A Home By The Sea

[anonguest]

Here's my shoreline management scheme:

1) Rename 'Shingle Street' to 'Rockpool Way'

2) Replace 'Give Way' sign with 'Bail'

Not sure who's the stupidest - people buying those Shingle Street houses, or the banks giving them mortgages - assuming they have a mortgage.

I wouldn't like to have underwritten the indemnity insurance on the the surveyor.

I haven't enjoyed so much Schadenfreude in ages, from reading this thread - and the mind still boggling at how any sane individual would part with such huge sums of money as some of these people have to live right on the edge of the ever inland encroaching North Sea. What can i say? My heart bleeds for these people - NOT!

[anonguest]

Don't laugh. Your compulsory insurance levy is subsidising their choices.

Why isn't there a 'Screaming and Pulling Out Ones Own Hair' emoticon when you want one. :-(

Edited December 13, 2013 by anonguest

[happy_renting]

It has been obvious, for centuries, that erosion would swallow the land these properties stand on. Most of Dunwich itself disappeared in huge storms in the 13th century onwards, for example.

All these properties date from a time when the erosion would have been known about and observable.

Anyone building or buying these properties, unless insane, would have factored in the risk when doing so, and acquired the property at a discount that reflected the risk and anticipated shortened lifespan.

These people do not need nor deserve financial help; they have already had the benefits of getting the property cheap in the first place, unless they were incredibly stupid when buying.

Edited December 13, 2013 by happy_renting

[snowflux]

Total con. The problems are down to East Anglia being soil dumped from the glaciers melting, and so very prone to erosion, and the SE sinking as the north rebounds from the weight of ice.

Still, if we can raise another spurious tax and control people's lives even further let's blame carbon emissions eh?

It's a simple fact that the average global sea level is rising by about 3 mm per year, in addition to any localised effects. This is bound to exacerbate coastal erosion.

Edit: The rate at which the south east is sinking is no more than about 0.5 mm per year, so the effect of glacial rebound is relatively small compared to the rise in sea level resulting from global warming. No need to let the actual data influence your personal convictions though, eh Frank?

Edited December 13, 2013 by snowflux

[The Knimbies who say No]

Another update on the recent east coast storm surge, illustrating the damage that has been done to natural coastal defences.

The picture below is of Salthouse in Norfolk, a village which lies on the A149 coast road between Blakeney and Sheringham.

The village is separated from the sea by the Salthouse Marshes which are owned by the Norfolk Wildlife Trust (NWT). These in turn are protected by a high shingle bank on the beach.

Over time it is expected that the shingle bank will slowly flatten and the marshes will increasingly be inundated, but this process is thought likely to occur over many years (perhaps several decades).

Here's a picture which was taken from Salthouse Heath looking towards the sea. The car park is at the top right of the landscape and you can get some idea of the scale of the shingle bank.

The next photos were taken during the period of the surge (on 6th December I believe), showing just how high the seas were at that time.

This is what the area looked like in the aftermath of the surge, with a major breach in the bank. Notably large amounts of shingle have been washed inland.

The NWT is urging the Environment Agency to repair the breach ASAP in order to minimise damage to the nature reserve, but whether any attempt will be made to restore the height of the shingle bank remains to be seen.

[Continued in next post]

Wowsers, incredible pictures in your posts. Hard to see how any reasonably-priced attempt to restrain the erosion could be successful.

[motch]

It has been obvious, for centuries, that erosion would swallow the land these properties stand on. Most of Dunwich itself disappeared in huge storms in the 13th century onwards, for example.

All these properties date from a time when the erosion would have been known about and observable.

Anyone building or buying these properties, unless insane, would have factored in the risk when doing so, and acquired the property at a discount that reflected the risk and anticipated shortened lifespan.

These people do not need nor deserve financial help; they have already had the benefits of getting the property cheap in the first place, unless they were incredibly stupid when buying.

http://www.rightmove...y-39929287.html

£500k for a small terrace house, 75 sqm and 20 metres from the sea, in that sort of area... it does at least have a sea wall though. I could probably find some better examples of 80 sqm semi's for similar prices though with no walls or near cliffs prone to errosion.

Council tax fo this small pad? D

edit: this one sold £825k july 2013, a little closer to the shingle... http://www.rightmove...country=england picture 14 tells it all.

Edited December 16, 2013 by motch

[FreeTrader]

The picture below gives some indication of the high water levels along the Kent estuary at Sandside, Cumbria today (close to Morecambe Bay).

The property concerned was up for sale when the Google street view imagery was taken in June 2009. It sold a month later for £245,000.

