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Loopy Colleague Tells Me To Use Htb

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Every so often I post details of my loopy colleague who would be a Daily Mail reader if knew how to read. Anyway, the latest instalment...

A couple of weeks ago I bumped into her, and she cheerfully told me HTB was coming soon and would be great for people like me. Yesterday, wanting to test her financial acumen, I messaged her...

Me: "I see HTB has arrived early, but I can't quite see how it will help me".

Dozy Bint: "Yeah, the government lends you money on top of your mortgage so you can buy a house".

Me: "Hmmm, you're getting confused with HTB1. HTB2 is where you can get a 95% mortgage, part guaranteed by the government using my taxes to do so"

Dozy Bint: "I'm not sure, but it's better than renting because that's just throwing money away".

Me: "Ok, so how does HTB1 or HTB2 help me buy a house, when we can already borrow as much as we can afford to repay?"

Dozy Bint: "I don't know. But what you going to do otherwise?"

Me: "Carry on renting until house prices return to normal".

Dozy Bint: "Oh".

Me: "Are you seriously suggesting I put my wife and 2 children's welfare at risk, by borrowing so much money that I risk being unable to pay the bills in the future?"

Dozy Bint: "You better pray you win the lottery then".

At that point I gave up :rolleyes:

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Every so often I post details of my loopy colleague who would be a Daily Mail reader if knew how to read. Anyway, the latest instalment...

A couple of weeks ago I bumped into her, and she cheerfully told me HTB was coming soon and would be great for people like me. Yesterday, wanting to test her financial acumen, I messaged her...

Me: "I see HTB has arrived early, but I can't quite see how it will help me".

Dozy Bint: "Yeah, the government lends you money on top of your mortgage so you can buy a house".

Me: "Hmmm, you're getting confused with HTB1. HTB2 is where you can get a 95% mortgage, part guaranteed by the government using my taxes to do so"

Dozy Bint: "I'm not sure, but it's better than renting because that's just throwing money away".

Me: "Ok, so how does HTB1 or HTB2 help me buy a house, when we can already borrow as much as we can afford to repay?"

Dozy Bint: "I don't know. But what you going to do otherwise?"

Me: "Carry on renting until house prices return to normal".

Dozy Bint: "Oh".

Me: "Are you seriously suggesting I put my wife and 2 children's welfare at risk, by borrowing so much money that I risk being unable to pay the bills in the future?"

Dozy Bint: "You better pray you win the lottery then".

At that point I gave up :rolleyes:

You work at the Treasury?

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Very funny.

We were looking at reasonable houses on rightmove yesterday, and it is still cheaper to rent than buy.

Renting a 3 bedroom detached place with a garden is about £700/£750 per month.

Buying the same house is about £250k.

The payments may work out the same with 0% interest rates for the next few years, but then you are screwed. Also I like to keep a big pile of cash for other uses like making more cash. It's foolish to tie up all your capital in a property.

Funnily enough even with HTB it costs more to buy.

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Very funny.

We were looking at reasonable houses on rightmove yesterday, and it is still cheaper to rent than buy.

Renting a 3 bedroom detached place with a garden is about £700/£750 per month.

Buying the same house is about £250k.

The payments may work out the same with 0% interest rates for the next few years, but then you are screwed. Also I like to keep a big pile of cash for other uses like making more cash. It's foolish to tie up all your capital in a property.

Funnily enough even with HTB it costs more to buy.

The only problem is that by renting you are also keeping the housing ponzi alive as home owners have a get out clause. 'oh we will rent it, no point in giving it away.'

Though the Telegraph was saying that London rents may fall 5% as a result of H2B2, which Tory Central Office immediately siezed upon.

I'll believe it when I see it.

Last night on Beeny, a couple worked and saved in a caravan for 7 years and built a luxury home on a barge for under £40k. I think thats the only way to go now! :lol:

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The only problem is that by renting you are also keeping the housing ponzi alive as home owners have a get out clause. 'oh we will rent it, no point in giving it away.'

True, but you have to live somewhere and we spent all my life living in shit holes until we decided to rent decent houses in nice areas. We would buy a decent house but I really don't think that we could get the mortgage on our income anyway.

Might as well live in a nice house, save off balance sheet and when retirement comes pop down to the council and get a taxpayer funded flat for free.

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The only problem is that by renting you are also keeping the housing ponzi alive as home owners have a get out clause. 'oh we will rent it, no point in giving it away.'

Though the Telegraph was saying that London rents may fall 5% as a result of H2B2, which Tory Central Office immediately siezed upon.

I do not think so. The rental yield in London is about 3% and falling 15% every year as prices go up and rents stay the same.

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Every so often I post details of my loopy colleague who would be a Daily Mail reader if knew how to read. Anyway, the latest instalment...

A couple of weeks ago I bumped into her, and she cheerfully told me HTB was coming soon and would be great for people like me. Yesterday, wanting to test her financial acumen, I messaged her...

Me: "I see HTB has arrived early, but I can't quite see how it will help me".

