More Than £46 Million Of Nhs Waste On 'unnecessary' Jobs

[Mrs Bear]

From today's Times, after F of I requests to every NHS organisation in the UK

Including

£36m on 826 PR jobs

£6.8m on 165 Equality and Diversity jobs

£3.5m on 86 'green' jobs

One art curator and programme manager

An 'administrator of green travel facilities'

And one 'car sustainability' officer

Total would pay for 1662 full time nurses

[Bloo Loo]

Add in BLoo Loos MRIs, xrays and consultants and thats a cool billion.

All caused by a woman who shouldnt have been driving.

[council dweller]

From today's Times, after F of I requests to every NHS organisation in the UK

Including

£36m on 826 PR jobs

£6.8m on 165 Equality and Diversity jobs

£3.5m on 86 'green' jobs

One art curator and programme manager

An 'administrator of green travel facilities'

And one 'car sustainability' officer

Total would pay for 1662 full time nurses

....you know that nurses mainly administer drugs and do paperwork don`t you?

What is needed is more Health Care Workers.

[SHERWICK]

....you know that nurses mainly administer drugs and do paperwork don`t you?

What is needed is more Health Care Workers.

Health Care Workers??

What do we need them for in the NHS?

[council dweller]

Health Care Workers??

What do we need them for in the NHS?

Sorry....I don`t know what came over me.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, it should b a crime to waste/steal/misappropriate/etc the tax payers money.

[Bloo Loo]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, it should b a crime to waste/steal/misappropriate/etc the tax payers money.

you cant prosecute a POLICY...they were only obeying orders.

[katchytitle]

Sorry....I don`t know what came over me.

Last I read, it costs about £100m / day to run the NHS. There is always going to be wastage, even in manufacturing where you don't have the human element it can be as high as 10%. The problem with the NHS and our current society in general is that everyone has moved to a just in time model for staffing. With housing increasing at above inflation for 20 years, people need to constantly move jobs to keep their standard of living the same.

You can't pay more and hire more caring staff. You hire caring staff by actually caring for them so they can care for others. You give them a good quality of life, the ability to have a home and a family and not worry about their job all the time. Our whole problem is always that we think of money first when we should think of it as only a means to an end. The NHS spends billions hiring "warm bodies" via recruitment shops at £300/day. You will never create a sustainable system this way, you will just tread water and fire fight from one problem to the next.

[Bloo Loo]

Last I read, it costs about £100m / day to run the NHS. There is always going to be wastage, even in manufacturing where you don't have the human element it can be as high as 10%. The problem with the NHS and our current society in general is that everyone has moved to a just in time model for staffing. With housing increasing at above inflation for 20 years, people need to constantly move jobs to keep their standard of living the same.

You can't pay more and hire more caring staff. You hire caring staff by actually caring for them so they can care for others. You give them a good quality of life, the ability to have a home and a family and not worry about their job all the time. Our whole problem is always that we think of money first when we should think of it as only a means to an end. The NHS spends billions hiring "warm bodies" via recruitment shops at £300/day. You will never create a sustainable system this way, you will just tread water and fire fight from one problem to the next.

entitlement is strong in this post.

[Blod]

Going on the numbers at the head of this thread these employees are on about £43,000 :angry:

[katchytitle]

entitlement is strong in this post.

Its not really entitlement - just a comment on who is actually making the money and that money doesn't always buy better service. You may think people are on big salaries but I'm willing to bet that the big organisations and the 0.1% owners have their noses in the trough rather than the salaried consultant. Its all about convincing the population that this way is somehow "better" for them - the best advertising is when you don't even notice that it changed your mind. Branded drugs, colourful packaging, "green" activity managers are all an attempt to convince people they are "doing the right thing". Once you get people repeating something they don't understand its pretty easy to get them to repeat anything you want.

On the notion of salaries - the nominal value should matter less as one person's £40K is another's £30K if you compare standard of living and cost of taxes and goods in,say, London vs Bradford.

[Smyth]

Last I read, it costs about £100m / day to run the NHS. There is always going to be wastage, even in manufacturing where you don't have the human element it can be as high as 10%. The problem with the NHS and our current society in general is that everyone has moved to a just in time model for staffing. With housing increasing at above inflation for 20 years, people need to constantly move jobs to keep their standard of living the same.

There is a difference between unavoidable wastage that is the consequence of having a huge organisation (projects going over budget, departments blowing money on nonsense to avoid underspending, general inefficiency, expense claims, etc), and deliberate planned wastage such as employing hundreds/thousands of people to work in non-jobs that shouldnt exist.

