Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

interestrateripoff

Opposition Says As Many As 1,300 Killed In Gas Attack Near Damascus

Recommended Posts

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/08/21/uk-syria-crisis-idUKBRE97K0AJ20130821

Syria's opposition accused President Bashar al-Assad's forces of gassing many hundreds of people - by one report as many as 1,300 - on Wednesday in what would, if confirmed, be the world's worst chemical weapons attack in decades.

Western and regional countries called for U.N. chemical weapons investigators - who arrived in Damascus just three days ago - to be urgently dispatched to the scene of one of the deadliest incidents of the two-year-old civil war.

Gas attack or a false flag to enable foreign intervention on the grounds of weapons of mass destruction used?

Would the opposition gas their own people to get foreign help?

Either way it appears a lot of people have been killed if the reports are accurate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TV news just reported this...they said the UN called for Inspectors....they didnt say the Inspectors are already there and just a couple of miles away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

US will not intervene in Syria as opposition unsympathetic to US interests.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/10257208/US-will-not-intervene-in-Syria-as-rebels-dont-support-interests-says-top-general.html

General Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and Barack Obama's chief military adviser, said that the US military was capable of taking out the Syrian government's airforce and tipping the deepening struggle back in the favour of the country's opposition.

But, in an extraordinarily frank assessment, Gen. Dempsey said that approach was not favoured by Washington as it would leave the US mired in another Middle Eastern war and offer little chance of peace in a country wracked by ethnic divisions.

In an August 19 letter to Representative Eliot Engel, obtained by the Associated Press, Gen. Dempsey effectively ruled out even limited intervention, including US cruise missile attacks and other options that wouldn't require US troops on the ground.

"Syria today is not about choosing between two sides but rather about choosing one among many sides," he said. "It is my belief that the side we choose must be ready to promote their interests and ours when the balance shifts in their favour. Today, they are not."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://www.aljazeerah.info/News/2013/August/21%20n/200%20Syrians%20Killed%20in%20Gas%20Attack%20By%20Government%20Forces%20Near%20Damascus,%20August%2021,%202013.htm

SURPRISING TIMING

The timing and location of the reported chemical weapons use - just three days after the team of U.N. chemical experts checked in to a Damascus hotel a few km (miles) to the east at the start of their mission - was surprising.

"It would be very peculiar if it was the government to do this at the exact moment the international inspectors come into the country," said Rolf Ekeus, a retired Swedish diplomat who headed a team of UN weapons inspectors in Iraq in the 1990s.

"At the least, it wouldn't be very clever."

Ekeus said the mandate of the U.N. team was limited to three sites but could be amended to investigate fresh claims - which would be simpler to verify than the other months-old cases.

"It is easier to do sampling and testing, and also to look at the victims, if there are sick people or even dead people (on the scene). It is easier to get to doctors and get to the place where the event happened."

Charles Lister, an analyst at IHS Jane's Terrorism and Insurgency Centre, also said it made little sense for the Syrian government to use chemical agents now.

"Nonetheless, the Ghouta region (where the attacks were reported) is well known for its opposition leanings. Jabhat al-Nusra has had a long-time presence there and the region has borne the brunt of sustained military pressure for months now," he said, referring to a hardline Sunni Islamist rebel group allied to al Qaeda.

Its almost as if it was planned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And world opinion is supposed to think that the Syrian government did such a thing, even though it is winning the conflict and when it knows it would be a pretext for foreign intervention, because ...?

You'd have to think the people you supposedly represent were thick as pig poo for them to buy that straight away, without question or serious verification

"I hope this will wake up some who have supported the Assad regime to realise its murderous and barbaric nature," Foreign Secretary William Hague said on a visit to Paris

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

... the only reason I can think of for not erring towards suspecting this is a put up job is that it looks too much like a put up job

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The gas was also used in the suburbs of Damascus - surely too close to Assad's own people if the wind changed, assuming that the people killed were not his in the first place.

Awful, awful thing. Someone somewhere did an evil thing in a world of evil things.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lots of calls for weapons inspectors to be allowed to inspect the area but given it is in rebel hands and part of a war zone that would seem to be less than practical.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lots of calls for weapons inspectors to be allowed to inspect the area but given it is in rebel hands and part of a war zone that would seem to be less than practical.

So the areas targeted are rebel held? Then it could indeed have been the regime wanting to clear out Damascus.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Lots of calls for weapons inspectors to be allowed to inspect the area but given it is in rebel hands and part of a war zone that would seem to be less than practical.

Given that it is a propaganda war as much as an arms war, I think that the only people I would believe would be UN weapons inspectors.

I don't know what to believe, and I am certainly not going to believe something just because I want to believe it. Or because someone else wants me to believe it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Given that it is a propaganda war as much as an arms war, I think that the only people I would believe would be UN weapons inspectors.

I don't know what to believe, and I am certainly not going to believe something just because I want to believe it. Or because someone else wants me to believe it.

Not a weapons inspector, but UN...

Telegraph (May 2013): UN accuses Syrian rebels of chemical weapons use

"According to the testimonies we have gathered, the rebels have used chemical weapons, making use of sarin gas," del Ponte, a former war crimes prosecutor, said in an interview with Swiss radio late on Sunday.

"We still have to deepen our investigation, verify and confirm (the findings) through new witness testimony, but according to what we have established so far, it is at the moment opponents of the regime who are using sarin gas," she added.

She stressed that the UN commission of inquiry on Syria, which she is a part of, had far from finished its investigation. (cont)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Massive load of military hardware and personnel in Afghanistan no longer needed there. Option A: Undertake a huge logistics operation to repatriate it. Option B: Start another war that suits our interests somewhere nearby.

