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Ford Shuts Down Uk Plants

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Bye bye.

http://www.worldbulletin.net/?aType=haber&ArticleID=113410

World Bulletin/News Desk

Second-largest US car maker Ford, which recently closed down its 40-year-old Southampton plant, will be closing its Dagenham plant on July 26 and switching production to its Kocaeli plant in Turkey, where, according to Ford, the costs are “significantly lower” than anywhere in Europe, even after delivery charges.

According to media reports, a further 750 jobs will be axed with the final UK plant closure in addition to the 531 employees that were dismissed after the Southampton closure. The Southampton plant was used for Ford Transit production, while the Dagenham plant had tool and stamping operations.

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Ford have been a bunch of professional panhandlers for decades. The number of times they say to governments around the world, "give us a hand out or we will die on your doorstep" is uncountable.

I expect they extracted big tax concessions from the Turkish government who are desperate to keep their growth going in the face of riots.

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Bye bye.

http://www.worldbulletin.net/?aType=haber&ArticleID=113410

World Bulletin/News Desk

Second-largest US car maker Ford, which recently closed down its 40-year-old Southampton plant, will be closing its Dagenham plant on July 26 and switching production to its Kocaeli plant in Turkey, where, according to Ford, the costs are “significantly lower” than anywhere in Europe, even after delivery charges.

According to media reports, a further 750 jobs will be axed with the final UK plant closure in addition to the 531 employees that were dismissed after the Southampton closure. The Southampton plant was used for Ford Transit production, while the Dagenham plant had tool and stamping operations.

1 week's notice for the workers? Shame on Ford.

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1 week's notice for the workers? Shame on Ford.

Yay for globalisation!

Not.

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and switching production to its Kocaeli plant in Turkey, where, according to Ford, the costs are “significantly lower” than anywhere in Europe, even after delivery charges.

So how does this work- everyone relocates to a cheap labour location and exports the products back into a higher wage location in order to sell them?

And where do the higher wages in that high wage location come from if everyone has relocated their business to a low wage location?

I don't blame Ford for what they are doing- it makes sense from their viewpoint- but in aggregate the strategy is a classic 'tragedy of the commons' scenario-

In economics, the tragedy of the commons is the depletion of a shared resource by individuals, acting independently and rationally according to each one's self-interest, despite their understanding that depleting the common resource is contrary to the group's long-term best interests.

The 'shared resource' in this case being the wage driven demand for goods and services.

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1374249688[/url]' post='909360651']

So how does this work- everyone relocates to a cheap labour location and exports the products back into a higher wage location in order to sell them?

And where do the higher wages in that high wage location come from if everyone has relocated their business to a low wage location?

I don't blame Ford for what they are doing- it makes sense from their viewpoint- but in aggregate the strategy is a classic 'tragedy of the commons' scenario-

In economics, the tragedy of the commons is the depletion of a shared resource by individuals, acting independently and rationally according to each one's self-interest, despite their understanding that depleting the common resource is contrary to the group's long-term best interests.

The 'shared resource' in this case being the wage driven demand for goods and services.

I had no idea it had a name. Do you think they're allowed to mention this in the boardrooms? Would love to be fly on the wall if it happened. I presume they rinse & repeat till sales fall to an unacceptable level, then start paying a wage that will allow for this kind of purchase again.

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The 'shared resource' in this case being the wage driven demand for goods and services.

Sounds like good news for savers then. More like a tragedy of the debtors scenario. I'm a bit fed up with your common resource collective responsibility business model, whilst non-owning savers subsidise big mortgage debtors and prevent landlords going under with QE and 0.5% rates and all the other stimulus. If UK people set their stall out for constant pay-rises that's their own choice.

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Sounds like good news for savers then. More like a tragedy of the debtors scenario.

Seriously? And what exactly are you going to be 'saving' in this scenario?

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I had no idea it had a name. Do you think they're allowed to mention this in the boardrooms? Would love to be fly on the wall if it happened. I presume they rinse & repeat till sales fall to an unacceptable level, then start paying a wage that will allow for this kind of purchase again.

It probably takes a collapse (or some serious trade embargoes). Once you start, you can't stop. Let's say you have two car manufacturers. One pays their workers a decent wage, so that the workers can afford to buy cars, the other relocates to Arseholeatania. The relocator's cars are therefore cheaper, so the workers buy those cars, not the ones they're making.