The former is annoying but somewhat forgivable since its largely unavoidable. The latter is not.

[Smyth]

Its not really entitlement - just a comment on who is actually making the money and that money doesn't always buy better service. You may think people are on big salaries but I'm willing to bet that the big organisations and the 0.1% owners have their noses in the trough rather than the salaried consultant. Its all about convincing the population that this way is somehow "better" for them - the best advertising is when you don't even notice that it changed your mind. Branded drugs, colourful packaging, "green" activity managers are all an attempt to convince people they are "doing the right thing". Once you get people repeating something they don't understand its pretty easy to get them to repeat anything you want.

On the notion of salaries - the nominal value should matter less as one person's £40K is another's £30K if you compare standard of living and cost of taxes and goods in,say, London vs Bradford.

I think people have the wrong idea of how money gets wasted in the public sector - its not senior management salaries that are the problem. Even if you believe that senior managers are paid too much, there still arent that many of them and you are 'only' talking about a few million pounds a year. The real money pit is the enormous layer of middle management, and people working in jobs that shouldnt exist ("diversity consultants", etc). Its not that people are being paid too much, its that too many people are being employed in roles that shouldnt be there at all.

Its the exact same situation in universities; people complain about Vice Chancellors getting £500k a year but that is chickenfeed compared the hundreds/thousands of people a university employs doing pointless administrative roles on £30-50k salaries. If you looked at these people one-by-one then their roles/salaries might be somewhat defensible, but in aggregate you are talking about 10s of millions of pounds that are being wasted on essentially nothing.

Edited April 1, 2014 by Smyth

[R K]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, it should b a crime to waste/steal/misappropriate/etc the tax payers money.

It's not taxpayers (whoever they are) money though is it?

There's a deficit so it's mostly Chinese government, banks & insurance companies' money. F*ck 'em.

[THE BALD MAN]

I think people have the wrong idea of how money gets wasted in the public sector - its not senior management salaries that are the problem. Even if you believe that senior managers are paid too much, there still arent that many of them and you are 'only' talking about a few million pounds a year. The real money pit is the enormous layer of middle management, and people working in jobs that shouldnt exist ("diversity consultants", etc). Its not that people are being paid too much, its that too many people are being employed in roles that shouldnt be there at all.

Its the exact same situation in universities; people complain about Vice Chancellors getting £500k a year but that is chickenfeed compared the hundreds/thousands of people a university employs doing pointless administrative roles on £30-50k salaries. If you looked at these people one-by-one then their roles/salaries might be somewhat defensible, but in aggregate you are talking about 10s of millions of pounds that are being wasted on essentially nothing.

Senior salaries being too high is still a problem...its almost fraudulent...no stress, no accountability yet massive salaries.

[Rare Bear]

I think people have the wrong idea of how money gets wasted in the public sector - its not senior management salaries that are the problem. Even if you believe that senior managers are paid too much, there still arent that many of them and you are 'only' talking about a few million pounds a year. The real money pit is the enormous layer of middle management, and people working in jobs that shouldnt exist ("diversity consultants", etc). Its not that people are being paid too much, its that too many people are being employed in roles that shouldnt be there at all.

Its the exact same situation in universities; people complain about Vice Chancellors getting £500k a year but that is chickenfeed compared the hundreds/thousands of people a university employs doing pointless administrative roles on £30-50k salaries. If you looked at these people one-by-one then their roles/salaries might be somewhat defensible, but in aggregate you are talking about 10s of millions of pounds that are being wasted on essentially nothing.

What you say is very true but it doesn't go down well with the lefties.

[@contradevian]

There is a difference between unavoidable wastage that is the consequence of having a huge organisation (projects going over budget, departments blowing money on nonsense to avoid underspending, general inefficiency, expense claims, etc), and deliberate planned wastage such as employing hundreds/thousands of people to work in non-jobs that shouldnt exist.

The former is annoying but somewhat forgivable since its largely unavoidable. The latter is not.

..and all those professional social media trolls too. Total waste of money.

[Billy soy]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, it should b a crime to waste/steal/misappropriate/etc the tax payers money.

Agreed. But what of the Royal Mail sell off,deliberately under valued by £1 billion. Apparently the independent has found out boy George's best man was one of the 20 selected to buy bulk shares, at an artificially low rate on the understanding they would not immediately sell. And they did just that, gidiots mate alone raking in £20 million in 24 hours.

[DeepLurker]

..and all those professional social media trolls too. Total waste of money.

