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Frank Hovis

You Are What You Do (Post Only For Men, No Girls Allowed To Read It)

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I found this gave me a bit of a think. Ok it slates something I think is a total waste - gaming - but by pointing out how wasteful certain other behaviours are (just how many times have I seen my favourite films, or Top Gear US Special) it underlines that looking down on others is not a great idea. I picked it up on MGTOW forum, though it comes from elsewhere, and what is surprising to me is the number of posters there, and apparently on the original forum, that very much do not agree with it. I agree with the great majority of it, the only real jarring note is about reading which I think is a plus.

Quick poll too.

I think this might have a lot of asterisks in it!

The reason this sub even exists shows how many men are lost today. We can blame feminism and a lot of things for this but I want to concentrate on three things. Video Games, Porn, and Sports. I believe these things are some of the biggest perpetrators to the pussification of the modern man.

Video Games: Fills the competitive need for men, giving false achievements. Made to be as addictive as possible. An escape from reality.

Porn/Masturbation: Drains men of their life force and sexual energy, which is one of the most powerful things we have. Why ****** real girls when you can cum any time you want to any fantasy you want? Im not about that nofap junk but many men could definitely cut down a bunch.

Sports: Playing sports is great, but sitting around watching them for multiple hours a day then watching the highlights and talk shows is pathetic to me. Watching sports also fills the competitive need for men, while they funnel potato chips down their guzzle. I believe they used sports in ancient Rome to occupy the masses. Its no different now.

Are all these things okay in light amounts? Sure. Nothing wrong with gaming once in a while. It should just be pretty low on your priorities. Many guys I know game all day long, and it's sad. They're wastes of life.

You need to get a handle on a your porn and masturbation habits also. Ideally you should be getting laid so this is a non issue but if you're not you need to limit fapping to around once a week imo. The extra horniness and testosterone will make you want to get out and get laid more too. Theres a big problem when many teenagers and men in their 20s are having erection issues. After watching hardcore group latex bukkakes with all 9s and 10s a normal woman just doesnt do it for you as much anymore I guess.

While sports seem to be all a lot of guys care about. They literally cant talk about anything else besides sports and maybe beer. Is this what masculinity has come to? Technology and entertainment has not been kind to men.

Instead of these things a man should get out of the ******ing house. Socialize. Hit the gym. Read books. Meditate. Pick up a new skill or trade. Learn to cook and eat better. Get creative and start writing or painting or making music instead of wasting hours leveling up your RPG character and jacking off. Set some damn goals.

Our habits are everything. (All successful men talk about habits, all of them. Habits are everything.) You will never improve until you change your habits and value your time. No more Netflix marathons or vegging out in front of the TV watching Seinfeld re-runs because you've seem them all 20 times already. This includes the internet and Reddit. Dont think you're improving just because you come on this sub. The internet is a great source of learning but it is also highly addictive.

"We are what we repeatedly do" - Aristotle

Top-rated response (also showing that a lot of blokes don't agree with it):

A lot of people are reacting negatively to this post because it requires admitting that entertainment and escapism are not investing in yourself. Or because they are strawmanning the OP and making it look like he said to avoid these things cold turkey. He didn't.

He's not saying you shouldn't pursue entertainment. He's pointing out that these common forms of escapism can trick your brain into thinking you're self-improving, a bad-ass, or are succeeding (when they aren't actually improving you).

Any video game that has linear progression of your character is a fake self-improvement based reward system. You feel good because "you" got better (aka your character). It's a fun drug, but it is a drug. Acknowledge it and just make sure you moderate it.

With Oculus Rift and rapidly improving VR, the addictiveness of living in and investing self-improvement time into an ultimately false life is only going to be more seductive and more widespread.

I'm not saying it's wrong or bad to invest in a fake life (whether it be an MMO of today or the VR-World-Sim 2032), but that's a choice you should make with self-perception of what you are doing, not one you should accidentally slip into (like so many good men have with games like WoW).

Porn is similar in that your brain thinks you're ******ing a supermodel. If you fap to a pornstar you don't have as much of the burning need to get laid IRL whether you realize it or not. Horniness is a weapon. Desperation is a weapon. It's not as bad as with video games because with gaming you have that linear progression of your character that makes you feel accomplished (a false, fake accomplishment that isn't real), whereas with porn it's usually not fooling you into feeling like you've accomplished something. But it's sating the hunger that makes men what they are with a false meal.

If the Red Pill is about unplugging from the Matrix, then this post is the ultimate TRP post. Video games, porn, and sports are escapism. Opiates for the masses. If you do them a little, sure they're fine. But the problem is that every hour you spend on escapism is an hour you could have been lifting, learning a new language, making money or building a business, networking, building your social network, or amassing power. It's totally cool for you spend most of your free time for a decade having fun and pursuing escapism, but OP wants you to realize that if you had spent an extra hour every day improving yourself instead of watching another episode on Netflix, after ten years you'd have spent 3600 hours becoming a badass.

