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timebandit

This Is Our Moment-Tim Aker Ukip Policy Guru

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Following on from this HPC thread & JD reminding me on Twitter.

I received a direct mail from Tim Aker (Head of @UKIP Policy Unit. Prospective #UKIP MEP for Eastern England).

Tim Aker Email me ***@ukip.org re housing policy - what's wrong with it and what should be done.

This could be an ideal opportunity on this forum to bullet point housing (economic) problems & solutions.

I understand we have been 'screwed over' by the Government (all parties), but can we keep it polite & brief (not like my usual rants) as I will provide Tim Aker a link to this thread, who has taken time out to address our issues.

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There is nothing that can be done, this has to run its course now. The UK IS the housing market. The end will be a thing of beauty.

Edited by Giraffe

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The predation of young ftbs wishing to buy homes and start families by older (average age 51) b2l brigade.now the cost of living is so high, it acts as a brake on fertility rates which seems to be the prime reason for so much e.u immigration. Those pensioners need taxpayers somehow.

The refusal to build housing developments due to land bank hoarding/speculating, planning laws for an age long gone, nimbys and bananas everywhere need to be confronted and not appeased.

Social housing? If only to curb housing benefit and landllordism.

These all need addressing too as we'll as the easy credit bubble machine banking industry backed by the state.

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In my view, the central point to impress is the nature and urgency of the current housing crisis. I know UKIP are keen to limit immigration as a solution to addressing future pressures on local services and housing etc, but we start from a position of a decade of underinvestment in new build housing. We are something like a million homes short right now. The current cost of housing in the UK is, on average, absurd when viewed against local wages. Any UKIP policy on this issue has to address this in a straightforward manner imo. They will win few votes by cooking up schemes to prop up prices/suppress interest rates in the manner that the current Government are doing.

Housing costs feed into our competitiveness as a nation. Higher housing costs = more mortage interest = higher wages required.

The hardest part of UKIP formulating their housing policy is that many of the party will see limiting immigration as the complete solution, whereas it only deals with the future part and not the legacy problems of the previous 3 terms of Government at least.

1 million extra homes equates to an increase in total number of houses of under 4%. Will the character of towns and villages be irreversibly damaged by increasing the number of dwellings by this amount? Of course not.

Post war Governments used to try and build hundreds of thousands of homes per annum, when we had a much smaller population. Unfortunately the political worthiness of this activity has been lost in a mire of nimbyism and the idea that hoarding houses for BTL purposes is some sort of socially worthy activity.

This post is a bit of a ramble, apologies.

PS On the renting side there is much to do- offer much longer term contracts with more security to boot. The boil of housing benefit hoarding and rents tied to local rates needs lanced to boot. Many large scale landlords who rely on benefit claimant tenants are scooping it in, and the rates paid affect rents for private individuals renting in the same area. The £24Bn housing benefit bill is ripe for slashing, and few tears will be shed for house hoarding landlords. They simply have no option but to take reduced rents as there are not enought tenants to go around.

Edited by The B.L.T.

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They need to challenge the word affordable.

If fuel poverty was defined as 10% or more of your income going on energy then what should the definition of housing poverty be?

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UKIP.... Will get nowhere until they get rid of that odious Farage and the other xenophobic twits he surrounds himself with.

That's exactly why people WILL vote for him.

I've predicted for a couple of years now we will see the rise of right wing parties across Europe. Nothing i've seen lately has changed my opinion. It's a scary thought.

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Very tough challenge.

The UK electorate is heavily addicted to the ponzi scheme,

My thoughts: ..... but it will take Churchillian type courage.

  • Step 1: Close the UK borders to prevent greater demand for housing.
  • Step 2: Limit imported products to only those countries with similar human rights, employment rights, and environmental protection laws, in order to allow British co's to compete on a level playing field.
  • Step 3: Instruct banks to redirect lending to small and medium businesses, and away from the housing bubble.
  • Step 4: Raise taxes on BuyToLet, 2nd home owners, 3rd home owners, and holiday home owners. Discouraging more, and encouraging them to sell.
  • Step 5: Let the housing crash begin, and try to mitigate it's worse effects with cheap council pre-fabs on temporary greenfield sites for repossessed families.
  • Step 6: Raise interest rates to try to stabilize the pound. Although it may be too late to save it now, in which case, an emergency/temporary currency will be needed. Plus rationing to prevent hoarding.
  • Step 7: Cancel all government contracts for HS2, foreign aid, and quangos which are only propping up the elite.
  • Step 8: Begin a large scale house building programme, employing millions of BRITISH only workers.
  • Step 9: Exit the EU, and hope that they don't kick off World War 3 as the euro collapses.
Edited by SleepyDog

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Too much emphasis is put by The Powers That Be on generating wealth through property price rises. While this may create a sugar-rush feeling of financial well-being that trickles into the economy, it is in fact no substitute for economic growth achieved through developing industry, allowing enterprises and businesses to flourish etc. In reality, house price rises above that of wage growth does not create any new wealth - it merely transfers it from the mostly younger housing have-nots to the mostly older housing haves. That option has been pushed and pushed to the limit - it is a cul-de-sac for economic growth, not a highway.

