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Market Definitely Picked Up Where I Live


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its like a bullsh1tter alert.

how come all thse 'bull' posters are new and turn up time and time again with the same sorry arguments we have been through a million times. dont you get bored with it ?

if you had any OPPOSITE opinion to this hot air you keep bleating out id be interested in it, but its always the same failed arguments and tall storys about insanley priced property suddenly 'flying off the shelves' when we all know that its not.

Maybe we don't spend as much time as you on this forum so we don't know that it's been said before. You posted 3400 times in 9 months, that's an average of 20 per working days. What do you do for a living ? do you actually work ?

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:lol::lol::lol:

Just shows how these people realise how important sentiment is that they will go to these lengths. Of course if they're working for an estate agent then they haven't got much else to do right now!

So this is how objective this forum is. When someone says: this guy reduced the price by 50% to sell, everyone would believe him without questionning but if you say things are picking up in your area, you're a liar or worse...an Estate Agent. Don't you think you guys are a bit too easy on the critics:

All of you said we had to wait for the LR valuesto see the fall cause all the others were wrong. They come out and they're up, so now, the LR are liars as well(seen on many posts).

Is not it too easy to treat everyone a liar as soon as they say something you don't want to hear.

I am not saying prices won't crash but they won't crash now. There is far too much at stake for everyone on this market and inflation can not recover any crash. I read an article recently http://www.moneyweek.com/article/1346/inve...using-boom.html

saying that the market will crash in 2008 and he explains why and I seriously believe him. It won't happen next year, that's for sure though, it may go up and down slightly as no market can remain flat, but it won't go strongly one way or the other until it can't be maintained.

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Right, undecided I will keep this short. I don't believe you and I think you are lying, for what reason I don't know and nor do I much care. Of course I might be wrong, in which case apologies, but I don't think so. Why do I think you are lying, well read on....

In the message you posted regarding renting and who was happy renting you posted the following:

All,

just a quick survey of the renting community that I'd like to understand.

yesterday I came back home after reading many stuff on this cite and told my partner: maybe we should sell as the market is likely to crash. What she answered is the following:

We have lived here for 5 years, we made this house look eactly like we wanted. When we come back from work and get in our house, it feels like home, it feels good and I feel proud about what we've achieved in it. If we'd been renting, we would have been in someone else's house, we could not even paint it the way we wanted, let alone changing the kitchen or bathroom and we would have people coming to check our place regularly to make sure we did not make too many holes in the wall or made the ugly carpet dirty.

I though she had a point and I wondered. That's true, people have now been waiting for 3 years if they followed the economist and the prediction now seem to be that it's going to take 4-5 years to really go back to lower affordable prices assuming that it does. That means renting for 8 years in a place that's not yours, that you can't change and make at your taste and where people are allowed to come and check on what you're doing whenever they want ... not sure I could have that. So, my question, what is it like to rent then. Do you feel the same as her, do you feel a lot better renting that buying ? Are you happy renting (not on a financial level, on an emotional level) ?

This was dated the 4th November and can be summarised as:

- You owned a house

- You had some doubts about the market and that you thought maybe you should sell

- Your missus quickly put the boot into that idea and pointed out why you wouldn't be selling

- You ended up agreeing with her thoughts and were then convinced that selling wasn't for you

Then today, you posted the following:

Hi All,

I have been reading on this forum for quite a while because I was worried about what I was supposed to do with my flat. We wanted a house and we could buy or sell. After a lot of thinking, we visited about 15 houses and loved one whith a lot of work to do but a big potential.

So we put ours for sale just slightly below what the estate agent recommended (they said 180k , we put it for 175k). During the first two weeks, we had 2 viewings, not good. That was end of October. in the last 3 weeks, we had 10 viewings and 2 offers last friday, one fomr a FTB, one from someone buying for his daughter. They offered at 170k, less than 3% below asking which we were happy to accept.

I then thought I was lucky and I checked the status of the other 14 properties we visited but did not offer on and all but 1 were either sold or under offer. I then phoned my estate agent saying they seem to have been doing well recently and they told me they sold more houses in the last 3 weeks than in the last 3 months before that.

