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right_freds_dead

The Main Reason There Wont Be A Crash

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ive been on here since feb 05. the situation is as dire now as it was then. its never on the news about how many people are priced out. its never a debate in parliment. its never addresses. this site is about the only refuge for the priced out. even then its not much. its mainly yawning charts and financial predictions, the famous YOY 2% falls in sydney and of course. the SIPPS myth debunked.

well woop dee doo. SIPPS myth debunked. thats going to stop it dead in its tracks. wow. you debunked it. ive got news for you. SIPPS will kick your sorry assess even more than now. prices will never go back to reality and you will be paying 6x salary from here on in.

why ?

becuase no one has the backbone to stand up and say enough is enough. no one dare protest. no one cares to let the government and media know that not everyone is sharing this new economic 'miracle'.

no - no change needed. no one here is going to do anything other than bleat on about the crash and continue to take it on the chin for another few years. then another few after that. wake up.!!!

YOU are the voters. YOU are the buyers. YOU have the right to protest. YOU can change this, not take it. all you have to do is attend a march to downing street on a saturday afternoon. this is YOUR country. YOU have the right to afford to live here and the government has a duty to provide its citizens with affordable housing. we want answers.

will we get them - no.

not as long as your all happy to read this junk every month, while rents rise and prices stagnate at insane levels. all within 24 months. 95% of this country were already homed before the boom. they will not be paying half their wages on housing. they are not nailed to insane debt for nothing more than a pile of bricks 7m x 18m wide. has it come to this.

they have no sympathy for you know. they will have less in the future. they dont give a sh1t about you. you dont even give sh1t about you. your taking this like a sack of sad muppetts. gutless. timewasting. bleating sheeple who havent the balls to stand up for your rights.

STR - you made a bad mistake.

FTB - 21st century slave.

the rip off is well deserved. they are welcome to all your savings. please - take them.

your soft in the head. you dont need them. your stupid enough to live like this, acceptable in a modern day democracy - i dont think so.

but then, i seem to be the only one.

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So what do you want others to do RFD? Start thinking about buying property now like you did? Or suddenly change the tune and become bull like Monkey did? Do you advise us to march to the parliament? You said the majority have houses- they voted for Tony B liar and Great Bull. what can we do about that? go to the Tory camp? They themselves want house prices up to protect their rich voters in the south East!

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RFD

I'm a would be FTB, when I read your half/dim-witted attempts to irritate the folk who frequent the forum I was bored by the time I'd reached the end of 1st paragraph.

By the end I found it a joke & to be honest I'm now even more bored so thats it rant over.

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I know of a new workers party being formed in the UK to represent the aspirations of working people, and housing will certainly be a priority, as you say people may be too apathetic nowadays to get actively involved

but I am not so sure. It is often the case that it is only when the people have their backs against the wall they will be moved to act.

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I know of a new workers party being formed in the UK to represent the aspirations of working people, and housing will certainly be a priority, as you say people may be too apathetic nowadays to get actively involved

but I am not so sure. It is often the case that it is only when the people have their backs against the wall they will be moved to act.

workers party eh. Lets call it something to do with work...

hard work, erm, toil, erm, no I've got it labour.

Oh yes.

Power corrupts.

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Fred, it's bad enough having the VI's constantly heaping sh1t all over FTB's without you getting in on the act as well. If you had ONE decent suggestion, just one, I would listen to you. But all you can offer is marches and writing to your MP and writing to the Times and the Sunday Telegraph; what next, organised sit-ins for FTB's, holding hands, singing "Kumbayah" round the campfire? I've got news for you, that will achieve ABSOLUTELY F**K-ALL for FTB's in this country. Even organised squatting would be a more practical solution than that (but then no doubt we would be labelled as 'criminal lawbreakers').

FTB's ARE SCREWED IN THIS COUNTRY. THERE IS NO WAY OUT.

And no, this is not pathetic defeatism or political apathy or any other of those tired and inaccurate stereotypes; it is a simple recognition that EVERYTHING in this country is stacked against the FTB, the government, the financial system, estate agents, even our parents for ****'s sake!

Edited by IPOD

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well woop dee doo. SIPPS myth debunked. thats going to stop it dead in its tracks. wow. you debunked it. ive got news for you. SIPPS will kick your sorry assess even more than now. prices will never go back to reality and you will be paying 6x salary from here on in.

why ?

becuase no one has the backbone to stand up and say enough is enough. no one dare protest. no one cares to let the government and media know that not everyone is sharing this new economic 'miracle'.

