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eric pebble

Many People Very Worried: Cannot Sell Their Properties.

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Went to W London last night - met up with various friends - and a few couples from outside London.

There were no less than SIX couples who - after being very cautious to talk about it initially - ended up talking in hurried way - were really really anxious and fed up - all had been trying to sell their properties in and around London for at least a year - in some cases over 18 months!! All had nightmare stories to tell of bad tenants, massive rent voids etc. - 3 couples had moved out of London in last 12-20 months - and bought in various places including West Country - long ago had realised London is a hateful place - and all had [in some cases tried without success] rented out London properties and made the move - many helped along by inheritance/money from granny in varying amounts.

They had, in all cases, spent large sums on re-furbishments/re-building etc etc. - thinking that they would easily sell their London pads at massive profit - and thus keep cash flow nice and sweet....... WELL - this has turned out NOT to be the case at all!! Just NOT ABLE TO SELL - even with 10-20% [or even more] "discounts"..... AND they are STILL trying to get rid of them - with NO SIGN of success - "things are worse than ever now - it's all gone dead" - and are really really worried now - as money problem begins to bite..... Still paying out all those nasty bills on the properties..... especially very nasty sizeable Council Taxes....[on 2 properties of course - London and the "country"...] - so things are NOT good....

One couple there trying to sell their 3/4 bed place in Somerset - absolutely NO bites at all for over a year!! - despite HUGE decrease on asking price..... c £55k!!!

THey all sat there despondently - relating how they all knew many many others who are in the same boat - all over the UK -- and - get this - they were saying "All those things you read/hear in the newspapers/radio/tv about the "Recovering" "Stable" market are just plain "LIES" - "d'you know!" - "It is all made up you know" said one of the ladies who until now all her life had just believed everything she reads in the press - she avidly reads all those horrendous "Property" supplements - - "I'ts just propoganda" she said!!!! I sat there - and said to her - "Marge - did you always think it was all true - all that guff in the press - endless stuff every day/weekend - endless endless drivel about the property prices "only going up" [etc. etc.] -- and she went silent for a bit - and I gently told her - it has been total CR@P for years and years - all trotted out by PR Agents and the Vested Interests.......

Her face.... as it dawned on her that perhaps she had been a schmuck.......... What a worried lot of people - a bit sad. I just didn't have the heart to tell them it's even WORSE than they think.... Plus see - http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...showtopic=19559 - and here - http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...showtopic=19210 - tells us that things ain't good at all out there....

Edited by eric pebble

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Guest consa

Hi Eric,

Nice enecdotal, I notice you mention council tax on two properties, I thought you didn't pay council tax on empty property??, although I did read somewhere they were introducing a percentage to be payable even if it is empty.

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Theres no such thing as can't sell your property. Its the fact that they are not selling for a price that someone is willing to pay for it. Thats what I love about market Forces somehing is worth what someone will pay for it. At present sellers outstrip buyers by a long margin an that will continue to increase. Regards news there will more doom and gloom regards property as opposed to good news. A majority of people are agreeing now is not a good time to buy whilst two years ago you would have been ostracised for saying this. Nothing has realy happened yet its plateaued noone is buying the worse is yet to come.....keep an eye on the States both the property market and the stock exchange that is when the fun will really start.

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I'm seeing in Oz that the reductions are happening faster now. A property just near me was put on the market only 4 weeks ago and already they've cut the price. It seems to be speeding up and this is an empty property so the owner is probably under financial pressure to sell.

Also there are probably 10% more houses on the market generally than a few weeks ago. The market isn't going up...

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Good piece of anecdotal evidence - The property bulls and the BTL merchants out there know only too well the current atate of the market, as they try to latch onto any upwards twitch in this or that statistic. Watch their eyes closely and you will see the deep seated fear............ anecdotal evidence is indeed compelling.

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Guest muttley

A co-worker put her house on the market two weeks ago and has received an offer already! The house is a pre-war end terraced in Blackpool.The asking price was 90k.

She's also had an offer accepted on another property at 5k below asking price (130-140k range,I think) .

She is blissfully unaware of any problems or trends with the housing market and therefore very happy to be moving up "the ladder".

It surprises me how someone can make such a major purchase without doing any research.I am sure she could have got more than 5k off the next house.However,I hope it works out for her.

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Generally, No Sale = Price TOO HIGH.

However, if a property has been on the market for a long time, it can go "stale", and people don't bother viewing as they think something must be wrong with it.

Also, in a declining market, the vendor must make a realistic initial reduction or he/she will be continually chasing the market downwards.

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Guest Time 2 raise Interest Rates

Was out and about earlier today, thought I'd have a drive around

one part of our local area, which is very nice indeed. The sort of

area most towns and villages have if you won the lottery, somewhere

you'd like to live. Well, I was quite amazed. The last time I was in

the area, nothing for sale, today in four of the roads, granted some

more than half to mile long, I counted 18 for sale boards. Maybe

nothing in it, or maybe panic, who knows?

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Yes,but..... No Forced Sellers = No Crash.