If you are not a highly ambitious person or have simple goals, then by all means watch Anime, play three hours of an MMO a night, watch every NFL game, or whatever else. Just as long as you are able to acknowledge the opportunity cost of your time and recognize escapism for what it is. There's truly a different balance between escapism and self-investment for everyone and moderation is key - it's not healthy to be at either extreme.

But which problem is more common for men today? Engaging in masturabatory pleasures too much or overworking oneself and self-investing too much?

Ambition and self-discipline are at the essence of what it means to be a man. There are two things in common between the most respected human beings in history: discipline/hard work/time investment and genius. And you can only control how hard you work not how much genius or talent you naturally have.

I've been thinking a lot about escapism lately. Storytelling, drama, and theater was the first form of human escapism. Then books. Then radio. Then television. Then gaming. Now VR is going to be the ultimate form of escapism - it may very well eventually become better than the real thing (though that will only be possible if we're able to directly connect to the brain).

Each new form of escapism takes up more and more of your time and is more and more seductive. How many fewer Leonardo Da Vinci's and Sir Isaac Newtons' do we have just because the dude is sitting on his couch watching Netflix instead today?

No, I don't knwo what "Oculus Rift" is either.

http://www.mgtowforums.com/forums/mgtow-general-discussion/21605-video-games-porn-masturbation-watching-sports-downfall-modern-man.html

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I don't play computer games, and watch few sports! I read a book once, and am still thinking about it! :blink:

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I personally agree with it - but I think the human population has always had a mixture of go-getters and drifters - as well as a spectrum in between. A small number at either spectrum become addicted to the pleasure of work, or distraction accordingly.

I suspect technology, sports and beer is all most men have been able to talk about for thousands of years.

Perhaps it's not a bad thing.

After all, if progress looks like a million hipsters in cafes, eeking out an expresso so they can use the free wifi on their macbooks while trying to sell you their latest app or online training in woo - then perhaps it might be better if they stayed playing games.

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I don't play computer games, and watch few sports! I read a book once, and am still thinking about it! :blink:

Very good Mr P, but it's about what you actually do rather than don't do. So it's not saying stop playing RPG games all weekend and just sit there, rather that the effort that you are exerting doing that is entirely wasted and actually stops you achieving other things because your time and energy has gone on this.

Watching sports on telly is a good example. I'll be doing this for the World Cup but I know somebody (friend's dad) for whom this is his life; his wife goes on holidays by herself.

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I personally agree with it - but I think the human population has always had a mixture of go-getters and drifters - as well as a spectrum in between. A small number at either spectrum become addicted to the pleasure of work, or distraction accordingly.

Perhaps it's not a bad thing.

After all, if progress looks like a million hipsters in cafes, eeking out an expresso so they can use the free wifi on their macbooks while trying to sell you their latest app or online training in woo - then perhaps it might be better if they stayed playing games.

Yes, I can see that. Sort of on a par with cannabis use, I'm fine for it being legal and everybody else doing it as it gives me an advantage in that I don't touch the stuff.

The same of course applies to alcohol for which I have been very much part of the plebs sordida myself, here's hoping the New Year's resolution succeeds.

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Yes, I can see that. Sort of on a par with cannabis use, I'm fine for it being legal and everybody else doing it as it gives me an advantage in that I don't touch the stuff.

The same of course applies to alcohol for which I have been very much part of the plebs sordida myself, here's hoping the New Year's resolution succeeds.

Being a girl, I wasn't going to post. But I couldn't resist this, FH. You're hoping your NY Resolution succeeds. Don't just hope. Get some grit and MAKE it happen.

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Being a girl, I wasn't going to post. But I couldn't resist this, FH. You're hoping your NY Resolution succeeds. Don't just hope. Get some grit and MAKE it happen.

Cor dear me, isn't she bossy! ;):P

Thanks :)

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Yes, I can see that. Sort of on a par with cannabis use, I'm fine for it being legal and everybody else doing it as it gives me an advantage in that I don't touch the stuff.

The same of course applies to alcohol for which I have been very much part of the plebs sordida myself, here's hoping the New Year's resolution succeeds.

Exactly.

From an evolution standpoint, drifter and go-getter strategies probably work well enough.

After all, being a cannabis user might mean you get to make out with that cute hippy chick before the strait laced entrepreneurial type does. And beer goggles have probably allowed even some of the most marginal representative of both genders to reproduce.

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Back in the early years of the modern world of the 60's, we had common experiences...Danger Man, The Man from UNCLE, Morcambe and Wise.

Today, it is just about impossible to relate to your neighbours as they are 99% likely to have watched something else...you therefore have to find some other commonality just to relate to people...

