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Good Use Of Fire Service Resources?

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So, there are four fire appliances and crews + 1 x senior Fire bod who came in a car in attendance at an incident in our village right now.

They have been here for about 2 hours already and will be here a while yet.

The disaster that requires this level of resource?

A cow has got stuck in a small river that runs through its field and they are trying to get it out.

Does that represent a sensible use of the Fire Service?

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The traditional image is of them running into burning houses to save people. When ever a representative is challenged over their terms and conditions you can bet the response is going to be "how much would you pay...."

I wonder if that image is really true.

There were 212 deaths in dwelling house fires in 2010/11 Fire statistics monitor.

There are approximately 60,000 firefighters in the UK My link

I would guess that the number of people actually saved by the fire service from dwelling fires is substantially less than the number killed but for these purposes lets assume they're the same.

Over a 30 year career that's 6,000 people saved, i.e. there's a 1/10 chance that over a career they'll save one person.

Now obviously they work as a work as a team so the above analysis is a bit artificial but I think it is instructive none the less.

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The traditional image is of them running into burning houses to save people. When ever a representative is challenged over their terms and conditions you can bet the response is going to be "how much would you pay...."

I wonder if that image is really true.

There were 212 deaths in dwelling house fires in 2010/11 Fire statistics monitor.

There are approximately 60,000 firefighters in the UK My link

I would guess that the number of people actually saved by the fire service from dwelling fires is substantially less than the number killed but for these purposes lets assume they're the same.

Over a 30 year career that's 6,000 people saved, i.e. there's a 1/10 chance that over a career they'll save one person.

Now obviously they work as a work as a team so the above analysis is a bit artificial but I think it is instructive none the less.

It's a decent enough argument you make, but if you were that one person...?

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Reminds me of the time back at school. A technician had gone to the outside chemical store, and had knocked over a container of acid, which fell to the floor, cracked and started leaking fuming nitric acid. They were unable to deploy the spillage clean-up kit due to the fumes. They retreated, closed and locked the door. The courtyard around the chemical store was sealed off, and classrooms that faced the yard evacuated.

The school secretary phoned the local fire station, and asked for assistance by a hazmat crew with breathing apparatus, so that the spill-kit could be used, making clear that the spill had been contained, the area had been evacuated and that there were no injuries.

A total of 8 fire appliances, 4 ambulances, 2 paramedic cars and 2 police cars turned up in convoy with blue-lights and sirens blaring.

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The traditional image is of them running into burning houses to save people. When ever a representative is challenged over their terms and conditions you can bet the response is going to be "how much would you pay...."

I wonder if that image is really true.

There were 212 deaths in dwelling house fires in 2010/11 Fire statistics monitor.

There are approximately 60,000 firefighters in the UK My link

I would guess that the number of people actually saved by the fire service from dwelling fires is substantially less than the number killed but for these purposes lets assume they're the same.

Over a 30 year career that's 6,000 people saved, i.e. there's a 1/10 chance that over a career they'll save one person.

Now obviously they work as a work as a team so the above analysis is a bit artificial but I think it is instructive none the less.

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It's not just fires though is it. My brother did 12 years in the retained fire service and a significant part of the job was road accidents and cutting people out of the wreckage.

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If the farmer tries to rescue the cow, they'll be down there to him later, so they may as well rescue the cow now.

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A friend knew one of the retained firefighters down here, it was an open secret that when it got quiet and they hadn't been paid for a shout for a while then a gorse fire would "happen". Cue everybody out in the sunshine for two hours, chatting and occasionally stopping to beat out the fire.

This a service that is ripe for reform.

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But if they are sitting doing nothing, why not help out? I would say the question is what happens when a higher priority call comes in.

They don't obviously just put out fires either. I wouldn't be surprised if attending car accidents wasn't there most common job.

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Simple.

First they have to sit there and complete risk assessment on the Fire Appliance computer before they're allowed to start work on the job.

Secondly, they don't get nearly as many calls as they used to - down 31% since 2000/01 - due to use of modern building and furnishing materials, so at the least sign of an incident, they all converge, each hoping to be a hero. :ph34r:

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It's not just fires though is it. My brother did 12 years in the retained fire service and a significant part of the job was road accidents and cutting people out of the wreckage.

True, but chopping the roof off someones car doesn't have quite the same emotional pull as running into a burning building.

And it does beg the question as to why this is a fire service duty anyway, other than they've nothing better to do.

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True, but chopping the roof off someones car doesn't have quite the same emotional pull as running into a burning building.

And it does beg the question as to why this is a fire service duty anyway, other than they've nothing better to do.

Unless you are going to fit out Ambulances or Police cars who else is going to carry the equipment to do this? In anycase a fire engine is a much better platform for running this type of equipment with onboard generators and compressors. Furthermore in any serious road accident with people trapped the FB will automatically attend due to the risk of fire following an accident.

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A friend knew one of the retained firefighters down here, it was an open secret that when it got quiet and they hadn't been paid for a shout for a while then a gorse fire would "happen". Cue everybody out in the sunshine for two hours, chatting and occasionally stopping to beat out the fire.

This a service that is ripe for reform.

