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Biblical Stories Of Jesus Roman Psych Warfare


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HOLA441

Not a complete list on my part

For example, the claim that he was the holy begotten Son of God sent to Earth to redeem us from our collective guilt for someone eating an apple at the beginning of time slipped my mind for some reason.

And yet Americans love Apple pie..

That story has always puzzled me, why would gaining knowledge be seen as bad? I think you can easily twist the story around and it was God encouraging man to seek knowledge and break out of jail.

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HOLA442

snip

As it happens, many religious folk, Christian or otherwise, seem to actually like believing internally inconsistent things and four internally inconsistent gospels are just fine.

course they do.

rather than a god that gave Adam total freedom EXCEPT to eat from the tree, they think God made it hard to understand what it wants us to do

god wouldnt do such a thing...he gave 10 commandments...The Church turned that into a book 10,000 tablets long and made it a cause for lifelong careers study and devotion.

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HOLA443

Bart Ehrman, an atheist/agnostic NT historian is pretty clear that Jesus was a historical character.

As Jesus makes very regular references to the "OT" scripture and moral code, his teaching probably isn't that "radical"; the golden rule is taken from the OT, and most prophets accuse Judah or Israel of being too greedy or showing insufficient care for the poor. Most OT "heroes" are morally compromised in many ways - David of course, but also Solomon, Moses, etc etc. The universality of sinfulness, the appeals to a sincere humble non-judgemental faith are

The radical departure that Jesus makes is his description of himself as "the Son of Man", a clear reference to the vision of the Messiah given in Daniel, several centuries BC.

The Roman and Jewish authorities may well have been threatened by his ministry, but this is hardly a hidden message, the gospels and acts are all about this.

The big problem is why did an otherwise utterly monotheistic middle Eastern cult - i.e. Judaism - suddenly embrace a divine Son of God in reasonable numbers, rather than simply writing Yeshua off as a prophet, murdered like so many others (e.g. John the Baptist, Isaiah)?

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HOLA444

And yet Americans love Apple pie..

That story has always puzzled me, why would gaining knowledge be seen as bad? I think you can easily twist the story around and it was God encouraging man to seek knowledge and break out of jail.

Bear in mind that for fundamentalist Christians the Bible is a 100% factually accurate document, proof-read by God, and not allegorical in any way.

So, in their case, we really are talking about an apple (edit: OK, strictly speaking, not necessarily an apple, but a piece of unspecified fruit)

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HOLA445

Bear in mind that for fundamentalist Christians the Bible is a 100% factually accurate document, proof-read by God, and not allegorical in any way.

So, in their case, we really are talking about an apple (edit: OK, strictly speaking, not necessarily an apple, but a piece of unspecified fruit)

I feel sure I read once, but cannot cite the source, that 57% of Americans (Catholic?) believe everything in the Bible to be true; that it is, in essence, a non-fiction reference work of fact.

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HOLA446

I feel sure I read once, but cannot cite the source, that 57% of Americans (Catholic?) believe everything in the Bible to be true; that it is, in essence, a non-fiction reference work of fact.

Hell, no. Catholicism is much is much more complicated and ****ed up than that.

Evangelical protestants mostly. Baptists, that sort of thing.

The big problem is why did an otherwise utterly monotheistic middle Eastern cult - i.e. Judaism - suddenly embrace a divine Son of God in reasonable numbers, rather than simply writing Yeshua off as a prophet, murdered like so many others (e.g. John the Baptist, Isaiah)?

The bodily resurrection thing does give the Jesus as a murdered prophet narrative a little extra je ne sais quoi.

Acknowledge him as a non-divine murdered prophet and then we're talking Islam.

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HOLA447

Seems unlikely ...

But the Romans - principally Constantine in the 4th century AD - did invent a lot of the bible story, notably the fairytale elements like the Christmas story we know today. It was (it seemed at the time) a stroke of political genius, turning a very dangerous cult into something cuddly and bringing it in from the cold to the mainstream....

As Seneca the Younger wrote in the 1st century BCE: "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful"

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HOLA448

As Seneca the Younger wrote in the 1st century BCE: "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as useful"

Blessed are the Ammonites, for they are wise! ;)

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HOLA4413

Dinosaurs... dem fun-da-mentalists have an an answer (and sign) for everything...

Could that possibly because, even Noah was a bit too young to see dinosaurs? :huh:

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HOLA4418

On the subject of making Jesus who you want him to be...

A scene from the Gospel of Luke...

While he was still speaking a crowd came up, and the man who was called Judas, one of the Twelve, was leading them. He approached Jesus to kiss him, but Jesus asked him, “Judas, are you betraying the Son of Man with a kiss?”. When Jesus’ followers saw what was going to happen, they said, “Lord, should we strike with our swords?” And one of them struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his right ear.

But Jesus answered, “No more of this!” And he touched the man’s ear and healed him.

The Saxon version, as told in the Heliand...

‘Christ the chieftain is captured, Peter the mighty soldier defends him boldly’.

‘Christ’s warrior companions saw warriors coming up the mountain making a great din

Angry armed men. Judas the hate filled man was showing them the way.

The enemy clan, the Jews, were marching behind.

The warriors marched forward, the grim Jewish army, until they had come to the Christ.

There he stood, the famous chieftain.

Christ’s followers, wise men deeply distressed by this hostile action

Held their position in front.

They spoke to their chieftain, ‘My Lord chieftain’, they said, ‘if it should now

Be your will that we be impaled here under spear points

Wounded by their weapons then nothing would be so good to us as to die here

Pale from mortal wounds for our chieftain’.

Then he got really angry

Simon Peter, the mighty, noble swordman flew into a rage.

His mind was in such turmoil he could not speak a single word.

His heart became intensely bitter because they wanted to tie up his Lord there.

So he strode over angrily, that very daring Thane, to stand in front of his commander

Right in front of his Lord.

No doubting in his mind, no fearful hesitation in his chest he drew his blade

And struck straight ahead at the first man of the enemy with all the strength in his hands

So that Malchus was cut and wounded on the right side by the sword.

His ear was chopped off.

He was so badly wounded in the head that his cheek and ear burst open with the mortal wound

Blood gushed out, pouring from the wound.

The men stood back; they were afraid of the slash of the sword.

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HOLA4419

On the subject of making Jesus who you want him to be...

A scene from the Gospel of Luke...

The Saxon version...

I do like a Fighting Jesus! That's far better than the *****y one that did ****** all! ;)

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HOLA4420

I do like a Fighting Jesus! That's far better than the *****y one that did ****** all! ;)

The language appears to affirm its authenticity!

But bear in mind, even the boring bible portrays Jesus as violent, when he took offence at the gift shop in the temple. I wonder how He would fare in a modern cathedral?

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HOLA4421

I do like a Fighting Jesus! That's far better than the *****y one that did ****** all! ;)

Could it be that you are descended from Saxon Thanes MrPin?

The Mongol Jesus is on record as saying '…to crush your enemies, to see them fall at your feet to take their horses and goods and hear the lamentation of their women. That is best.'

OK, I made that last one up, but that appears to be permissible.

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HOLA4424

I wonder what he thought he'd given them all that sand for?

What do you think they make the oil out of? They've got like this big turbine thing, shovel sand in one end, oil comes out the other. They mature it underground then suck it back up a few months later.

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HOLA4425

Could it be that you are descended from Saxon Thanes MrPin?

The Mongol Jesus is on record as saying '…to crush your enemies, to see them fall at your feet to take their horses and goods and hear the lamentation of their women. That is best.'

I am descended from Vikings, but not recently!

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