Too much economic policy is geared towards supporting and growing asset prices, to maintain the sugar-rush. As more and more people's wealth is concentrated in bricks and mortar, there is less to be spent in the wider economy. As prices rise, banks also lend an increasing amount of their funds to property purchases, crowding out loan requests from businesses that actually generate more jobs and wealth.

Public opinion in the 90s was against joining the Euro because it meant surrendering control of the national interest rate. However, the same has happened without joining the Euro - the ridiculous amount of loose credit that was handed out during the boom has resulted in interest rates frozen at 0.5%, even though persistent inflation suggests they need to be higher and pension returns have collapsed as a result.

I could go on and on here...

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Following on from this HPC thread & JD reminding me on Twitter.

I received a direct mail from Tim Aker (Head of @UKIP Policy Unit. Prospective #UKIP MEP for Eastern England).

This could be an ideal opportunity on this forum to bullet point housing (economic) problems & solutions.

I understand we have been 'screwed over' by the Government (all parties), but can we keep it polite & brief (not like my usual rants) as I will provide Tim Aker a link to this thread, who has taken time out to address our issues.

Problem: The housing market is prohibitively expensive for new entrants.

Issue with current policy: The past two governments have tried to address housing cost by making it easier to get into dangerously high levels of debt rather than face the underlying issue.

Solution: Make housing "actually affordable" (I almost didn't want to use the word affordable, seems to have become a bit of a weasel word the past few years).

Benefits of solving problem: People cease to be reliant on landlords/the state for housing needs and as others have pointed out, it increases our competitiveness by reducing the cost of living/the benefits bill.

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Housing costs feed into our competitiveness as a nation. Higher housing costs = more mortage interest = higher wages required.

Unfortunately, that's the optimistic view. The pessimistic view, and the one I might better agree with, is that our competitiveness is reduced due to the presence of a growing proportion (especially at the younger end of the workforce) for whom hard work simply doesn't pay. If you cannot through your own hard graft provide a decent living for yourself and the family that your increasingly less likely to have in the first place, you simply have no investment in society and no reason to graft away for fifty years to someone else's benefit. A hidey-hole to escape to and sleep in between shifts is the most very basic necessity which one ought to expect to be able to provide oneself.

Even if you're a right-wing elitist rent-skimmer, the plebs need a reason to work effectively for your benefit. People aren't going to form themselves into pointlessly-toiling "hard-working families" simply out of some sense of moral fanaticism.

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Didnt know him personally, but Tim Aker used to be a dried-in-the-wool conservative back in my uni days.

Anyway, I find it slightly worrying though that a party that calls itself 'libertarian' really needs to ask these questions.

Surely the answer is get rid of restrictions (namely planning permissions) and state subsidies (involvement in the mortgage market and housing benefit). Libertarian should just mean get government out the way. Its not difficult, is it?

However, given the oh-so-libertarian Farage has a vendetta against windfarms because 'theyre ugly' I dont have much faith in them to reform any part of the planning system in a libertarian direction...quite the opposite. UKIP should just stick at getting us out of the EU for the time being.

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Unfortunately, that's the optimistic view. The pessimistic view, and the one I might better agree with, is that our competitiveness is reduced due to the presence of a growing proportion (especially at the younger end of the workforce) for whom hard work simply doesn't pay. If you cannot through your own hard graft provide a decent living for yourself and the family that your increasingly less likely to have in the first place, you simply have no investment in society and no reason to graft away for fifty years to someone else's benefit. A hidey-hole to escape to and sleep in between shifts is the most very basic necessity which one ought to expect to be able to provide oneself.

Even if you're a right-wing elitist rent-skimmer, the plebs need a reason to work effectively for your benefit. People aren't going to form themselves into pointlessly-toiling "hard-working families" simply out of some sense of moral fanaticism.

That's more or less what I meant.

I should have been clearer tht since wages have not matched housing/living costs over the last 15 years, our competitveness is severly eroded for the reasons you mention.

e.g. my household income is well into the ninth decile, yet a three bed semi in a non-scruffy part of my provincial town home is likely to come with an asking price of at least 4 times gross income, and for one that needs no updating or work it could be close to 6 times. Crazy imo. I'm not paying someone that sort of money for the sort of house that would have been the preserve of ordinary lower-middle earners not so long ago. No chance.

edit clarity.

Edited by The B.L.T.

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High housing costs = high wage demands = uncompetitive country

Without wage inflation the rest of the economy will suffer (no disposable income)

With higher wages the country becomes uncompetitive in a global economy also (see ROI they all become rich selling houses to each other @ ever increased prices)

No it`s not catch 22 we need CHEAPER housing and more of them

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A link sent to Tim Aker

Thank you for the replies agree with the sentiment.

