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How Long Till It All Collapses ?


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HOLA441

This is still true today, as it was when you posted it in 2005. Yet it's a market, with different views and opinions. Time is coming non-owners beginning to feel more sorry for themselves, rather than hasty buyers who've been massively outbidding them for years.

My view is buyers are going to fall away. Fewer willing to pay the ever higher prices that have been set in recent years during reflation.

Rents based on incomes and ability to pay. I might believe differently if the authorities truly get anywhere with dreams of wage-inflation.

Wages can't inflate in today's circumstances....due to so many insecure jobs, lack of regular and uncertain future incomes......debt inc mortgage debt requires long-term stability and security....we do not at the moment have that. ;)

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HOLA442

I've said before, i think they have lucked into this "recovery" and are playing it for all they can.

However, with the HTB2 scheme forcing up the asking prices of the cr*ppiest of places by £20K in 3 months it will have stopped even the most enthusiastic of FTBs and the BTLers wont make any profit at those prices.

The plates are spinning slowly now.....

The only thing holding up the Titanic is the iceberg!

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HOLA443

I say we have until the end September next year before this all blows up. Martin Armstrong has been on the money with amazing accuracy. His ECM is one to watch.

ecm-wave-2011-2020.jpg

Er...US$ to soar. :lol:

Gold to collapse :lol:

Hmmm...

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HOLA444

Wages can't inflate in today's circumstances....due to so many insecure jobs, lack of regular and uncertain future incomes......debt inc mortgage debt requires long-term stability and security....we do not at the moment have that. ;)

Wages can't rise because they've already been inflated by fifteen odd years of unsustainable debt-driven demand.

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HOLA448

That fcuker Osborne (with his pet, Carney) has done something really, really bad here.

As far as I can see it has to mean government support for house prices for a generation - MIRAS, enhanced SMI, abolishing stamp duty, FTB grants and things we never even dreamed of will have to be brought in to stop the crash when IRs finally rise.

I think he's a true psycho.

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HOLA449

That fcuker Osborne (with his pet, Carney) has done something really, really bad here.

As far as I can see it has to mean government support for house prices for a generation - MIRAS, enhanced SMI, abolishing stamp duty, FTB grants and things we never even dreamed of will have to be brought in to stop the crash when IRs finally rise.

I think he's a true psycho.

it sometimes makes me wonder if it's deliberate...either they want total collapse or they want the banks to continue getting free money.

Basically we are all working to support the banks and the public sector now.

The free market tories have turned out to be fixed market toe-rags.

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HOLA4410

it sometimes makes me wonder if it's deliberate...either they want total collapse or they want the banks to continue getting free money.

Although he clearly likes hanging out with the rich and powerful I think Osborne's driven mainly by winning to prove to himself how clever he is - I think it means more to him even than being in power.

I think he's quite different to Gordon Brown who I think was driven mad by 20+ years of compromises but who did actually think he was in power to do good (however deluded).

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HOLA4411

it sometimes makes me wonder if it's deliberate...either they want total collapse or they want the banks to continue getting free money.

Basically we are all working to support the banks and the public sector now.

The free market tories have turned out to be fixed market toe-rags.

State Capitalism. General equilibrium theory with Krugmanite rather than Keynesian modifiers. The central bankers were all educated at the same universities, they're all true believers. Corresponds very well with Deng-era Chinese Communism.

See Steve Keen, Nassim Taleb and Michael Hudson for comprehensive demolition/refutation.

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HOLA4412

Looks to me like the return to normal/rush to sell at insane prices has started.

There will be winners and losers for sure but one thing I think is clear, there is going to be an almighty collapse in the UK this year.

I predict we wont get to past Sept before the housing market has died a death in the UK.

I'm currently trying to sort out a job abroad, I for one have no desire to stay here now.

I've done exactly that, and got myself a job abroad. Now debating what to do with my wad of savings. The 'sensible' thing to do if we were not in a bubble would be to do a BTL for the 2-3 years I am out of the country. This government has kept things propped up with hot air and promises for far too long - it surely has to crash again soon? I don't want to risk a 20% fall. But that can't be allowed to happen...?!?!

Grrr. I don't have long to decide.

Edit: five months until I leave these insane shores.

Edited by neon tetra
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HOLA4413
The free market tories have turned out to be fixed market toe-rags.

It's ironic that only a Tory government could have gotten away with directly subsidising mortgages for middle class house buyers- any labor leader who suggested such a thing would have been lynched.

But it does tend to flush 20 years of 'free market' rhetoric from the right down the toilet- quite appropriate given where such rhetoric has led us- up to our necks in sh*t.