Edit:

An image search turned up this picture from 2006:

Edited January 3, 2014 by FreeTrader

[Democorruptcy]

Not really relevant to the thread because it's Lahinch, County Clare. Nice picture though and I've brought the thread back up while the UK is having storms....

http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/gP.c3isHvsMfNB.9uidSAg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD05OTU7cT03OTt3PTE1MDA-/http://l.yimg.com/os/publish-images/news/2014-01-06/64eac85f-f683-40ae-9d4b-b28a779bcc35_uk-storm10-060114.JPG

Edited January 6, 2014 by Democorruptcy

[winkie]

Not really relevant to the thread because it's Lahinch, County Clare. Nice picture though and I've brought the thread back up while the UK is having storms....

http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/gP.c3isHvsMfNB.9uidSAg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD05OTU7cT03OTt3PTE1MDA-/http://l.yimg.com/os/publish-images/news/2014-01-06/64eac85f-f683-40ae-9d4b-b28a779bcc35_uk-storm10-060114.JPG

Great picture.....just puts into perspective that none of us has any chance against the forces of nature.

[FreeTrader]

Not really relevant to the thread because it's Lahinch, County Clare. Nice picture though and I've brought the thread back up while the UK is having storms....

Thanks for posting Democorruptcy.

There's been some terrific (and humbling) photography of the Atlantic storms over the past few days.

Aberystwyth:

Ardrossan:

Porthcawl:

(continued)

[FreeTrader]

Porthcothan Bay:

Porthleven:

Portreath:

[long time lurking]

Lahinch above Newgale below

[FreeTrader]

Lahinch above Newgale below

Thanks for those, long time lurking.

I have another one of Newgale saved from yesterday. I have my doubts about the longevity of those seafront properties.

[long time lurking]

They have had it worse this is 1989

There use to be a photo in that pub of the day this happend with a wave going over the roof I dread to think what the insurance cost on the place

Edited January 7, 2014 by long time lurking

[Dorkins]

I guess UKIP would probably not be in favour of this:

[SarahBell]

Thanks for adding the photos!

[Democorruptcy]

For some reason this thread came to mind.... might be of interest to anyone who watches the BBC's Ripper Street.

Inspector Reid was a real person and after retiring from the force (oopppss he won't get killed or sacked in any future episodes) he bought a house he had to leave due to coastal erosion!

In 1903 Reid moved into No. 4, Eddington Gardens at Hampton-on-Sea. He named his house Reid's Ranch, painted castellations and cannon on its side and soon became known as the eccentric champion of the Hampton-on-Sea residents, all of whom faced losing their properties due to sea erosion. His house contained a parrot and many photographs of his London cases. His garden contained a cannonball found on his property, a post from the end of the old pier and a flagpole with a union flag. From a wooden kiosk in his garden named the Hampton-on-Sea Hotel he sold soft drinks and postcards featuring himself photographed by Fred C. Palmer.

The sea flowed very close to his property, and in 1915 he was the last remaining resident of Eddington Gardens and of Hampton-on-Sea. He abandoned his house in 1916 due to sea erosion

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmund_Reid

Stumbled on that after watching an episode that had the Elephant Man in it that was true to life. The doctor in the episode was also a real person and the circumstances of a death were correct.

[FreeTrader]

I'm wondering what effect the recent storms may have had on Horse Cove House, the cliff top property at Dawlish that has featured a couple of times on this site over the years.

It was originally given planning permission in 2005 and was nearing completion in early 2007 when a sizeable chunk of the garden was lost in a major landslip (BBC article, Daily Mail article).

Despite the cliff collapse the owner, local businessman Nick Skilton, said he was not in the least worried about the risk to his home. And local estate agent Paul Ranger had this to say about the potential of a 100% loss:

"That stretch of coastline offers stunning sea views. With that viewpoint comes a certain amount of risk which is often part and parcel of the chance you take. But as long as your house doesn't topple in, most people consider it a small price to pay."

Despite his declared lack of concern Mr Skilton subsequently put the property up for sale and presumably the purchasers were following Mr Ranger's philosophy when they paid £1.8 million for the home in October 2009.

The agent's classy brochure is no longer available online, but I have a copy on my hard drive and it's easy to see the allure (although I think they went more than a little OTT with the saturation adjustments in Photoshop):

Then in February 2011 disaster struck for a second time. Another landslide took away even more of the garden and the house made national headlines once more (Daily Mail article, HPC thread).

Since then a planning application has been put in for engineering works to stabilise the cliff face, but I'm not sure whether anything was implemented before the recent storms (and I can't see what engineering solutions could possibly combat such wave energy anyway, although I'm not really qualified to comment).