In fairness, I have to say out of the two, option A does look like a bit of a faff.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Frank Gardner pontificates but offers no answers...

Two things stand out immediately in this reported Syrian attack.

Firstly, the timing is odd, bordering on suspicious. Why would the Assad government, which has recently been retaking ground from the rebels, carry out a chemical attack while UN weapons inspectors are in the country?

But secondly, the scale of the apparent casualties is far worse than any of the previous alleged chemical attacks. Experts say it would be almost impossible to fake so many dead and injured, including children and babies. They bear no visible wounds from gunshots; instead, many display the classic symptoms of a nerve agent attack, with startled, frozen expressions that experts say are reminiscent of Saddam Hussein's 1988 attack on the Kurds at Halabja.(cont.)

Why indeed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why indeed.

Because Moscow and/or Beijing told him to?

Assad is not going anywhere, because he has the support of Russia and China. It suits their interests to keep him in power and with a significant military infrastructure, primarily to deter Israel from bombing Iran, and therefore to ensure continuity of supply to Iranian oil to Russia and China. The fact that the Syrian rebels are comprised mainly of ultra-hardline Islamic nutjobs who, the US government has just confirmed, it has no intention of supporting, entrenches Assad's position even more. So this is just a show of force, I guess.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because Moscow and/or Beijing told him to?

Assad is not going anywhere, because he has the support of Russia and China. It suits their interests to keep him in power and with a significant military infrastructure, primarily to deter Israel from bombing Iran, and therefore to ensure continuity of supply to Iranian oil to Russia and China. The fact that the Syrian rebels are comprised mainly of ultra-hardline Islamic nutjobs who, the US government has just confirmed, it has no intention of supporting, entrenches Assad's position even more. So this is just a show of force, I guess.

And what's now deterring Israel from a pre-emptive strike against Syria if this was a govt attack on the rebels using chemical weapons?

Isn't it the case that the ultra-hardline Islamists involved in the rebel cause have turned off most of Syrians that supported the revolt in the first place?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Because Moscow and/or Beijing told him to?

Assad is not going anywhere, because he has the support of Russia and China. It suits their interests to keep him in power and with a significant military infrastructure, primarily to deter Israel from bombing Iran, and therefore to ensure continuity of supply to Iranian oil to Russia and China. The fact that the Syrian rebels are comprised mainly of ultra-hardline Islamic nutjobs who, the US government has just confirmed, it has no intention of supporting, entrenches Assad's position even more. So this is just a show of force, I guess.

An interesting thesis but kind of undermined by the Russian government and Russian media repeatedly insisting that these are staged provocations.

Not much point to a hypothesised show of force when you're insisting the other guy did it.

(Contrast the Russian behaviour with that of the British foreign secretary who is gagging to pin this on the Syrian government)

As to the other side of the equation and the Western establishment's solid track record for truth telling when it comes to WMD

(Russia is now the largest producer of oil in the world. So I doubt its government is that concerned about the oil side of things. Quite the opposite)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IN OTHER NEWS:

there isnt any, as all the super difficult political situations everywhere are all now gone thanks to terrists in Syria...expect new news tomorrow.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Obvious red flag attempt.

Russian sources reported yesterday that the rocket/warheads were apparently fired from rebel held areas. Just like in June this looks like an attempt by the rebellion/Western powers to force intervention.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wonder what the US (and their allies such as the UK) are hoping for from Syria?

They don't want to intervene because nobody who counts there likes the Western allies, maybe they're hoping for minimal survivors on either side?

They're certainly not concerned about people being slaughtered left and right in their thousands with conventional arms, although a few noises are being made about nerve gas attacks

Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

At least the Americans gave an honest response when asked, not waffle about humanitarianism.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At least the Americans gave an honest response when asked, not waffle about humanitarianism.

che?

Reuters (July 2013): Exclusive: U.S. congressional hurdles lifted on arming Syrian rebels

The expression 'Do not listen to what They say. Look at what They do.' comes to mind

There are going to be divisions within the US establishment, same as anywhere else, over this issue. Broadly speaking there are the neocon, Dick Cheney/ John McCain, types who are all out for direct intervention and the Machiavellian Zbigniew Brzezinski types who favour more indirect means of maintaining US hegemony.

A really shocking, high profile incident, like oooh say a mass biological weapon attack, could easily tip things in the direction of the advocates of direct action.

Something would just have to be done by a 'reluctant' Western establishment.

Dempsey didn't rule out intervention. He simply said it wasn't an approach favoured by the US government.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In other news, the CIA has just fessed up to staging the 1953 Iranian Coup and the ousting of democratically elected terrorist 'communist' Mohammad Mossadeq.

BBC: CIA documents acknowledge its role in Iran's 1953 coup

So, on that basis, we'll only have to wait till 2073 for (partial) disclosure of what the CIA is up to in Syria.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, on that basis, we'll only have to wait till 2073 for (partial) disclosure of what the CIA is up to in Syria.

I agree, it would be naive to think that the CIA and Mossad aren't up to their necks in this unfolding mess. But I also wondered whether this latest gas attack might not have been carried out by the extremist elements of the rebellion as a provocation to bring in Western assistance.... The extremists certainly don't seem to mind killing their own people for the cause, and perhaps it also serves as an effective psychological weapon: warning the general populace what happens to those who withdraw support from the rebellion?

Who knows. But I certainly can't swallow this as is currently being presented to the world, there is certainly more going on than meets the eye...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • The Prime Minister stated that there were three Brexit options available to the UK:   224 members have voted

    1. 1. Which of the Prime Minister's options would you choose?


      • Leave with the negotiated deal
      • Remain
      • Leave with no deal

    Please sign in or register to vote in this poll. View topic


×

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.