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justthisbloke

I've Ordered An Electric Car

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Another thread reminded me that we used to have an electric car thread running - which I can't find.

Well, I've taken the plunge and ordered one from BMW. When it arrives (no idea when - I'm not even sure they've finished the factory yet), I'll report back with experiences.

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Another thread reminded me that we used to have an electric car thread running - which I can't find.

Well, I've taken the plunge and ordered one from BMW. When it arrives (no idea when - I'm not even sure they've finished the factory yet), I'll report back with experiences.

You can then take a picture of yourself filling it up at a petrol station and take the lead in that particular contest as well (I don't believe anyone has left the starting blocks yet in that particular challenge).

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Very interesting car - carbon fibre etc.

Are you getting the range extender with this? They say the range is 180 miles but can't you just put more petrol in it to go further or is the mpg for the range extender really bad? Or maybe the right question is when the battery is flat, can the range extender power the car on its own?

Is there an option for photovoltaic solar on the roof?

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I'm guessing that would be quite costly ?

Well, it is a BMW (not renowned as the world's cheapest car manufacturer) and I have allowed Mrs JTB free reign on the options list so, yes, "costly" would probably be an appropriate word.

However, I'm not sure it's excessively costly when compared to the squandery of money that any new-car purchase is. There's no direct comparison conventional car in the BMW lineup but I did compare a similarly specced Renault Zoe and Clio and the 'leccy version was about the same or cheaper[1] if you rack up the miles.

[1] For the first time in my life, I'm getting a bung from you lot - my generous fellow taxpayers. I never thought the govt would see fit to give me a £5k discount on a Beemer!

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The 2014 Honda Jazz hybrid has 134bhp, 0-60 in 10s(It's not that long ago that this would have been considered serious hot hatch territory), better handling than before, apparently quite good this time, decent auto box and a claimed mpg approaching 90, so probably 75mpg real world.

No range issues, very practical, it'll probably never break down and will cost a lot less than the BMW I3.

So well done to you for supporting the new tech, someone has to, however at those figures I'll settle for the Honda when it arrives next year if it's as good as promised. I'd love a Tesla Model S though. :-)

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Very interesting car - carbon fibre etc.

Are you getting the range extender with this? They say the range is 180 miles but can't you just put more petrol in it to go further or is the mpg for the range extender really bad? Or maybe the right question is when the battery is flat, can the range extender power the car on its own?

Is there an option for photovoltaic solar on the roof?

Yeah, I've specced the range extender. I really don't think it'll be needed (I've analysed the past couple of years driving) and I don't really want to lug around an ICE - but the primary driver will be Mrs JTB and she's more wary of new tech than I am. Also, there a couple of longer trips I'd like to do (to show the thing off!) and I'm yet to be convinced that the public charge network is up to scratch. It's getting there and maybe I'll never use the REx but I've got all bases covered this way.

No PV roof option. I suspect because it'd add practically no benefit.

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The 2014 Honda Jazz hybrid has 134bhp, 0-60 in 10s(It's not that long ago that this would have been considered serious hot hatch territory), better handling than before, apparently quite good this time, decent auto box and a claimed mpg approaching 90, so probably 75mpg real world.

No range issues, very practical, it'll probably never break down and will cost a lot less than the BMW I3.

So well done to you for supporting the new tech, someone has to, however at those figures I'll settle for the Honda when it arrives next year if it's as good as promised. I'd love a Tesla Model S though. :-)

If this was an exercise in frugality, I'd have not walked through the doors of a BMW showroom in the first place! It's the mid-life purchase of a technology loving early adopter who hasn't met the right barmaid to run off with (yet).

I think this does 0-60 in a shade over 7s. If that sort of thing is important to you (it isn't to me - I ride a bicycle usually).

The Tesla S, IMO, suffers from being American. Yanks have never been able to build cars so I'm wary of quality and design. It's also too damn big! Also, having analysed our driving patterns, I simply don't need the range it offers (at huge cost). Mrs JTB's peace of mind was cheaper to buy with a REx in a brand that she trusts.

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....it is not saving money but spending it, anyway would it not be more environmentally friendly to continue driving an existing low emissions car..... and rather than becoming a guinea pig wait a few more years for any electrical teething problems to be sorted first?......then buy one second hand. ;)

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/experts/article-2243534/How-does-cost-charge-electric-car-home.html

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....it is not saving money but spending it, anyway would it not be more environmentally friendly to continue driving an existing low emissions car..... and rather than becoming a guinea pig wait a few more years for any electrical teething problems to be sorted first?......then buy one second hand. ;)

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/experts/article-2243534/How-does-cost-charge-electric-car-home.html

No doubt you will approve of my 15 year old, 4.5 litre shit burping bus! :blink:

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Something to look forward to. Got to be some fun going to electric.

Been playing with the idea of building my own, using a shell like an Audi A2 (compact MPV style, aluminium, no longer in production). Enjoyed watching all the ones converted to electric in the USA on YouTube, including a Beetle done by father and daughter. Just using regular batteries (shorter range), not the expensive lithium ones.