Whether it's gonna crash or not is still a mistery to me but things have definitely picked up where I live.

I live in South west London just at the border with Surrey. It may be very different anywhere else though.

New builds, however, don't seem to be selling well but after visiting one, it's no wonder, they're small and expensive, have electric storage heater (there's nothing worse than that) and a £1000 a year maintenance cost.

Hmmm interesting, this can summarised as follows:

- You own a flat

- The flat has been on the market since October

- Before the end of October you had a few perspective buyers round but no sale

- You have recently accepted an offer

Ok, so thats a remarkable change of sentiment in such a short time, in under 3 weeks you have gone from being convinced selling isn't the right thing to do right the way to having convinced the missus it is infact the right thing to do, putting it on the market AND getting an offer. I'd be a little sceptical about that at the best of times but I would usually just shrug my shoulders and say 'Hey, what the hell'.

What convinces me you aren't telling us the whole truth though is the matter of dates. On the 4th November you were posting saying you had decided not to sell, the missus had convinced you. Yet today you are saying you'd put the place on the market mid-October and had some viewings. Now it occurs to me that discussing the possibility of selling 2 weeks AFTER you have already put the place on the market and AFTER you have had people round to view the place is a bit like putting the horse before the cart ;) Then to make matters worse, after putting your house/flat on the market, then discussing it with the missus, deciding selling wasn't the way to go you left it on the market and 3 weeks later accepted an offer.

Your posts simply don't match up, the type of property, the dates and times, your opinions, your partners opinions....they're all different and ultimately makes no sense.

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Right, undecided I will keep this short. I don't believe you and I think you are lying, for what reason I don't know and nor do I much care. Of course I might be wrong, in which case apologies, but I don't think so. Why do I think you are lying, well read on....

In the message you posted regarding renting and who was happy renting you posted the following:

This was dated the 4th November and can be summarised as:

- You owned a house

- You had some doubts about the market and that you thought maybe you should sell

- Your missus quickly put the boot into that idea and pointed out why you wouldn't be selling

- You ended up agreeing with her thoughts and were then convinced that selling wasn't for you

Then today, you posted the following:

Hmmm interesting, this can summarised as follows:

- You own a flat

- The flat has been on the market since October

- Before the end of October you had a few perspective buyers round but no sale

- You have recently accepted an offer

Ok, so thats a remarkable change of sentiment in such a short time, in under 3 weeks you have gone from being convinced selling isn't the right thing to do right the way to having convinced the missus it is infact the right thing to do, putting it on the market AND getting an offer. I'd be a little sceptical about that at the best of times but I would usually just shrug my shoulders and say 'Hey, what the hell'.

What convinces me you aren't telling us the whole truth though is the matter of dates. On the 4th November you were posting saying you had decided not to sell, the missus had convinced you. Yet today you are saying you'd put the place on the market mid-October and had some viewings. Now it occurs to me that discussing the possibility of selling 2 weeks AFTER you have already put the place on the market and AFTER you have had people round to view the place is a bit like putting the horse before the cart ;) Then to make matters worse, after putting your house/flat on the market, then discussing it with the missus, deciding selling wasn't the way to go you left it on the market and 3 weeks later accepted an offer.

Your posts simply don't match up, the type of property, the dates and times, your opinions, your partners opinions....they're all different and ultimately makes no sense.

I think even I (the wicked troll) agree that there's some inconsistency ....AND Undecided .. you posted this

............in our house, it feels like home, it feels good.............

Which does in fact show that you can use the words Home and Nouse and undersatnd teh difference.

i'm afraid that like the Dragon's den - I'm out of this one!

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Your posts simply don't match up, the type of property, the dates and times, your opinions, your partners opinions....they're all different and ultimately makes no sense.

Well done wtc. There seem to be more and more of these troll posts recently.

I think the best thing to do is to expose them and then ignore them; don't feed the trolls.

They seem to be succeeding in lowering the quality of the discussion. I really enjoy a good debate with a proper Bull.

This thread adds nothing at all.