In which case things will just run its course without any intervention. Flat prices and lack of buyers (esp. FTB) is a function of the market, it's like a pyramid scheme, they run out of fools or money, or fools with money and then it corrects.

Prices will come down to rope in a new round of buyers, once those have been used up prices will have to fall further to rope in yet another round, maybe a rate cut will do that instead of prices but after 2-3 months that 'hit' will be absorbed and yet more falls in prices and rate cuts will be needed to rope in the next round, by that time people may have twigged that maybe this is not a good time to buy, after all the prices will be cheaper still next month... best wait until then, then the whole thing slowly unwinds.

It's not a case of being obstinate but rather the sheer unaffordability that prevents the market moving forward. You can jump up and down outside Parliament all you like but eventually the market will do the work for you, no doubt you could take the credit for correction anyway :) Estate Agents and the media can do all they can but if the figures don't stack up the market is screwed, it's like trying to get a bunch of tramps to buy a Roller, no doubt they'd love one but what about the numbers, maybe the lenders will accept empty bottles as a deposit?

Edited by BuyingBear

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RFD

I'm a would be FTB, when I read your half/dim-witted attempts to irritate the folk who frequent the forum I was bored by the time I'd reached the end of 1st paragraph.

By the end I found it a joke & to be honest I'm now even more bored so thats it rant over.

I find this attitude irritating - questioning whether the HPC will happen in the short-term is perfectly valid; it is not a betrayal of "the cause."

Being a bear should be based on facts - it seems to have become an act of faith.

Also, agree with RFD - my decision to STR in '04 is increasingly looking like a bad decision.

Oh, and count me in for the march.

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workers party eh. Lets call it something to do with work...

hard work, erm, toil, erm, no I've got it labour.

Oh yes.

Power corrupts.

As New Labour has abandoned the working class in favour of big business, there is a growing demand

for political representaion for the ordinary joe who might just be getting fed up with being screwed.

However there will be many who will just winge and moan and take the piss, and hope someone else

fights their battles for them

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Some of you lot just don't get it, do you? You talk as though someone, or some organisation, sits down and sets the selling price of homes and is screwing you for every penny.

Get real - houses are the price they are because that's what pople are paying for them. When they stop paying those prices they will fall to match what people will pay. FTBs are "screwed" because other FTBs are paying the asking price.

What do you expect a march to achieve, that market forces can't?

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Fred is broadly right.

I think few here realise just how third world housing has become in this country. Most here are contemplating buying at some point in the future, but what about the 1.5 million families in cramped, shoddy B&Bs - the damp infested fleapits with electric heaters in them? What about the worker who has to hand over half their income to rent a dreadful room from some Rachman - the sort of holes that used to feature in 80s heroin documentaries to scare schoolkids?

How are kids going to grow up spluttering with asthma in their crappy damp tempory housing, how are they going to find a quiet place to do their homework? What state are their parents going to be in living through all this? Future social problems right there - 1.5 million of them under 'Labour'.

What about the working or lower middle class kid that plays the game at school, passes their exams, doesn't rock the boat, gets a degree only to end up with 12-20k of debt and job market that creates dozens of slave-wage jobs are every living wage position? People that would have probably bought a one bed flat or starter home within a couple of years of graduation in the 90s, even if they didn't land a dream job. You can add them to the Rachman/Student/House Sharers.

What about those on a good salary that have been bamboozled into buying crap properties with vast mortgages by BILLIONS of quidsworth of PR and marketing from banks, every newspaper, dozens of TV shows, the radio, estate agents, the BBC? Many of these will suffers years of debt-slave penury or even repossession?

What has been the counter argument? The odd article quoting some economist/report/data utterly obscure to the the average bloke in the street. The odd Daily Express front page interspersed with amazing new Diana evidence and terrorist asylum seekers. An amatuer website. The workplace/pub/family crash theorist. Some feeble-minded appeals to the free market fairy. That's about it.

People here slate Brown and Blair daily but many don't fully appreciate how rapid and brutal the assualt on quality of life has been for millions of people under NuLabour's crony-capitalist Thatcherism.