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I had no idea it had a name. Do you think they're allowed to mention this in the boardrooms? Would love to be fly on the wall if it happened. I presume they rinse & repeat till sales fall to an unacceptable level, then start paying a wage that will allow for this kind of purchase again.

Particularly ironic given Henry Ford's opinion on the subject...

wiki: Henry Ford

Ford astonished the world in 1914 by offering a $5 per day wage ($110 today), which more than doubled the rate of most of his workers.[21] A Cleveland, Ohio newspaper editorialized that the announcement "shot like a blinding rocket through the dark clouds of the present industrial depression."[22] The move proved extremely profitable; instead of constant turnover of employees, the best mechanics in Detroit flocked to Ford, bringing their human capital and expertise, raising productivity, and lowering training costs.[23][24] Ford announced his $5-per-day program on January 5, 1914, raising the minimum daily pay from $2.34 to $5 for qualifying workers. It also set a new, reduced workweek, although the details vary in different accounts. Ford and Crowther in 1922 described it as six 8-hour days, giving a 48-hour week,[25] while in 1926 they described it as five 8-hour days, giving a 40-hour week.[26] (Apparently the program started with Saturdays as workdays and sometime later it was changed to a day off.)

Detroit was already a high-wage city, but competitors were forced to raise wages or lose their best workers.[27] Ford's policy proved, however, that paying people more would enable Ford workers to afford the cars they were producing and be good for the economy. Ford explained the policy as profit-sharing rather than wages.[28]

Edited by Nuggets Mahoney

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Seriously? And what exactly are you going to be 'saving' in this scenario?

Not Ford specific. Just in aggregate when more companies do it, including perhaps banks next when they consider their domicile.

I happen to want a house price crash, and don't want to be competing against people who need a wage-driven demand to pay higher prices for houses Or to sustain the house prices that have already been reached given too many people have over-borrowed, and had the best of policy for 5 years to prevent them meeting the consequences.

Forgive me for thinking about individuals, not toward the over-indebted group.

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It probably takes a collapse (or some serious trade embargoes). Once you start, you can't stop. Let's say you have two car manufacturers. One pays their workers a decent wage, so that the workers can afford to buy cars, the other relocates to Arseholeatania. The relocator's cars are therefore cheaper, so the workers buy those cars, not the ones they're making.

So,

The answer is high import tariffs?

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Not Ford specific. Just in aggregate when more companies do it, including perhaps banks next when they consider their domicile.

I happen to want a house price crash, and don't want to be competing against people who need a wage-driven demand to pay higher prices for houses Or to sustain the house prices that have already been reached given too many people have over-borrowed, and had the best of policy for 5 years to prevent them meeting the consequences.

Forgive me for thinking about individuals, not toward the over-indebted group.

I dunno - it sounds like you want to buy a house in a wasteland where people are paid tuppence a day. The thing is, the tragedy of the commons has nothing to do with savers and debtors.

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If the country had been run properly and had a more balanced economy then some of Ford's redundant skilled workers could have been deployed into some other technical area but if they're lucky they'll just have to become skilled burger flippers and skilled tax credit claim form fillers.

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I had no idea it had a name. Do you think they're allowed to mention this in the boardrooms? Would love to be fly on the wall if it happened. I presume they rinse & repeat till sales fall to an unacceptable level, then start paying a wage that will allow for this kind of purchase again.

The reason it's a tragedy is that even if everyone involved realises that in the long run they are destroying themselves they have no choice but to carry on.

Any company that chose to pay higher wages would just get driven out of business by those who paid less and undercut their prices.

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So how does this work- everyone relocates to a cheap labour location and exports the products back into a higher wage location in order to sell them?

Ironically, it was founder Henry Ford that realised if you want to create a market for goods you have to have well paid workers. We keep on shedding them and celebrate the opening of a Lidl for providing a few tax-credit supported slave jobs..

Edited by CrashedOutAndBurned

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Any company that chose to pay higher wages would just get driven out of business by those who paid less and undercut their prices.

Sadly I don't think there's much chance that David Hockney will be driven out of business by wonderpup so your theory needs work.

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Bad news. I knew some people at the Dagenham plant.

However it used to be a requirement that if you want to trade in the EU or the UK you had to have some form of manufacturing presence in the UK. So for a while Jap TV sets were assembled here and its why Honda. Toyota and Nissan have plants here.