Dozy Bint: "Yeah, the government lends you money on top of your mortgage so you can buy a house".

Me: "Hmmm, you're getting confused with HTB1. HTB2 is where you can get a 95% mortgage, part guaranteed by the government using my taxes to do so"

Dozy Bint: "I'm not sure, but it's better than renting because that's just throwing money away".

Me: "Ok, so how does HTB1 or HTB2 help me buy a house, when we can already borrow as much as we can afford to repay?"

Dozy Bint: "I don't know. But what you going to do otherwise?"

Me: "Carry on renting until house prices return to normal".

Dozy Bint: "Oh".

Me: "Are you seriously suggesting I put my wife and 2 children's welfare at risk, by borrowing so much money that I risk being unable to pay the bills in the future?"

Dozy Bint: "You better pray you win the lottery then".

At that point I gave up :rolleyes:

Why do you think you can change her mindset. In animal experiments to get a subject to perform a certain kind of behavior you reward that behavior. Her and her ilk have been rewarded for what? 16, 17 years maybe longer. And right now it seems these rewards are not about to stop.

Those 'dozy bints' have been making out like bandits for the last decade plus, with possibly limited intelligence and resources. Maybe not so dozy after all.

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Very funny.

We were looking at reasonable houses on rightmove yesterday, and it is still cheaper to rent than buy.

Renting a 3 bedroom detached place with a garden is about £700/£750 per month.

Buying the same house is about £250k.

The payments may work out the same with 0% interest rates for the next few years, but then you are screwed. Also I like to keep a big pile of cash for other uses like making more cash. It's foolish to tie up all your capital in a property.

Funnily enough even with HTB it costs more to buy.

Have you moved back to the UK?

There are detached houses from about 65kGBP around Galway.

Edit : That said - WTF is this, a time warp from 2006/7 ??

http://www.daft.ie/searchsale.daft?id=460447#

Edited by swissy_fit

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Why do you think you can change her mindset. In animal experiments to get a subject to perform a certain kind of behavior you reward that behavior. Her and her ilk have been rewarded for what? 16, 17 years maybe longer. And right now it seems these rewards are not about to stop.

Those 'dozy bints' have been making out like bandits for the last decade plus, with possibly limited intelligence and resources. Maybe not so dozy after all.

I have no intention of changing her mindset - I was just asking her to back up her daytime TV property advice.

She has been very lucky to have bought when she did.... at no point was it due to logic, common sense or financial awareness. You'll have to trust me when I say she is loopy and dozy.... i work with her :)

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She has been very lucky to have bought when she did.... at no point was it due to logic, common sense or financial awareness. You'll have to trust me when I say she is loopy and dozy.... i work with her :)

The real tragedy of the crisis is this kind of misallocation of resources. Give all the wealth to those that demonstrate the least financial awareness and competence and what do you get. The uk today.

But there is a point in what she is saying. What else do you do? Win the lottery or use whatever scheme is available or rent, which actually can be quite crap particularly if you have a family. I can see why you would do it, pile in, everyone else is, the government is telling you to. What are they going to do, repossess the uk? If you cant beat them..?

Im coming around to the idea of buying something small to minimise my exposure to the madness and just watching it play out. No landlord, security of tenure, small exposure.

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Im coming around to the idea of buying something small to minimise my exposure to the madness and just watching it play out. No landlord, security of tenure, small exposure.

That's what I've done recently. There's an assumption in this country that you should buy the most expensive house you can afford. Why? If you go and buy a 40 inch telly from Argos, you don't get the sales assistant suggesting you speak to their financial advisor to see if you can afford a 60 inch telly. I bought a house that does the job, with the same mindset I used to buy a telly. I no longer care whether house prices go up or down (other than worrying about my kids' futures).

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That's what I've done recently. There's an assumption in this country that you should buy the most expensive house you can afford. Why? If you go and buy a 40 inch telly from Argos, you don't get the sales assistant suggesting you speak to their financial advisor to see if you can afford a 60 inch telly. I bought a house that does the job, with the same mindset I used to buy a telly. I no longer care whether house prices go up or down (other than worrying about my kids' futures).

At the moment we can tollerate our shabby, rented, 2 bed terrace because we won't be there for ever. If we bought one (which is all we can afford) and prices plummeted, we'd be thinking "we could be here forever".

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That's what I've done recently. There's an assumption in this country that you should buy the most expensive house you can afford. Why? If you go and buy a 40 inch telly from Argos, you don't get the sales assistant suggesting you speak to their financial advisor to see if you can afford a 60 inch telly. I bought a house that does the job, with the same mindset I used to buy a telly. I no longer care whether house prices go up or down (other than worrying about my kids' futures).

A good idea when prices are low and can only go one way and when wages rise every year. However not such a good idea now.

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That's what I've done recently. There's an assumption in this country that you should buy the most expensive house you can afford. Why? If you go and buy a 40 inch telly from Argos, you don't get the sales assistant suggesting you speak to their financial advisor to see if you can afford a 60 inch telly. I bought a house that does the job, with the same mindset I used to buy a telly. I no longer care whether house prices go up or down (other than worrying about my kids' futures).