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I should point in my post I made a reference to the inconsitencies being a little like putting the horse before the cart....the observant amongst you will realise that putting the horse before the cart is normal way to do things :P Of course I meant, putting the cart before the horse, a totally crazy and illogical thing to do ;)

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Your posts simply don't match up, the type of property, the dates and times, your opinions, your partners opinions....they're all different and ultimately makes no sense.

Good stuff wtc. Caught red handed. Just shows the extents people will go to ramp property.

K.

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Right, undecided I will keep this short. I don't believe you and I think you are lying, for what reason I don't know and nor do I much care. Of course I might be wrong, in which case apologies, but I don't think so. Why do I think you are lying, well read on....

In the message you posted regarding renting and who was happy renting you posted the following:

This was dated the 4th November and can be summarised as:

- You owned a house

- You had some doubts about the market and that you thought maybe you should sell

- Your missus quickly put the boot into that idea and pointed out why you wouldn't be selling

- You ended up agreeing with her thoughts and were then convinced that selling wasn't for you

Then today, you posted the following:

Hmmm interesting, this can summarised as follows:

- You own a flat

- The flat has been on the market since October

- Before the end of October you had a few perspective buyers round but no sale

- You have recently accepted an offer

Ok, so thats a remarkable change of sentiment in such a short time, in under 3 weeks you have gone from being convinced selling isn't the right thing to do right the way to having convinced the missus it is infact the right thing to do, putting it on the market AND getting an offer. I'd be a little sceptical about that at the best of times but I would usually just shrug my shoulders and say 'Hey, what the hell'.

What convinces me you aren't telling us the whole truth though is the matter of dates. On the 4th November you were posting saying you had decided not to sell, the missus had convinced you. Yet today you are saying you'd put the place on the market mid-October and had some viewings. Now it occurs to me that discussing the possibility of selling 2 weeks AFTER you have already put the place on the market and AFTER you have had people round to view the place is a bit like putting the horse before the cart ;) Then to make matters worse, after putting your house/flat on the market, then discussing it with the missus, deciding selling wasn't the way to go you left it on the market and 3 weeks later accepted an offer.

Your posts simply don't match up, the type of property, the dates and times, your opinions, your partners opinions....they're all different and ultimately makes no sense.

Thanks for taking the time to write such a long explanation and I think it deserves an answer. I agee, it can seem strange and a quick change.

Let me tell you the whole story. End of September, having a baby starting to walk and run around, we decided that it was time to find a house in order to have a garden where she can go and run around.

We started to visit property towards the end of September and until mid-October. At that point, we had not really found anything and our estate agent said that we would need to sell first as we would have little weight with sellers without selling. So we put our property on the market without having found anything.

Early November, after having visited many houses and not finding a single one we liked and in the right lication, I started this thread on renting in order to see how the rental market was. At the end of this, I was genuinely convinced that renting was the way to go. We were gonna sell and go to rent a nice house somewhere nice. Looked at the rentals in the area and I was pretty disapointed. For anything less that £1100 a month, there was nothing decent. Furthermore, the choice was pretty limited or in the wrong area (remember school is important for us). Please feel free to have a look on findaproperty or RM.

A week later, we visited one last property that was less expensive than usual and we loved it. Don't know why as there's everything to do in it but it is close to the thames, in the catchment area of the good school, close to the shops and close to the station and is part of the good kingston hostpital. We fell for it and made an offer (don't ask me why I changed my mind, I can't explain). They agreed subject to sell and we sold about a week later.

As for the flat and house thing, I am french and in France, whether it is a flat or a house, we call it "maison" which matches the use of "home" in the english language. We don't have two words for house and home, we just have maison. Therefore, I used house where I meant home and that created the confusion.

As I have now disasociated myself from the flat, I call it a flat and not a home anymore (it's just an emotional thing I can't explain).

You may well still not believe me but I appreciate that you took the time to explain your reasons rather than just calling me a liar.

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I have been posting regularly (last 2 weeks) about SW London - things most definitely picking up. Especially the properties over 2m - which is not relevant to FTB's I know - but it is relevant about city money & bonuses.