[@contradevian]

Agreed. But what of the Royal Mail sell off,deliberately under valued by £1 billion. Apparently the independent has found out boy George's best man was one of the 20 selected to buy bulk shares, at an artificially low rate on the understanding they would not immediately sell. And they did just that, gidiots mate alone raking in £20 million in 24 hours.

Well if there was an any justice in this country, Osborne and his mate would be scampering around trying to raise the £1BN + £20M to avoid a public lynching.

However Dee White is releasing a rap record, so that will occupy the press and TV for a while. Just need the Royals to knock out a few more sprogs to maintain the bread and circuses.

Edited April 1, 2014 by aSecureTenant

[Mrs Bear]

While on the subject of NHS waste, we have a friend whose bathroom is like a chemist's shop - masses of prescription items stockpiled. To be fair he has various health problems, some of them more serious than others - but on one visit I counted over 60 prescription items (maybe 6 or 7 different products) on his bathroom shelves - mostly for various skin irritation problems. There is some very bland moisturiser he gets on prescription - large dispensers of it - and every time we go he presses me to take a couple home.

I have given up asking why on earth he keeps taking these repeat items (all free since he is getting on) when he has so much already - why doesn't he just tell them he doesn't need it? But it falls on deaf ears -he has a tendency to hoard anyway. It makes me fume every time we go.

But I can't help wondering how much of this goes on.

[@contradevian]

While on the subject of NHS waste, we have a friend whose bathroom is like a chemist's shop - masses of prescription items stockpiled. To be fair he has various health problems, some of them more serious than others - but on one visit I counted over 60 prescription items (maybe 6 or 7 different products) on his bathroom shelves - mostly for various skin irritation problems. There is some very bland moisturiser he gets on prescription - large dispensers of it - and every time we go he presses me to take a couple home.

I have given up asking why on earth he keeps taking these repeat items (all free since he is getting on) when he has so much already - why doesn't he just tell them he doesn't need it? But it falls on deaf ears -he has a tendency to hoard anyway. It makes me fume every time we go.

But I can't help wondering how much of this goes on.

I've had that too. Visited some elderly friends in Norfolk and took away sack fulls of prescription paracetamol and bottles of that medicine to reduce acid reflux. Not that I needed it, but their cupboards were overflowing and it was easier to say OK.

Local chemist near me is a constant queue of oldies waving prescriptions.

Free prescriptions presumably. Now in France I think they have a slightly different system. You pay and then claim it back, but the French are apparently known for a certain level of hypercondria.

Edited April 1, 2014 by aSecureTenant

[katchytitle]

There is a difference between unavoidable wastage that is the consequence of having a huge organisation (projects going over budget, departments blowing money on nonsense to avoid underspending, general inefficiency, expense claims, etc), and deliberate planned wastage such as employing hundreds/thousands of people to work in non-jobs that shouldn't exist.

The former is annoying but somewhat forgivable since its largely unavoidable. The latter is not.

I agree that there is inefficiency and it should be rooted out but the entire system is set up to increase inefficiencies to remove transparency and transfer wealth to a few. No one wins prizes for fixing the NHS by cut backs or telling people its unaffordable and it will collapse. You're never going to get elected if you say that.

I would also say that Labour's civil/NHS employment boom was to get people off the dole and into work. Basically they would have more fulfilled lives if they were striving to do something (anything!) and then the smarter ones would filter into the private sector or move up the rungs in government. The reality is, it is much better to employ a human being in a non job than to let them languish watching daytime TV on the dole. At least they "pay some taxes" ( I know it won't be enough to cover costs). They at least have a chance of being productive that way. Unfortunately if people just sit in their 9-4 jobs and don't do anything copy and pasting sustainability documents and having meetings discussing soap operas it lowers productivity and bankrupts the state eventually.

[Si1]

entitlement is strong in this post.

+1

Give me more money so I can stop worrying about money, and give you better value

Give it me

Now

[Si1]

While on the subject of NHS waste, we have a friend whose bathroom is like a chemist's shop - masses of prescription items stockpiled. To be fair he has various health problems, some of them more serious than others - but on one visit I counted over 60 prescription items (maybe 6 or 7 different products) on his bathroom shelves - mostly for various skin irritation problems. There is some very bland moisturiser he gets on prescription - large dispensers of it - and every time we go he presses me to take a couple home.

I have given up asking why on earth he keeps taking these repeat items (all free since he is getting on) when he has so much already - why doesn't he just tell them he doesn't need it? But it falls on deaf ears -he has a tendency to hoard anyway. It makes me fume every time we go.

But I can't help wondering how much of this goes on.

Have you thought of having a word in confidence with his GP?