Millions play WOW and other games, and yes, you do begin to live your characters...the Brain doesnt know the difference between reality and virtuality, so yes, building up your level and accumulating GOLD, and today Bitcoins et al is a reflection on your SELF perceived wealth and value in a World that doesnt actually give a damn.

Add in a keen sense of ENTITLEMENT, and we see a degeneration of actual value of people compared to what they are think they are actually worth.

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This book has an interesting - and completely opposite - take on the same issue

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everything_Bad_Is_Good_for_You

His basic theory is that computer games and TV are developmental rather than a waste of time.

For me a lot of this is difficult to judge. This morning I read the first chapter of Great Expectations. Was that any better or developmental for me than playing GTA? A lot of people would say so, but when Great Expectations was published a lot of people would have said that reading that was a waste of time and you should be reading the bible instead.

What disappoints me is how computer games haven`t been exploited to any meaningful degree as educational tools. The potential for language learning is vast, imagine a totally immersive adventure game set in a foreign country where you need to develop language skills to progress in the game. The technology is so close that it`s killing me that we don`t have this yet.

The best imagination of the potential I`ve seen was in the novel The Diamond Age (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Diamond_Age) Where an interactive educational tool called "A Young Lady`s Illustrated Primer" is described. It`s explained better than I can explain it in this blog http://proto-knowledge.blogspot.co.uk/2011/11/building-young-ladys-illustrated-primer.html

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1388906977[/url]' post='1102443205']

I found this gave me a bit of a think. Ok it slates something I think is a total waste - gaming - but by pointing out how wasteful certain other behaviours are (just how many times have I seen my favourite films, or Top Gear US Special) it underlines that looking down on others is not a great idea. I picked it up on MGTOW forum, though it comes from elsewhere, and what is surprising to me is the number of posters there, and apparently on the original forum, that very much do not agree with it. I agree with the great majority of it, the only real jarring note is about reading which I think is a plus.

Quick poll too.

I think this might have a lot of asterisks in it!

Top-rated response (also showing that a lot of blokes don't agree with it):

No, I don't knwo what "Oculus Rift" is either.

http://www.mgtowforu...modern-man.html

Despite being a girl I know what this is (sadly) as I ordered one for Christmas at my eldest sons request. As it wasn't going to reach us in time I cancelled.

My lot, including Mr B, spend far too much time gaming and it bothers me. If I say anything I shall no doubt be accused of being a nag.That is all.

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This book has an interesting - and completely opposite - take on the same issue

http://en.wikipedia....Is_Good_for_You

His basic theory is that computer games and TV are developmental rather than a waste of time.

For me a lot of this is difficult to judge. This morning I read the first chapter of Great Expectations. Was that any better or developmental for me than playing GTA? A lot of people would say so, but when Great Expectations was published a lot of people would have said that reading that was a waste of time and you should be reading the bible instead.

What disappoints me is how computer games haven`t been exploited to any meaningful degree as educational tools. The potential for language learning is vast, imagine a totally immersive adventure game set in a foreign country where you need to develop language skills to progress in the game. The technology is so close that it`s killing me that we don`t have this yet.

The best imagination of the potential I`ve seen was in the novel The Diamond Age (http://en.wikipedia....The_Diamond_Age) Where an interactive educational tool called "A Young Lady`s Illustrated Primer" is described. It`s explained better than I can explain it in this blog http://proto-knowled...ted-primer.html

Ah yes...all this leads to the "knowledge economy"....one where you just get rich by knowing stuff...or, more likely, keeping stuff from people who need it and charging them their last shirt for the privilege of having you do it for them.

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I'm sure if WOW had the tax man in it stealing your gold at every opportunity, and you had to go down a mine for 9 hours every day before you could do anything interesting then it's popularity would wane. Same with porn. If before you could watch the 'best bits' you had to listen to 8 hours of life story drivel, and then look a different sofas for 4 hours porn wouldn't be such a problem. ;)

I think the world has got to realise if people don't get some reward for doing something..... then they won't do it!

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Ah yes...all this leads to the "knowledge economy"....one where you just get rich by knowing stuff...or, more likely, keeping stuff from people who need it and charging them their last shirt for the privilege of having you do it for them.

I`m hoping for a more free flow of information, but people will try that for sure. We`ve just got to not let them :)

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Despite being a girl I know what this is (sadly) as I ordered one for Christmas at my eldest sons request. As it wasn't going to reach us in time I cancelled.

My lot, including Mr B, spend far too much time gaming and it bothers me. If I say anything I shall no doubt be accused of being a nag.That is all.