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SIPPS will kick your sorry assess even more than now.

becuase no one has the backbone to stand up and say enough is enough. no one dare protest. no one cares to let the government and media know that not everyone is sharing this new economic 'miracle'.

no - no change needed. no one here is going to do anything other than bleat on about the crash and continue to take it on the chin for another few years. then another few after that. wake up.!!!

not as long as your all happy to read this junk every month, while rents rise and prices stagnate at insane levels.

they have no sympathy for you know. they will have less in the future. they dont give a sh1t about you. you dont even give sh1t about you. your taking this like a sack of sad muppetts. gutless. timewasting. bleating sheeple who havent the balls to stand up for your rights.

the rip off is well deserved. they are welcome to all your savings. please - take them.

your soft in the head. you dont need them. your stupid enough to live like this, acceptable in a modern day democracy - i dont think so.

All the above include you Fred. When was the last time we say you dressed up in your spandex CrashMan suit scaling Big Ben?

but then, i seem to be the only one

The only one to do what? Bemoan on a house price crash website?

If you want something done properly... do it yourself. Be the f***in HPC role model. Break the mould. Do something yourself. Start the ball rolling. After all, all you are doing is moaning about moaners.

See you on News At Ten. :rolleyes:

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Guest horace

>>rfd

Property (the sale and purchase of) is a market. Prices can go up they can also fall.

I think it was Mrs T who coined the adage `you can`t buck the market`

Protests of the type you suggest would, imo, be fruitless.

horace.

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Some of you lot just don't get it, do you? You talk as though someone, or some organisation, sits down and sets the selling price of homes and is screwing you for every penny.

Get real - houses are the price they are because that's what pople are paying for them. When they stop paying those prices they will fall to match what people will pay. FTBs are "screwed" because other FTBs are paying the asking price.

What do you expect a march to achieve, that market forces can't?

Rubbish.

Council homes sold off were not replaced because powerful people decided not to build any more. 'The market' didn't do anything.

Credit was deregulated by powerful people to give banking interest easy profits while exposing the public to debt-addiction. The market didn't do anything.

Powerful people allowed the spread of btl mortgages. The market didn't do anything.

Powerful people decided not to clamp down hard on large-scale mortgage fraud. The market didn't do anything'.

Powerful people decided to give a discount on second home council tax instead of making it MORE expensive. The market didn't do anything.

Powerful people decided to spend billions and billions in PR to get people to massively overextend themselves, billions spinning any data that suggested it was a bad data. Who the heck actively WANTS to borrow more than they can afford? Powerful people actively worked to create this subversion of consumer choice. The market didn't do anything.

etc. etc.

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Even organised squatting would be a more practical solution than that (but then no doubt we would be labelled as 'criminal lawbreakers').

Thats a great idea, i would be up for that. I would have no problem being called a law breaker. Were all the squatting rights screwed up a few years ago or is there any way of doing it these days?? I would not mind living in some of those new flats. I would need a couple though to have enough room. We could have a hpc towerblock

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Fred,

Much as I love you to bits old boy, I can't help but think everyone here, including you, would have been better off if you'd have stuck to your capitulation. Then you would have suddenly been able to see the market from an OO position, and you wouldn't have written that Corporal Jones-esque "don't panic" post.

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Rubbish.

Council homes sold off were not replaced because powerful people decided not to build any more. 'The market' didn't do anything.

Credit was deregulated by powerful people to give banking interest easy profits while exposing the public to debt-addiction. The market didn't do anything.

Powerful people allowed the spread of btl mortgages. The market didn't do anything.

Powerful people decided not to clamp down hard on large-scale mortgage fraud. The market didn't do anything'.

Powerful people decided to give a discount on second home council tax instead of making it MORE expensive. The market didn't do anything.

Powerful people decided to spend billions and billions in PR to get people to massively overextend themselves, billions spinning any data that suggested it was a bad data. Who the heck actively WANTS to borrow more than they can afford? Powerful people actively worked to create this subversion of consumer choice. The market didn't do anything.

etc. etc.

Don't talk nonsense - you sound like a paranoid conspiracy theorist. Let's take BTL for example - when investments stop providing a satisfactory yield due to high purchase price, people will no longer invest in them. If people still are investing in them it means either there's a little way further to go on prices, or, more likely, investors are a little behind the pace. The market sets a limit.

Do you think the government likes the idea that FTBs are priced out? Why would they? Percentages of owner occupation has always been a key performance indicator.

Council houses were sold off years ago - that doesn't account for the rise in the last 5 years (in fact why did prices fall by 30% after the biggest tranche of council home sell-offs)

Stop looking for evil-doers. Prices are high because enough people are willing to pay them, that's all. If you were right, prices would have fallen more by now.

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Conspiracy theorist? For saying people in power and those who influence them do stuff? Why have them there? Why do they debate things? Why are lobbyists so intent on making them do things?