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HOLA4414

It's ironic that only a Tory government could have gotten away with directly subsidising mortgages for middle class house buyers- any labor leader who suggested such a thing would have been lynched.

But it does tend to flush 20 years of 'free market' rhetoric from the right down the toilet- quite appropriate given where such rhetoric has led us- up to our necks in sh*t.

There are few free markets most are manipulated...

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HOLA4415

So much media narrative against this now.

Tories are in that middle-ground now - half way between 'fixing' the economy and breaking it.

This won't hold until election. I expect we'll see something in budget to cool London:

- bringing forward overseas CGT

- some small/delayed BTL tax change to indicate that's next

- removal of HTB2 for properties in M25

There are those other lending constraints hitting in April too I think - extra checks etc.

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HOLA4416

So much media narrative against this now.

Tories are in that middle-ground now - half way between 'fixing' the economy and breaking it.

This won't hold until election. I expect we'll see something in budget to cool London:

- bringing forward overseas CGT

- some small/delayed BTL tax change to indicate that's next

- removal of HTB2 for properties in M25

There are those other lending constraints hitting in April too I think - extra checks etc.

Comedy gold in that post tongue.gif

Either way, we can agree there will be MORE TINKERING.

We don't need tinkering, we need people with vision and a selfless self determination to sort this mess out.

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HOLA4418

It doesn`t matter what people on here think, there is an insatiable lust for London property from immigrant families and foreigners. They will pay anything for real-estate in the Capital of the World.

Errrrrrr...one question....where was that insatiable lust for London property in 2008 when there was no insane lending, low interest rates or government props ?

I think you have mistake lust for property to government ramping of house prices using freshly printed money causing rampant inflation, devaluing peoples incomes/savings/pensions and quite possibly plunging the whole country into the worst depression imaginable.

Smoke and mirrors from a lying government and a corrupt/bankrupt banking system does not make for a sustainable housing market.

Edited by TheCountOfNowhere
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HOLA4419

It doesn`t matter what people on here think, there is an insatiable lust for London property from immigrant families and foreigners. They will pay anything for real-estate in the Capital of the World.

The streets of London are paved in gold.......bring it on, let them keep thinking that....tomorrow we will all be millionaires....rich beyond our wildest dreams. ;)

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HOLA4420

it sometimes makes me wonder if it's deliberate...either they want total collapse or they want the banks to continue getting free money.

Basically we are all working to support the banks and the public sector now.

The free market tories have turned out to be fixed market toe-rags.

Of course it's deliberate - Loot, loot, loot and then loot some more whilst the going is good. This sucker is going down and those in the know want to squeeze every last drop of blood out of it.

And the Tories turning out to be no better than Labour when it comes to stealing wealth off the electorate to give to the bankers and insiders? Quelle Surprise! It's what politicians do. Anyone who really thinks that the political establishment act in the interests of the electorate are extremely gullible or deluded.

Their job is as middle men, PR agents. Give the public the sense that they are participating in a representative democracy and it gives legitimacy to any amount of dodgy decisions taken in the interests of the well connected. So much easier to enrich yourself when your money supply happily hands over a chunk of their earned wealth without needing to be put under the barrel of a gun.

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HOLA4423

It doesn`t matter what people on here think, there is an insatiable lust for London property from immigrant families and foreigners. They will pay anything for real-estate in the Capital of the World.

That lust stops dead at the slightest whiff the asset won't appreciate any more.

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HOLA4425

I've done exactly that, and got myself a job abroad. Now debating what to do with my wad of savings. The 'sensible' thing to do if we were not in a bubble would be to do a BTL for the 2-3 years I am out of the country. This government has kept things propped up with hot air and promises for far too long - it surely has to crash again soon? I don't want to risk a 20% fall. But that can't be allowed to happen...?!?!

Grrr. I don't have long to decide.

Edit: five months until I leave these insane shores.

Why would that be sensible, even if it were not a bubble, and prices affordable (without HTB, QE, base rates years at 0.5%, FLS) ?

So you had a home for when you got back? I don't think I could stand any one in my home (if I had one), renting it, awaiting the call(s) for trouble needing sorting.

Too many have been concerned about their paper/digital savings, and therefore I suspect it's helped drive up asset prices. I've taken my position long ago, for the worst so far, and possibly terminally, but would be good if people with some savings/money are the only ones left standing.

Why are existing landlords not concerned about 20%+ falls? Or rental yields set to slide. Be afraid landlords and sell up.

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