Stop interfering in the markets.

Punative tax for amateur BTL, 2nd homers, empty properties

A tenancy (favoured) agreement may be concluded for a ‘limited’ or ‘unlimited’ period.

Stop HS2 funding diverted to new local infrastructure including transport links & housing

Huge increase of local cooperative self build rent & ownership

Nimbys' children banned from owning or renting property of their own.(too far :D )

Introduce LVT to pay for the removal of business rates & council tax

Advise Patrick O'flynn Daily Express columnist & UKIP candidate of the damaging headlines 'house prices soar' crap.

Have no wish to derail my own topic, but found this interesting and sleepydog may be worth a thread of its own?

Step 6: Raise interest rates to try to stabilize the pound. Although it may be too late to save it now, in which case, an emergency/temporary currency will be needed. Plus rationing to prevent hoarding.

Would that ever happen in the UK?

Edited by timebandit

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No it`s not catch 22 we need CHEAPER housing and more of them

We probably need different types of housing.

If building one bedroom flats doesn't make financial sense, then does building bigger proeprties designed for sharers make more sense?

There's a chronic shortage of many types of housing - specifically for

- older people who don't want big gardens and stairs and don't want to live in a huge block of flats

- young people leaving home for the first time

- families who need a bit more room inside and out

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Following on from this HPC thread & JD reminding me on Twitter.

I received a direct mail from Tim Aker (Head of @UKIP Policy Unit. Prospective #UKIP MEP for Eastern England).

This could be an ideal opportunity on this forum to bullet point housing (economic) problems & solutions.

I understand we have been 'screwed over' by the Government (all parties), but can we keep it polite & brief (not like my usual rants) as I will provide Tim Aker a link to this thread, who has taken time out to address our issues.

year 1) Scrap HS2 and spend the money on new council houses, revoke the right to buy on these houses.

thereafter) Reduce housing benefit by 25% across the board and ring fence the money for building new council houses.

Liberalise the planning system.

Direct the BoE to normalise interest rates (i.e. 3- 5% base rate).

Introduce charge limits on lending for domestic property e.g. a charge on the deeds of property held for loan security can only be placed on a maximum of say 85% of the property's value. Perhaps have a lower limit for BTLs. This would effectively cap LTVs. This could phased in gradually say 2% a year.

Remove interest tax relief on BLT mortgages.

Remove CGT allowance on all domestic property other than main residence.

Introduce annual level on domestic property held by non UK resided entities (i.e. individuals and corporations).

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A few that haven't been mentioned yet:

- increase minimum standards for new builds, not only for space but wall thicknesses, insulation, material quality etc.

- introduce a measure to stop land banking, be it a LVT or other.

- maintain a proper landlords register and make it illegal to let out a property without being on it.

- rent control, rent cannot be increased higher than inflation. At least this would force true inflation figures to be published.

To be honest though, all UKIP realistically have to do is get some airtime and show the facts. Cost of living increasing, public spending increasing, quality of service is lowering.

If you can get it to the public that things aren't rosy and really just kickstart some proper negativity for the decades of Labour and Tory rule and show that things if left unchanged are headed for absolute chaos and that whether we like it or not the country is headed for disaster then its win win.

People respect you for being a party that doesn't hide the truth and you show the other three for what they are.

If you get in power then great, you can't lose as you've prepared people for the worst.

If you don't get in then what's the issue, you've helped point the country in an important direction. That is the aim, right? To help the country? Or to get yourselves in power?

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A tenancy (favoured) agreement may be concluded for a ‘limited’ or ‘unlimited’ period.

Ah yes forgot about that one.

I would say that the best way to handle this is to require a license for any limited time letting over 1 month (in order to not unfairly punish holiday lets B&B and other "proper businesses") which would cost a % of the rental value every year.

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They need to challenge the word affordable.

If fuel poverty was defined as 10% or more of your income going on energy then what should the definition of housing poverty be?

+1

The main problem is highlighted by the fact that our political classes can use this term and get away with it.

We aren't going to see a wave of new building unless radical measures are take to reduce the costs of housing.

The reason we aren't all driving around in Rolls Royces is that there too expensive for the majority, even if they produced millions a year we still wouldn't, its the price that is too great.

We're stuck in rut till the nation accepts that.

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That's more or less what I meant.

I should have been clearer tht since wages have not matched housing/living costs over the last 15 years, our competitveness is severly eroded for the reasons you mention.

e.g. my household income is well into the ninth decile, yet a three bed semi in a non-scruffy part of my provincial town home is likely to come with an asking price of at least 4 times gross income, and for one that needs no updating or work it could be close to 6 times. Crazy imo. I'm not paying someone that sort of money for the sort of house that would have been the preserve of ordinary lower-middle earners not so long ago. No chance.

edit clarity.

You fool. Its never coming back (to us).

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