their live work (and listen to John Paul Jones!).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edPEBB6VjRQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[newbonic]

And Zeppelin win their plagiarism law suit about stairway to heaven...

[Turned Out Nice Again]

To be fair Stairway has some very obvious structure and development. From Chamber music to heavy metal all in one song!

The defence cited this (among other previous uses of that chord structure):