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Interesting....keep us posted.

I was pondering these the other day, this or something like this is clearly going to be the way forward, especially if fuel costs spike up. I really like the i3 and I think the i8 looks great - and gives us petrol heads at least some hope for the future.

Petrol >£1.50 by the end of the year is very possible. I've been considering LPG for my next motor, and you don't need to do huge mileages to break even at £1.40 /litre let alone £1.50+. Has anyone here got / had LPG? I know there are drawbacks - got to have a tank somewhere, limited range, limited availability, potentially more 'stuff' to go wrong / require looking after.

Did they give you any idea what they expect residuals on the i3 to be like? And how does it work with the batteries - do they give a lifespan / replacement cost?

Kudos to BMW for getting ahead and investing big on this tech.

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Interesting....keep us posted.

I was pondering these the other day, this or something like this is clearly going to be the way forward, especially if fuel costs spike up. I really like the i3 and I think the i8 looks great - and gives us petrol heads at least some hope for the future.

Petrol >£1.50 by the end of the year is very possible. I've been considering LPG for my next motor, and you don't need to do huge mileages to break even at £1.40 /litre let alone £1.50+. Has anyone here got / had LPG? I know there are drawbacks - got to have a tank somewhere, limited range, limited availability, potentially more 'stuff' to go wrong / require looking after.

Did they give you any idea what they expect residuals on the i3 to be like? And how does it work with the batteries - do they give a lifespan / replacement cost?

Kudos to BMW for getting ahead and investing big on this tech.

I had LPG and would have it again, but they're not keen on it here in Switzerland.

You must do your research, any old car on LPG won't do. Some engines don't like it, others require flashlube, factory-fitted should be OK. If Mazda are still doing deals on LPG conversions and their newer engines are happy with LPG, that new 6 estate would be a great LPG car.

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Interesting....keep us posted.

I was pondering these the other day, this or something like this is clearly going to be the way forward, especially if fuel costs spike up. I really like the i3 and I think the i8 looks great - and gives us petrol heads at least some hope for the future.

Petrol >£1.50 by the end of the year is very possible. I've been considering LPG for my next motor, and you don't need to do huge mileages to break even at £1.40 /litre let alone £1.50+. Has anyone here got / had LPG? I know there are drawbacks - got to have a tank somewhere, limited range, limited availability, potentially more 'stuff' to go wrong / require looking after.

Did they give you any idea what they expect residuals on the i3 to be like? And how does it work with the batteries - do they give a lifespan / replacement cost?

Kudos to BMW for getting ahead and investing big on this tech.

Not much guidance on residuals (as you'd expect at this stage) - the finance packages are for lease/hire (rather than PCP with an option to buy at the end). Monthly payments start at £3k down and £369 per month. I'm wondering if the leasing strategy implies that BMW want to control the second hand market and therefore residuals a bit. I'll be paying cash anyway.

No guidance on battery replacement costs but they do have an 8 year battery and drivetrain warranty which gives a fair degree of comfort.

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Not much guidance on residuals (as you'd expect at this stage) - the finance packages are for lease/hire (rather than PCP with an option to buy at the end). Monthly payments start at £3k down and £369 per month. I'm wondering if the leasing strategy implies that BMW want to control the second hand market and therefore residuals a bit. I'll be paying cash anyway.

No guidance on battery replacement costs but they do have an 8 year battery and drivetrain warranty which gives a fair degree of comfort.

As a business driver in a sales role covering 25k-30k p/a I've been keeping a keen eye on EV's the last 18 months. What I've noticed is a two tier 2nd hand market. Any pure electric EV with limited range (like the Nissan leaf) drops like a stone until the 2nd hand value makes is a no loss option compared to fuel savings for those that can easily live with a 60-80 mile range.

However the one I wanted, the only EV range extender on the market, the Vauxhall Ampera / Chevy Volt, are holding value better than high economy quality diesels like Honda and BMW.

I managed to delay changing cars from last summer to this seriously expecting to pick up a Ampera / Volt 2nd had at the 14-18 months old and under 20k miles for 50% to 60% off the £33k purchase price (Yes the real purchase price not the £38k list price because no one pays that, we give you £5k off gaurenteed).

However even though they first hit the road in May 2012 (12 plates), with some 61 plates about (pre order Demonstrators?) on Autotrader the cheapest you can pick up a Volt is £22.5k and Ampera is £23k.

This is only 30% off new! Crazy.

I have given up that idea now and bought a 15 month old 12 plate Honda Civic 2.2 I-Dtec ES with 12.5k on the clock for £13k, a saving of £10k off the £23k purchase price. A saving of 43%.

I guess the low sales volume (under 500) and very high lease costs means most of the Volt / Amperas where bought privately or on a longish lease.

Anyway the current residuals of above £20k for and ER-EV in the second hand market is pretty impressive, so I suspect and BMW ER-EV will have even better residuals. Of course this assumes BMW give the same or better 10 year / 100,000 mile warrenty as GM do on the battery pack?