Whatever the current situation, I don't think I could sleep easily in that particular property despite the wonderful vista.

[The Knimbies who say No]

I'm wondering what effect the recent storms may have had on Horse Cove House, the cliff top property at Dawlish that has featured a couple of times on this site over the years.

[...snip...]

Whatever the current situation, I don't think I could sleep easily in that particular property despite the wonderful vista.

Indeed. A news article recently refers to some steps adjoining the sea wall at Dawlish being damaged so it seems likely that the cliff at Horse Cove would be subject to pretty harsh conditions. It looks very precarious in 2011.

http://www.dawlishnewspapers.co.uk

Edited January 7, 2014 by The B.L.T.

[happy_renting]

Since then a planning application has been put in for engineering works to stabilise the cliff face, but I'm not sure whether anything was implemented before the recent storms (and I can't see what engineering solutions could possibly combat such wave energy anyway, although I'm not really qualified to comment).

Whatever the current situation, I don't think I could sleep easily in that particular property despite the wonderful vista.

Looks like a very soft sandstone to me, and look at the way the entire cliff is undercut, it is riddled with caves.

A foolish place to build; I am surprised it got PP but perhaps it's not the planners job to protect foolish builders from themselves.

They took the risk, I don't feel sorry for them if they lose the place, and I hope that no shoring-up is performed at taxpayer's expense.

But if they feel they got value for money from living for a short while on a beautiful spot, maybe they are content.

[FreeTrader]

Sales fear over flood hit property

Christmas and new year brought misery to thousands of people around the UK with widespread flooding and windstorm damage.

While we have seen some exceptional weather over recent years the scale and extent of the flooding this time round was at times unprecedented.

[...]

When the waters recede, property owners will face the unenviable task of clearing up the mess.

Some will be trying to put their lives back together without the aid of insurance as many people in areas prone to flooding are struggling to get cover at any premium - or find that even if they have a policy they are unable to claim.

What will happen to these properties in the future? If owners cannot get insurance cover can the properties ever be sold at anything other than a fraction of market value - if at all?

EAT thinks that the Government and the insurance industry must work together to deal with this crisis before it is too late.

Estate Agent Today

[FreeTrader]

Nearly 2,000 buildings have been flooded since storms began on 23 December according to government figures.

[...]

GAB Robins said 55% of the claims work it received from the storms on 5-9 December was for flood damage and 45% for storm damage.

But only 34% of the claims from the storms that began on 23 December have been for flood damage, with 66% from storm damage, said head of business development Ian Sutcliffe.

Flood claims for December are six times more expensive than storm claims as floods usually damage the entire ground floor of a building and claims are likely to include additional costs for alternative accommodation.

Many of the flood claims have been from tidal surges, which cost 25% more to repair than river flood damage because of the extra work of washing away the salt that can corrode electrical appliances.

Insurance Times

[The Knimbies who say No]

Piece in the Telegraph concerning comments from the Environment Agency suggesting that some parts of the UK which flooded recently may be left to the sea.

Parts of Britain which are still flooded after being swamped in last month’s tidal surge on the east coast could be abandoned to the sea forever.

Paul Leinster, chief executive of the Environment Agency which is in charge of protecting the coastline, said parts of east Anglia might not be reclaimed from the sea.

The Agency is now in talks with nature bodies about which areas should be left for wildlife to take over following the flooding. The news raises the prospect of Britain’s coastline being altered forever as a result of the surge.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/environment/10592746/Parts-of-Britain-to-be-abandoned-to-the-sea-after-December-tidal-surge.html

[FreeTrader]

Piece in the Telegraph concerning comments from the Environment Agency suggesting that some parts of the UK which flooded recently may be left to the sea.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/environment/10592746/Parts-of-Britain-to-be-abandoned-to-the-sea-after-December-tidal-surge.html

Thanks for the link.

One of the places mentioned is Salthouse, which I highlighted in post #50.

Another is Brancaster, and the longevity of the Royal West Norfolk golf course must now seriously be in doubt.

Here's a picture of Brancaster Staithe during the surge (lower photo, the upper one is from Google Earth 2010). The RWNGC clubhouse is at the top left.

At the left edge of the above picture you can see one of the houses that I showed in post #24 as being up for sale before the surge arrived. It has now been withdrawn from the market, but I'll keep an eye out for it on the LR sale lists.

Here are the pics again as a reminder:

[Frank Hovis]

Fascinating posts Freetrader. I wonder if you get a free pair of waders with the house for £2.6m?