Transported a future "forced sale" today to hospital the big C word. Death and disability will see houses put on the market and sold at market rates. :(

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Transported a future "forced sale" today to hospital the big C word. Death and disability will see houses put on the market and sold at market rates. :(

And: Anyone just wanting to sell to move up or to relocate will have to accept what they can get. These people will of course gain if they play their cards right. In both selling and buying they will help to bring on the crash.

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Guest muttley

The trend may be downwards,but it's all happening in slow-motion.

There is a Russian saying (relating to chess) " If a man is drowning,throw him an anvil."

We need an anvil,guys!! :(

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Guest consa

Yes,but..... No Forced Sellers = No Crash.

Fear of paper loss/negative equity = desperate sellers = crash

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Transported a future "forced sale" today to hospital the big C word. Death and disability will see houses put on the market and sold at market rates. :(

There will always be forced sellers for reasons of death, divorce, relocation, loss of job etc. and these sellers will drive the crash IMO. A continued standoff is impossible because some people simply have to sell.

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Hi Eric,

Nice enecdotal, I notice you mention council tax on two properties, I thought you didn't pay council tax on empty property??, although I did read somewhere they were introducing a percentage to be payable even if it is empty.

My understanding was that CT on second props used to be 50%, but has now been increased to up to 90%? Lot of second/holiday homes near me, must be costing quite a lot now..

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Guest consa

My understanding was that CT on second props used to be 50%, but has now been increased to up to 90%? Lot of second/holiday homes near me, must be costing quite a lot now..

I think you are correct, the 50% used to be the case but I am not sure whether or not different councils apply different reductions now.

This is one I nabbed for clarification:-

http://www.canterbury.gov.uk/cgi-bin/buildpage.pl?mysql=39

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Thnx Eric,

These couples you have described sound typical of those who "chase the market lower".

They will hope for an improvement, and slowly cut their prices as the market falls, always a step behind.

If they really wanted to sell, they would have to cut the price to make it stand out as a bargain. Has they done so a year ago, they would have sold at better prices than they can get now.

Agree totally Dr Bubb; thanks v much. Don't know about anyone else - but I keep hearing stories of people who can't sell all over the place -- there must be so many people in this predicament! Yes -- it is all very very slow - Great example of Japan over past decade+ tells us - it can drag on for years and years -- but look what happened there...... what was it? 90% drop in house prices in 10-15 years? ......

My understanding was that CT on second props used to be 50%, but has now been increased to up to 90%? Lot of second/holiday homes near me, must be costing quite a lot now..

90-95% Council TAx on 2nd property now I think.....

Edited by eric pebble

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Guest prudence

Yes,but..... No Forced Sellers = No Crash.

It is inevitable that there will be forced sales through personal circumstances (and some repos) and those selling prices will establish the benchmark for the area...............

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Guest muttley

There will always be forced sellers for reasons of death, divorce, relocation, loss of job etc. and these sellers will drive the crash IMO. A continued standoff is impossible because some people simply have to sell.

There were deaths,divorces,relocations and loss of jobs between 2000 and 2004.This did not stop the market rising at a rate considerably above inflation.

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There will always be forced sellers for reasons of death, divorce, relocation, loss of job etc. and these sellers will drive the crash IMO. A continued standoff is impossible because some people simply have to sell.

.

The person in question won't be selling. His estate will be though. :( Seemed like a top bloke too.

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Guest rigsby II

The person in question won't be selling. His estate will be though.

Possibly more money to be ploughed back into the property market then.

As the rellies move up the property ladder to a nicer house thanks to their nice inheritance.

Reducing the chances of crash IMHO.

Edited by rigsby II

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There were deaths,divorces,relocations and loss of jobs between 2000 and 2004.This did not stop the market rising at a rate considerably above inflation.

That the market rose is absolute proof that the transactions took place, that people were actually selling their houses. Where the price goes is another matter, the point is that a permanent stand-off where homes simpy do not sell is not at all likely. So either buyers are about to start offering higher prices or sellers are about to ask lower prices. One or the other since the market doesn't simply stop.

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The best summary explanation, from Business Week: "Today's housing prices are predicated on an impossible combination: the strong growth in income and asset values of a strong economy, plus the ultra-low rates of a weak economy. Either the economy's long-term prospects will get worse or rates will rise. In either scenario, housing will weaken. Caveat emptor."

''The only way is DOWN........Baby!'' (TTRTR)

Edited by Michael

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Guest muttley

That the market rose is absolute proof that the transactions took place, that people were actually selling their houses. Where the price goes is another matter, the point is that a permanent stand-off where homes simpy do not sell is not at all likely. So either buyers are about to start offering higher prices or sellers are about to ask lower prices. One or the other since the market doesn't simply stop.

But to me a forced seller is someone who didn't want to sell in the first place.In the early 1990's high interest rates and job losses forced people to sell.Similarly the lowering of interest rates and improved job security from 2000 onwards produced "enthused buyers".

I know we can't have a permanent stand-off (or "really serious stagnation" as Kirstie recently called it) but I thought the same last year.

In fact there was a competition to see who could predict the rise/fall in the Nationwide Index.I think BBB is going to win.

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  • 302 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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