Buying a house is a leveraged bet on inflation.

There hasn't been a whole lot of deflation any time in recent history - for example when it looked like it might happen back in 2008 we got a massive and continuing stream of money printing and bizarro stimulus measures which have stoked inflation - and there aren't too many ways that the average person can actually obtain leverage to speculate.

Put those two factors together and it's not surprising that the average person thinks that buying early and buying big is the way to go.

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A good idea when prices are low and can only go one way and when wages rise every year. However not such a good idea now.

...it is not only the wages/working hours not rising, it is also living costs rising ....we ain't seen nothing yet, everything we import will be getting dearer, there is little chance interest rates will fall further, if they did it would be through desperation....and desperation is not a good sign even in the best of times. ;)

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At the moment we can tollerate our shabby, rented, 2 bed terrace because we won't be there for ever. If we bought one (which is all we can afford) and prices plummeted, we'd be thinking "we could be here forever".

I wonder when it's going to become completely normal for ALL 20-38 yr olds to just up sticks and go abroad... In the early 20th century - LOADS of people did this --- both my grandads went off to the other side of the world and had a good time living there..... Then came back when they hit about 60.

I am curious that

a - Young people of say 20-35 - haven't all got together via facebook & twitter --- 2 MILLION OF THEM -- and just organised a complete blockade of ALL the streets around Westminster & the City -- and ALSO essential supply chains/places..... AND - just sit there and say that UNLESS & UNTIL the Banksters are imprisoned, BTL is banned, property goes back to MAX 3 x salaries -- They will just blockade EVERYTHING..... or

b - They don't just all leave the UK in their hordes - and leave the old people to get on with it.....

Seriously -- I am genuinely amazed in particular that they haven't done [a] above..... :rolleyes:

Edited by eric pebble

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a - Young people of say 20-35 - haven't all got together via facebook & twitter --- 2 MILLION OF THEM -- and just organised a complete blockade of ALL the streets around Westminster & the City -- and ALSO essential supply chains/places..... AND - just sit there and say that UNLESS & UNTIL the Banksters are imprisoned, BTL is banned, property goes back to MAX 3 x salaries -- They will just blockade EVERYTHING..... or

b - They don't just all leave the UK in their hordes - and leave the old people to get on with it.....

Seriously -- I am genuinely amazed in particular that they haven't done [a] above..... :rolleyes:

There are far too many funny cat pictures for that to ever happen.

My experience of mentioning the situation is that they haven't the faintest clue what is happening. 'What housing bubble?' 'Whats a housing bubble?'

What they do know is that they can't buy a house, ever. Its not even a desire or a hope anymore, none of their peer group are buying, its normal to rent. There is no social pressure to buy, no peer pressure, no concept that its a money tree either. Can't do it so won't do it seems to be the theme. You may as well ask them if they are considering going for a walk on the moon. "ive not really thought about it, would be nice I guess, but I cant see it happening".

This is of course amusing news when you consider the people with their houses on the market waiting for one of these same youngsters to come along and pay for their retirement for them. "Im not giving it away!". If they did, I wonder if the kids would take it.

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There are far too many funny cat pictures for that to ever happen.

My experience of mentioning the situation is that they haven't the faintest clue what is happening. 'What housing bubble?' 'Whats a housing bubble?'

What they do know is that they can't buy a house, ever. Its not even a desire or a hope anymore, none of their peer group are buying, its normal to rent. There is no social pressure to buy, no peer pressure, no concept that its a money tree either. Can't do it so won't do it seems to be the theme. You may as well ask them if they are considering going for a walk on the moon. "ive not really thought about it, would be nice I guess, but I cant see it happening".

This is of course amusing news when you consider the people with their houses on the market waiting for one of these same youngsters to come along and pay for their retirement for them. "Im not giving it away!". If they did, I wonder if the kids would take it.

Yes, those not out by now will not be getting a retirement pay-out, not anywhere close to what they expected anyway. Would the kids take it? Not in the same way as the "must get on the ladder" generation, or the "can`t go wrong with bricks and mortar" (:lol: Love that one) generations before them IMO. I think the Mega Ponzi (2001 - 2008 RIP) was a one off.

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At work I keep cheerily hearing that I won't loose any money as I'm buying and house prices only ever go up. :rolleyes:

I said: "Oh yeah, that's what my seller was told in 2006 when he bought for 190k and is selling today for 175k. No that's not a 15k loss but a real terms official inflation adjusted loss of 60k. As 190k in 2006 would now be worth 235k in today's money, due to ~25% inflation over the last 7 years. (forgot to mention the 2x 5k transaction costs, maintenance and renovations)

Ding! :huh: Penny drops... :unsure:

So that's one less 50 year old multi property owner that will be attempting idle conversation with me again.

Edit: For reference, price action in Gloucestershire with recent kitchen and bathrooms.

Back to 2003/2004 equivalent real terms prices (so far) http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/indices-nationwide-national-inflation.php

Edited by DarkHorseWaits-NoMore

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