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The Ukraine Chernobyl Thread

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Western capitals scrambled for a response, but it was limited to words. "Realistically, we have to assume the Crimea is in Russian hands. The challenge now is to deter Russia from taking over the Russian-speaking east of Ukraine" said a Western official. Reuters

How does they want to deter Russia?

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Shocking Videos Of Russian Troops And Helicopters Moving Through Crimea

By Michael Snyder, on February 28th, 2014

Russian troops and pro-Russian militia forces now have full military control of Crimea without a shot being fired, and Russian troops and helicopters continue to pour into the region. Not that there really was ever any doubt about what was going to happen in Crimea.

So does "not that there really was ever any doubt about what was going to happen" mean the videos aren't really "shocking".

Didn't something similar happen in Hungary in 1956.

Edited by billybong

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So does "not that there really was ever any doubt about what was going to happen" mean the videos aren't really "shocking".

Yup, that's why i deliberately left the word "shocking" out of the link title, i'm sure it was just used in the original as an emotional intensifier. It's one of those things that could blow up big time WW3, anew cold war or just fizzle into some posturing. There is no way NATO can get significant military into the location to counter posture. This is on Russia's borders, they can be there in a day, the response from Ukraine population will reveal whether it was a genuine popular revolution with mass support, or simply a western backed coup played out with the support of selective western media coverage.

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Yup, that's why i deliberately left the word "shocking" out of the link title, i'm sure it was just used in the original as an emotional intensifier. It's one of those things that could blow up big time WW3, anew cold war or just fizzle into some posturing. There is no way NATO can get significant military into the location to counter posture. This is on Russia's borders, they can be there in a day, the response from Ukraine population will reveal whether it was a genuine popular revolution with mass support, or simply a western backed coup played out with the support of selective western media coverage.

the people probably just wanted to get rid of the theiving thug that was in charge.....now he's gone, they want to go shopping, go to work and get on with their lives.

Its a shame they mostly rent ;)

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Crimea is just phase one. It's a tricky place to get to, 76th and Marines are now digging in, S300 or S400 is deployed. Admiral West, (who is quite a funny after dinner speaker, lost a ship in the Falklands) says Black Sea Fleet not that good. But I guess as it would only be possible to enter the Black Sea via Istanbul, you only need a couple of subs and anti ship missile to turn it into Russia's lake.

I hear Armour is massing North of Ukraine under the guise of exercises. They will switch off the gas on monday, tanks roll later in the week, I suspect working towards the Capital, to cut the head of the beast, just like the yanks did in Iraq (remember the military invasion was a sweeping success; the peace was of course a disaster).

As for NATO, I guess mobilisations and combat exercises in Germany? Not much stuff left there, most moved back to the states after Desert Storm. Brits have a few tanks and a the Germans a few, but not sure if combat effective. I would be worried in the EU/NATO countries bordering Ukraine, once again a buffer state. My over all conclusion invasion next week, straight to Kiev, arrest and try new government. As always with war in the East, it's all about supply lines, Russia is closer to the oil fields.

As I mentioned before, don't we have to ask the Russian's to kindly allow all our military kit back from Afghanistan through their territory to Riga?

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Ukraine ordered to conduct a call-up of reserves - theoretically all men up to 40 in a country. With universal male conscription, though Ukraine would struggle to find extra guns or uniforms for significant numbers of them. Link

Russia is coming, Russia is coming - what we are gonna do now. Panic all over Ukraine

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Estonia,Lithuania,Latvia,Poland,Czech,Hungary,Slovakia,Romania and Bulgaria ready to call up reservists. Kerry trying to claim the high moral ground and after the "wests" wars in Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan looking increasingly foolish.

Russia is digging in in Crimea and I guess waiting there moment, probably once the Ukrainian Ground troops and NATO show their hand.

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Estonia,Lithuania,Latvia,Poland,Czech,Hungary,Slovakia,Romania and Bulgaria ready to call up reservists.

Last time they train their reservists was about 25 years ago, most of them might be now retired.

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Crimea and south and east Ukraine to Russia, west Ukraine to the EU, job done. And while we're at it, Transnistria to Russia and Moldova to the EU via unification with Romania.

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http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-03-02/ukraine-capital-control-crunch-largest-bank-limits-cash-withdrawals-100-daily

As we warned on Friday, the military escalation in Ukraine has had dire consequences for the financial state of the country, its banks, and ultimately its people. The central bank promised to rescue domestic banks so long as they agreed to its complete control and it appears the first consequences of that "we are here to help you" promise is coming true:

UKRAINE'S PRIVATBANK LIMITS ATM WITHDRAWALS TO UAH1,000/DAY ($103/day)

Privatbank is Ukraine's largest bank and while claiming this move is temporary (just like Cyprus' capital controls), the bank has also ceased new loans amid what it calls "geopolitical instability". In summary, you can't have your money back! Expect long angry lines at Ukrainian banks on Monday morning (and at the pace of collapse in the Hyrvnia, hyperinflation next).

The banks fast running out of cash?

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All the trouble in the world is caused by Priests, Politicians and the Press.

This is absolutely nothing to do with us at all, despite the best efforts of the BBC.

Why are they trying to crank this up into a War.

Who benefits?

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All the trouble in the world is caused by Priests, Politicians and the Press.

This is absolutely nothing to do with us at all, despite the best efforts of the BBC.

Why are they trying to crank this up into a War.

Who benefits?

err....because its a distraction from the economic misery of the UK & most of Europe ?

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Kerry trying to claim the high moral ground and after the "wests" wars in Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan looking increasingly foolish.

Yeah, we can't really just push around and antagonise the Russians in their front garden (the Ukraine) like we could with insurgents and tin pot dictators against our better judgement (or put our might to a relatively good use like putting an end to the Libyan civil war).

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Personally I think what is happening in the Ukraine has been orchestrated by the US/UK/EU partly to throw a wildcard at Putin over Russian involvement in Syria, partly over Russian resuming Cold War military tactics over the past year.

In 2013 the Russian Airforce began a series of 'adventures' flying bombers and fighters off European coastlines, off the coast of Japan and even close the US. Their ships have been springing up in all sorts of places as well but I think it has been the Russian bombers and fighters, always resulting in NATO/US/Japanese, launches to intercept that has got the West riled.

Then, of course, there is Syria.

If Putin does not act strong in the Ukraine then he - who has presented himself as a strongman - looks weak in the eyes of the Russia people. If he acts tough, and sends his troops into the Ukraine, then he risks a bloody civil war on Russia border which could spill over into Russia itself.

It ia a bit similar to the problem that the Tsar faced in the early 20th Century - ignore Japanese and German threats and looks weak and risk his own position or act tough, lose militarily and also risk his own position.

The Crimea is undoubtedly Russian - it has been for a long, long time. Stalin only gifted to the Ukraine in the 1950s when, as far as he was concerned, the Ukraine was forever part of a never-ending Soviet Union.

The real problem is not the Crimea but the large parts of the Ukraine which are now full of Russians and who consider it their home. (Perhaps something that all countries who have massive influxes of alien populations need to think about?).

Don't forget, in WW2 there was effectively two Ukraines. The Ukraine who saw Nazi Germany as its sworn enemy and the Ukraine that saw Nazi Germany as its liberator from the evils of Soviet Communism. Ukrainians fought in vast numbers on both sides.

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I thought Crimea belonged to the Tatars, who hate Russia?

Well, yes.

I have found it interesting that there have been TV footage of Cossacks in Ukraine supporting the Russian line - anyone know how loved Cossacks are in Russia?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cossacks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_State

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