Ha ha! The world of "men"! Games are a bit of a "Marmite" thing I believe! If I had all the time in the world I would be in my shed, making things that don't work, not work even better! ;)

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The reason men channel surf on TV`s is because they want to find new horizons..we are always looking and never settled...women are content to sit and watch Coronation Street....my mind is always wandering to the other side of the world.

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Isn't the quoted OP basically saying that men should improve themselves solely for the benefit of women? What's the point of that? Maybe women should stop having their nails done, stop going to the shops, stop gossiping, stop drama, etc, etc, etc and invest their energy pleasing men? I'd say the OP is arguing for even more 'p ussification' of men. He's saying the only way to judge the value of a man is to judge him by the criteria women use and how useful they are to women.

In reality what both sexes should do is exactly what they want to do. If a bloke wants to play games and with himself all weekend good for him, if a woman wants to shop, drink coffee and have her hair done fair play to her.

The reality is that the majority of people are not going to make a significant contribution to society whatever they are doing so they may as well just enjoy themselves.

P.S. An Oculus Rift is a VR headset. Not out yet, recently funded through Kickstarter.

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The reason men channel surf on TV`s is because they want to find new horizons..we are always looking and never settled...women are content to sit and watch Coronation Street....my mind is always wandering to the other side of the world.

Do you honestly think that the women on here are the type to sit down and watch Coronation Street?

The people who watch soaps are all on Digital Spy discussing celebrities.

Edit for winkie: yes, I know that celebrities are just other people.

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Do you honestly think that the women on here are the type to sit down and watch Coronation Street?

The people who watch soaps are all on Digital Spy discussing celebrities.

Edit for winkie: yes, I know that celebrities are just other people.

All types here Frank! Just not many members of the "general public"! ;)

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I think the OP is absolutley correct; porn/video games/sports are not 'real' but they keep the masses occupied.

Same goes for alcohol in my opinion. And much of the internet.

The Occulus Rift that is referred to earlier is a Virtual Reality headset currently being developed which knocks the socks off any previous attempts at virtual reality; so games will become far more immersive; you'll get plenty of people just 'living' in the virtual world and only getting up to eat and crap.

I recently turned 30, and I spent most of my 20's either jacking off to porn, or posting on various internet boards arguing about things on the that in retrospect didn't really matter. I've also done the whole 'workaholic' thing too. These activities distracted me from my lonliness but I don't think they are a subsititute to finding and connecting with real people. I've done alot of thinking over the last few years and I've seen how much time I and my family/friends waste.

Of course a valid question would be 'if a fake life is better than real life, why not just drop out of reality and embrace it?'. I think we're only fooling ourselves to an extent - I don't think the virtual world really meets our needs. I know a couple of guys who are big into their role playing games, and rarely mix with 'real' people - both moribdly obese and drugged up to the eyeballs on antidepressants. They are not happy, which is why they need the antidepressants. If the virtual world was really meeting their needs in the way that living a full life and trying to be as physically healthy as possible does, then I doubt they'd need anti-depressants.

In fact, I think the virtual world, as well as the ease of access to junk food, is what has so many men depressed and on anti-depressants today. I say this as a person who has suffered with depression for my entire adult life.

Thankfully I've always thought that watching sports was ********.... football tops stretched over beer bellies, people referring to their farvouite team as 'we' (as if they had anything to do with their performance) so I've never wasted any time on that.

Another time waster that I think we should also be aware of is the especially British pastime of complaining about or mocking other people (I'm guilty of this and am consciously trying to reduce it). A perfect example of this is Have I Got News for You - the plebs sit in their thousands and get to laugh and/or be angry at people who are richer, more successful, and lead more interesting lives than they ever will; who exactly is getting the last laugh there?

I was home over christmas and my parents were watching Have I Got News for You, and my father went on a rant mocking Boris Johnson because Boris had failed some IQ test. My Dad was feeling good about himself by mocking Boris Johnson. Boris Johnson is rich and successful journalist, televison personality, and is the mayor of London. I think Boris is getting the last laugh, and the HIGNFY viewers are....mindless plebs who need to work out what they actually want to do with their lives, other than mock more successful people.

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The problem with all this, is the flawed value judgements being applied.

Whose to say being rich and successful in one's career is any better than Level 10?

You get speaking to two people down the pub.

One tells you about how they have, after ten years' solid gameplay, the most powerful wizard in World of Orcs.

The other talks about their cycling club, how they built their own shed, and the classic car that they keep on the road themself.

Which one would you like to have another pint with next week?

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Good thoughtful post Joe; I don't know gamers but am aware of some and have never bothered to chat to them.

You're spot on with the HIGNFY comments, I can't stand it nor Mock the Week or The News Quiz (these days, it was so much nicer when Richard Ingrams and Alan Coren were on it).

Bitter people like Marcus Brigstock, Jeremy Hardy and Ian Hislop being the playground bully with a microphone for the braying hordes.

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