M

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Another thread reminded me that we used to have an electric car thread running - which I can't find.

Well, I've taken the plunge and ordered one from BMW. When it arrives (no idea when - I'm not even sure they've finished the factory yet), I'll report back with experiences.

Good on you, looking forward to the updates. I've got half an eye on an eleccy in future, when the costs are a bit lower. markyh's comments re: residuals should give you confidence that it may not be too expensive if you ultimately decide to get rid in a few years. Good plan on getting the range extender.

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Yeah, I've specced the range extender. I really don't think it'll be needed (I've analysed the past couple of years driving) and I don't really want to lug around an ICE - but the primary driver will be Mrs JTB and she's more wary of new tech than I am. Also, there a couple of longer trips I'd like to do (to show the thing off!) and I'm yet to be convinced that the public charge network is up to scratch. It's getting there and maybe I'll never use the REx but I've got all bases covered this way.

No PV roof option. I suspect because it'd add practically no benefit.

Good for you, brave as an early adopter

I saw an interview with a BMW rep saying they were offering the use of an ice bmw car to i3 electric owners for longer trips (on what terms I don't know)

just looking at car build vid below, carbon frame is impressive, but I'm not sure about removing side pillar re: safety . It doesn't look that aerodynamic compared to prius / honda civic hybrid.

Carbon fibre cannot be repaired if damaged, (unlike fibreglass). Perhaps they just replace the whole frame if damaged, which is expensive . I like the plastic body panels

Nissan Leaf side post test

BMW i3 LifeDrive Architecture

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=uIs4Wi0rplU#t=4

the competition EV's score 5 in crash tests

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X070cnh0w74

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Another thread reminded me that we used to have an electric car thread running - which I can't find.

Well, I've taken the plunge and ordered one from BMW. When it arrives (no idea when - I'm not even sure they've finished the factory yet), I'll report back with experiences.

Let us know what the range is with the fan heater on during winter :)

I took part in a Ford electric car trial a couple of years ago. I must admit it was awesome to drive, so quiet and no blatant gear changes. On the minus side the range was crap and it took all night to charge properly.

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Let us know what the range is with the fan heater on during winter :)

I took part in a Ford electric car trial a couple of years ago. I must admit it was awesome to drive, so quiet and no blatant gear changes. On the minus side the range was crap and it took all night to charge properly.

EVs these days use a heat pump that uses only a third of the power of conventional heating - but it's a fair certainty, I'd say, that EVs are still going to lose a lot of range on a day when it's -5 compared to a day of +20. The other trick they now have is pre-heating; getting the car up to temp while it's still attached to the mains has the dual effect of warming the cabin and conditioning the battery. As EVs (actually, most cars whatever the power source) do relatively short trips there's often no need for further heating before you arrive at your destination.

Charging should be quicker these days as well; you get a free (thanks again, fellow taxpayers) 32A charger at home which should polish the job off in 2 to 3 hours. In fact, any home can get a free charger - you don't need an EV to qualify. Over the next couple of months, I'll be making sure that all my rellies get one!

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Novelty aside, what has prompted you to go for an electric car?

Mrs JTB has been pointing out for some time that we "need"[1] a newer, more reliable car and has dragged me around all the showrooms in Christendom. I've looked at everything but it's just left me cold; whatever the badge and the performance figures, they're all "just another car". Boring boring boring.

The i3 is the first car that I've come across that I find interesting. It may actually be "fun" to use. I'm curious as to how it'll perform and how the technology works in reality.

There's also a bit of eco-ness in me - although it's not the main driver in this (if it was, I wouldn't have any car). But it'll certainly be less polluting in the local environment (the biggest car-created pollutant after CO2 is noise) and being an early adopter will set the stage for societal CO2 reduction in future.

Finally, there's a sort of nod towards energy security. Another fuel crisis (remember that; wonderful days for cycle-commuting) and I'll be OK.

But, the main reason is my first reason; it's simply not as boring boring boring as most cars. So, my answer to your question which began "novelty aside", is "novelty"!

[1] We don't - no one "needs" a car.

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You can then take a picture of yourself filling it up at a petrol station and take the lead in that particular contest as well (I don't believe anyone has left the starting blocks yet in that particular challenge).

Assuming the Wiki entry is correct this car has a 25KW 650cc generator and 9 litre fuel tank to range extend the 22kwh LION battery. In total this gives a range of about 300km. This appears to be a good compromise and IMO the route Nissan should have gone down with the Leaf. Also an ICE range extender has the added benefit of a potential waste heat source for heating the cabin in the winter.

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What is rubbish is the range extending engine . It holds two gallons and only extends the range by 60-80 miles. That is 30-40 mpg. Awful. The range extender is a badly thought add on using the rubbish 650 scooter engine and a thimble tank. If they stuck at least a proper range fuel tank in it would help but that REx efficiency is dire.

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