From what my brother said when they effectively cut the standby allowance to 50p an hour they had to do something to make all the time and effort worthwhile <_<

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I think some of you may have negative views about firemen! A former colleague of mine was a fireman based as Speedwell in Bristol They were called out to get a cat out of a tree. Then they had to call the neighbouring firestation, to get a fireman out of the tree! :blink:

When I lived in Brighton, I came back from the pub, and was smelling petrol. Actually it was pissing out of MY car! Firemen came round and washed the petrol away, although it was me and my mole wrench that stopped it leaking!

When I was a kid, my dad lit a bonfire on his allotment. The fire spread and fire engines turned up and charged him thirty shillings for being a daft bugger! :blink:

I think quite highly of the firemen! They deal with everything! :D

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I think some of you may have negative views about firemen! A former colleague of mine was a fireman based as Speedwell in Bristol They were called out to get a cat out of a tree. Then they had to call the neighbouring firestation, to get a fireman out of the tree! :blink:

When I lived in Brighton, I came back from the pub, and was smelling petrol. Actually it was pissing out of MY car! Firemen came round and washed the petrol away, although it was me and my mole wrench that stopped it leaking!

When I was a kid, my dad lit a bonfire on his allotment. The fire spread and fire engines turned up and charged him thirty shillings for being a daft bugger! :blink:

I think quite highly of the firemen! They deal with everything! :D

My brother was highly critical of cat stuck in tree call outs on the basis of how many emaciated cat bodies do you see in trees - none because when they get hungry they come down. He said if noone was about they used to just hose them out of the tree :D

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My brother was highly critical of cat stuck in tree call outs on the basis of how many emaciated cat bodies do you see in trees - none because when they get hungry they come down. He said if noone was about they used to just hose them out of the tree :D

Well cats aren't that bright! On of mine got in the cabinet in the kitchen, got behind the back bit and ended up in the base of it and couldn't get out!! I could just hear a small noise, and wondered where the cat was. Eventually I pulled the bottom off the kitchen unit and "Einstein" was revealed! :lol:

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But if they are sitting doing nothing, why not help out? I would say the question is what happens when a higher priority call comes in.

They don't obviously just put out fires either. I wouldn't be surprised if attending car accidents wasn't there most common job.

I'd think attending car accidents would be a higher rate of attendance than house fires. I know a fireman who actually was off duty but happened to be a few hundred metres away when a car with a few youngsters in piled into the supports of a dual carriageway and trapped inside, he arrived just after with his mate. Unfortunetely they couldn't get the last person out of the car and she burned to death basically, the other two survived with one guys leg virtually ripped off, sorry to be a bit graphic. That and other things caused the FM to have a mental breakdown soon after.

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Time for the State to get out of the fire business and for people to take out "Fire Insurance". You`ve got it and a fire engine comes round, you haven`t and you burn to death.

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Time for the State to get out of the fire business and for people to take out "Fire Insurance". You`ve got it and a fire engine comes round, you haven`t and you burn to death.

We are just going to put you on hold until we have ascertained whether your policy covers for this eventuality / whether your premiums are up to date <_<

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We are just going to put you on hold until we have ascertained whether your policy covers for this eventuality / whether your premiums are up to date <_<

I have burnt to death many times! All it takes is a few teenager's blood! Isn't that right Mr Barlow? :o

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Time for the State to get out of the fire business and for people to take out "Fire Insurance". You`ve got it and a fire engine comes round, you haven`t and you burn to death.

Been done before:

21_sun_fire_mark.jpg

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I'd think attending car accidents would be a higher rate of attendance than house fires. I know a fireman who actually was off duty but happened to be a few hundred metres away when a car with a few youngsters in piled into the supports of a dual carriageway and trapped inside, he arrived just after with his mate. Unfortunetely they couldn't get the last person out of the car and she burned to death basically, the other two survived with one guys leg virtually ripped off, sorry to be a bit graphic. That and other things caused the FM to have a mental breakdown soon after.

A horrible experience obviously, but if I saw a car slam into a bridge abutment I'd stop and do what I could, including pulling someone's leg off if it was that or have them burn to death. I say this not to criticise your fireman friend, because having never had such a traumatic experience I don't know how I'd deal with the emotional fallout, it might well break me emotionally too. But I know myself well enough from various emergencies that I have been involved with to say with certainty that I'd pile in to help- and I as a private citizen don't get the slightest hint of 'danger money' in my remuneration.

To the OP- yes on the face of it it's an overreaction, but if the firemen were otherwise sitting about waiting for a call there's no harm- I'm pretty sure that if a shout for a life-threatening fire had come in most of them would have hopped back in their 'appliances' and shot off to it.

However, the last time there was a national fire service strike, with Green Goddeses getting involved etc., my local firefighters were earning ~£38k P/A. I thought 'TBH I'll have a bit of that', went on the fire service website and found they were not recruiting. That's not price discovery in action, is it?

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As long as they're not actually ignoring a fire blazing somewhere else, is it just me that finds it endearing that even today not everything is related to money?

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Well it takes all sorts

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jul/30/*****-toaster-message-fire-brigade-fiftyshadesofred

:unsure:

link not working -

Guardian

Do try not to get your ***** stuck in a toaster. A message from the fire brigade

Our #FiftyShadesofRed campaign is designed to remind people we should be attending fires, not tambourines on heads or yet another handcuff incident

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