The point I have tried to make is this:

if all the FTB's wait & wait to pick the exact bottom of the current slowdown, what is going to happen when everyone decides it is the bottom?

Well- anyone who wants to buy will pitch in & the prices will move up - or they will all be chasing around after properties & not able to buy what they want when they want.

I personally would prefer to buy when it is a buyers market - which it is at the moment - but (round here) apparently not for much longer.

The city bonus story was doing the rounds in 1989/90/91/92/93/94. It never happens. These guys get the bonuses that they get because they are very good at earning money for their employers who generally happen to be financial institutions in the City. They are not financially naive enough to increase their personal exposure to a market with "crash" written all over it. Also don't forget if I have a £1mln bonus I can buy my Chelsea 3 bed townhouse but I can also afford to sell my Fulham house at a knockdown price.

When the market drops 20% it really makes no difference to me. Mere mortals however will feel the pain.

These guys are all also familiar with "dead-cat bounces" and "double tops" and "head and shoulders" formations.

Markets go up or they go down - these guys understand that. If a market no longer has a reason to go up (gold and $ and most recently crude oil) it WILL go down.

"Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it" Abraham Lincoln.

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if you say things are picking up in your area, you're a liar or worse...an Estate Agent.

Nobody is saying that you're a lying estate agent because you've said that things are picking up a bit. People are saying that you're a lying estate agent because your story seems to be riddled with inconsistencies that you have not convincingly explained away. Just to pin that down in a bit of reality.

Also, and I do hate to harp on this but really must, if you are not a native speaker then your written English is absolutely astounding. It is exceedingly rare for non-native-English-speakers to master idioms as well as you have - apart from, funnily enough, in the posts in which you claim not to speak the language - in those posts your language really deteriorates. I think that you might be caught in what we Englishers refer to as a 'web of lies' - you tell one lie and then you have to tell another to cover it up and so on 'ad infinitum' or, more appropriately here, 'ad nauseum'. So try these idioms - repeat after me: 'give it a rest', 'you're 'avin' a larf' and 'pull the other one it's got bells on'.

:P

NLRG aka Pedant Bear

Edited by North London Rent Girl
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As you post for the Cambridge area section, show me where you are rent a 3 bedroom house (city) cheaper than a one bedroom flat (not luxury) Unsure of your motivate, denial maybe?

I realise this post is a bit late in the debate, but thought I'd respond. I didn't specify that the 3 bed house had to be in the same area, of course (i didn't even say in the city), and I also didn't specify that the flat had to be 'luxury' (what the heck does that mean anyway - pay more for less room maybe?) but here is the flat I mentioned and a 3br house in the same postcode area for the same price.

If you go here http://www.sab.co.uk/property_lists.aspx?locid=100 you'll see the 1br flats from the new riverside development advertised at 750pcm.

If you visit here http://www.jsmproperty.com/rentDetails.cfm?id=JPCB1811 - here's one 3 br house in Cambridge for the same price

Or if you want to live not too far out in a nice village you can save another £75pcm and STILL get a 3br house! Coton is lovely, IMO, much rather live there than in the centre of Cambridge.

http://www.jsmproperty.com/rentDetails.cfm?id=JPCB1870

This was through looking for 2 seconds (because I have a job to do)

If you go here http://www.cambridgepropertydatabase.com/l...earch_price=700

You'll see that there are literally hundreds of 2br places for less than £750 and a few 3br too (of course there are a few overpriced new builds in Cambourne too) - the point is why would anyone rent a 1br for £750 when they can get something bigger (2 or 3 bed)? I personally rent a huge, detached 3br house just outside cambridge for just over this price. It's a much nicer area, not overrun with students (don't have anything against students, just I'm not one).

p.s. sorry to all if I've interrupted the flow of this thread!!

Edited by Pedro
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Nobody is saying that you're a lying estate agent because you've said that things are picking up a bit. People are saying that you're a lying estate agent because your story seems to be riddled with inconsistencies that you have not convincingly explained away. Just to pin that down in a bit of reality.