I guess that was a few global trading agreements ago. But this could open a few floodgates

RIP: Manufacturing UK

Edited by Secure Tenant

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Sounds like good news for savers then. More like a tragedy of the debtors scenario. I'm a bit fed up with your common resource collective responsibility business model, whilst non-owning savers subsidise big mortgage debtors and prevent landlords going under with QE and 0.5% rates and all the other stimulus. If UK people set their stall out for constant pay-rises that's their own choice.

You are conflating two issues here. The point of the tragedy of the commons is that nobody wins. The best example is that of a fire in a crowded space- if everyone panics and rushes toward the door the result may be that the door gets blocked and everyone dies- if people don't panic and act in a more coordinated way they might all get out safely.

So there are situations in which everyone acting only in their self interest-as opposed to the wider groups interest- lead to far worse outcomes for the individuals concerned.

So while it might make perfect sense for companies on an individual level to locate their production in the lowest wage locations- on an aggregate level they might end up destroying the market for their products since there will be few high wage earners around who can afford to buy them. As a general rule the people in low wage locations employed to make things like IPads tend not to be the people who can afford to buy them.

Of course in a competitive market it's impossible to not act selfishly- if you don't you will be driven out of business by cheaper competitors.

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http://www.yellowad....0%20JOBS%20AXED

FORD'S tooling plant at Dagenham will close next Friday with the loss of 750 skilled jobs.

Four-hundred workers have been redeployed within the company and the remaining 350 have taken voluntary redundancy.

The Unite union has condemned the closure.

"Skilled workers have been thrown on the scrapheap and their jobs gone for ever, " said union national officer Roger Maddison.

The car giant announced restructuring within Ford Europe last autumn leading to the closures at Dagenham and at the Transit assembly plant in Southampton, which shuts on July 26, too.

"It was obvious from the beginning of negotiations over restructuring that Ford was determined to close the Dagenham plant, despite our arguments to keep it open," Mr Maddison said.

He believes the Dagenham plant could have diversified to repair and maintain tools for whole of Ford Europe.

"The plant had the skill and capacity to do that, but it was obvious whatever we said the company was determined to send the work overseas," he added. "Mark Stephens, our convener, went to Detroit to talk to Ford, which had brought work back in-house fr om Mexico, but the answer was the same – closure."

Ford claims the closures were unavoidable because of a 20 percent drop in vehicle demand in Western Europe.

Stephen Odell, president of Ford Europe, said: "We understand the impact of these restructuring actions on our employees and have provided individual support to ensure all employees have made informed decisions about their futures on a voluntary basis.

l FORD is to produce a new engine as part of it "continuing commitment to maintain UK investment."

The next generation low-CO2, 2-litre diesel engine will be developed at the company's technical centre in Dunton, Essex and manufactured at Dagenham from 2016, to power future Ford vehicles in Europe and beyond. Ford's UK operations 'remain a global centre for engine development and production'. "We are reaffirming our commitment to the UK with a major investment in engines and engineering, which reinforces the UK's central role in Ford's global powertrain strategy and commercial vehicle engineering," said Stephen Odell.

Edited by Secure Tenant

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Sadly I don't think there's much chance that David Hockney will be driven out of business by wonderpup so your theory needs work.

It's not my theory- it's been around a long time. Besides your analogy is flawed because you describe a scenario where no cheaper version of the original is possible. It's just as true to say that I could never be replaced by Hockney, since-by definition- a painting by Hockney is not a painting by Wonderpup.

Those lucky enough to possess unique and irreplaceable skills or talents will be immune- sadly that is not many people- most of us are rather expendable.

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So how does this work- everyone relocates to a cheap labour location and exports the products back into a higher wage location in order to sell them?

And where do the higher wages in that high wage location come from if everyone has relocated their business to a low wage location?

I don't blame Ford for what they are doing- it makes sense from their viewpoint- but in aggregate the strategy is a classic 'tragedy of the commons' scenario-

In economics, the tragedy of the commons is the depletion of a shared resource by individuals, acting independently and rationally according to each one's self-interest, despite their understanding that depleting the common resource is contrary to the group's long-term best interests.

The 'shared resource' in this case being the wage driven demand for goods and services.

The only reason we have a higher wage requirement is because of high housing costs. Jesus *ucking wept. An intilgent toddler could have worked that one out.

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  • 242 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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