Also, and I do hate to harp on this but really must, if you are not a native speaker then your written English is absolutely astounding. It is exceedingly rare for non-native-English-speakers to master idioms as well as you have - apart from, funnily enough, in the posts in which you claim not to speak the language - in those posts your language really deteriorates. I think that you might be caught in what we Englishers refer to as a 'web of lies' - you tell one lie and then you have to tell another to cover it up and so on 'ad infinitum' or, more appropriately here, 'ad nauseum'. So try these idioms - repeat after me: 'give it a rest', 'you're 'avin' a larf' and 'pull the other one it's got bells on'.

:P

NLRG aka Pedant Bear

Hello, thank you for the comment on my language, I appreciate the comment about my written english. I have been living in the UK for 9 years now which may well explain. If you hear my accent, you'll have to doubt about where I come from though. However, I wrote for a big consulting firm for 5 years and you do have to do how to write ******** in well said manner, that's why my written english is not bad.

I still make a lot of mistakes though e.g. I keep confusing sensible and sensitive as sensitive in french is spelt sensible.

I have not lied, I can promise this and it may well be the english and the surprise of the reactions I got that created this "deterioration" of my language.

BTW, what does 'pull the other one it's got bells on' mean, I have never heard this and I thought 'avin' a larf' was having a laugh !

For the record I am now an independant IT consultant and am making a lot more that I would as an estate agent but keep believing, I actually am starting to enjoy this.

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Hello, thank you for the comment on my language, I appreciate the comment about my written english. I have been living in the UK for 9 years now which may well explain. If you hear my accent, you'll have to doubt about where I come from though. However, I wrote for a big consulting firm for 5 years and you do have to do how to write ******** in well said manner, that's why my written english is not bad.

I still make a lot of mistakes though e.g. I keep confusing sensible and sensitive as sensitive in french is spelt sensible.

I have not lied, I can promise this and it may well be the english and the surprise of the reactions I got that created this "deterioration" of my language.

BTW, what does 'pull the other one it's got bells on' mean, I have never heard this and I thought 'avin' a larf' was having a laugh !

For the record I am now an independant IT consultant and am making a lot more that I would as an estate agent but keep believing, I actually am starting to enjoy this.

I have to say well done on trying to keep the pretence going, it must have taken some effort, and judging by the fatct that you have got 4 pages of responses you have at the very least succeeded in winding everyone up. :lol::lol:

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Guest Charlie The Tramp
For the record I am now an independant IT consultant and am making a lot more that I would as an estate agent

I would have thought you were in pharmaceuticals, I do hope you can label the containers correctly, we don`t want any nasty accidents do we.

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I have to say well done on trying to keep the pretence going, it must have taken some effort, and judging by the fatct that you have got 4 pages of responses you have at the very least succeeded in winding everyone up. :lol::lol:

5 pages please, impressive is not it. I am sure that no estate agents wanting to achieve this would have been able to like I have. I must admit, I feel quite proud. I should get myself started in an acting career as I am obviously quite gifted. I think I'll remove politics from the list of options as I do not seem very good at convincing people although I am not bad in my job I must say. I must be better at explaining IT stuff than trying to justify the truth.

What's even more funny is how bored people must be to post things on this thread for so long as there is nothing into it but 5 pages of speculation about who I am and what I say.All I can say is that, if everyone is as good with speculation about the house market as they are with identifying who I am and what I do, then there's not much point hoping to find the answer to the market here.

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Well, it has never happened before and history does tend to repeat itself.

However, if you use your argument, and if no-one wants to buy - this will mean that they............rent.

Which is good news to anyone renting out properties.

Well you do seem to have an interesting view of the market. The market is sustained by FTBs. They have halved as a percentage of buyers in the last couple of years and the market has only been propped up by BTLs, presumably like yourself. They do not necessarily rent. Many live with parents or share with friends who are unable to afford their highly-geared mortgages. The market goes in cycles. Last time 30% was wiped off values bringing them to long term sustainable levels. The same will happen again this time. As long as you have not bought in the last 3-4 years or are planning to hand on for at least 10 years, you should be all right.

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