This'd be a good Newsnight story: 'The entire house abstained from the key vote on the People's Housing Act tonight. The PM and Leader of the Opposition both shrugged and said, 'It's the market, innit'?

The current housing boom is a huge policy failure and, yes, could have been averted with different polcies. Policies are made by people not 'the market'.

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Conspiracy theorist? For saying people in power and those who influence them do stuff? Why have them there? Why do they debate things? Why are lobbyists so intent on making them do things?

This'd be a good Newsnight story: 'The entire house abstained from the key vote on the People's Housing Act tonight. The PM and Leader of the Opposition both shrugged and said, 'It's the market, innit'?

The current housing boom is a huge policy failure and, yes, could have been averted with different polcies. Policies are made by people not 'the market'.

Conspiracy theorist because you're saying, or at least implying, that people are trying to screw you over prices. But, like with everything else, you don't have to buy, you have the option to rent instead. And if enough people are willing to buy at today's prices, who are you or I to say they are wrong?

I'd like a Lamborghini, but enough people are willing to pay more than I can afford to make this a non-option for me. I don't blame anyone, and I don't claim they are overpriced, although they probably are!. And before you say it, I know housing is more of a necessity than a luxury car but I merely use the example to demonstrate the laws of the market, which as Horace said can't be bucked.

Of course people set the rules of the market place, powerful people, as you say, but the consumer has the choiuce at the end of the day, and if people think the product is over priced and stay away then it will fall. Unfortunately, with houses not enough people think it is yet. But they will, IMO.

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Of course people set the rules of the market place, powerful people, as you say, but the consumer has the choiuce at the end of the day, and if people think the product is over priced and stay away then it will fall. Unfortunately, with houses not enough people think it is yet. But they will, IMO.

...consumers really don't have a great deal of choice when faced with a barrage of emotional blackmail.Whether you like it or not it taks incredible strength of character and willpower to resist the media and peer pressure to buy this,that and the other.

I think you have too much faith in sheeple.

I think of them as prey.

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Of course people set the rules of the market place, powerful people, as you say, but the consumer has the choiuce at the end of the day, and if people think the product is over priced and stay away then it will fall. Unfortunately, with houses not enough people think it is yet. But they will, IMO.

...consumers really don't have a great deal of choice when faced with a barrage of emotional blackmail.Whether you like it or not it taks incredible strength of character and willpower to resist the media and peer pressure to buy this,that and the other.

I think you have too much faith in sheeple.

I think of them as prey.

....... and if they are wrong they will suffer from it, and the abstainer will benefit. But if they're right and we're wrong, who are we to blame anyone for our lack of foresight?

HPI has affected me because I had hoped to trade up to a better house. I've chosen not to, whereas in reality maybe I should have done so 2 or 3 years ago. Whose fault is it, mine or those batsards somewhere plotting against me? I tend to take full responsibility for my own decision, I may prove myself right I may prove to have missed a trick. One thing's for sure though, I'm not blaming anyone else!

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ive been on here since feb 05. the situation is as dire now as it was then. its never on the news about how many people are priced out. its never a debate in parliment. its never addresses. this site is about the only refuge for the priced out. even then its not much. its mainly yawning charts and financial predictions, the famous YOY 2% falls in sydney and of course. the SIPPS myth debunked.

well woop dee doo. SIPPS myth debunked. thats going to stop it dead in its tracks. wow. you debunked it. ive got news for you. SIPPS will kick your sorry assess even more than now. prices will never go back to reality and you will be paying 6x salary from here on in.

why ?

becuase no one has the backbone to stand up and say enough is enough. no one dare protest. no one cares to let the government and media know that not everyone is sharing this new economic 'miracle'.

no - no change needed. no one here is going to do anything other than bleat on about the crash and continue to take it on the chin for another few years. then another few after that. wake up.!!!

YOU are the voters. YOU are the buyers. YOU have the right to protest. YOU can change this, not take it. all you have to do is attend a march to downing street on a saturday afternoon. this is YOUR country. YOU have the right to afford to live here and the government has a duty to provide its citizens with affordable housing. we want answers.

will we get them - no.

not as long as your all happy to read this junk every month, while rents rise and prices stagnate at insane levels. all within 24 months. 95% of this country were already homed before the boom. they will not be paying half their wages on housing. they are not nailed to insane debt for nothing more than a pile of bricks 7m x 18m wide. has it come to this.

they have no sympathy for you know. they will have less in the future. they dont give a sh1t about you. you dont even give sh1t about you. your taking this like a sack of sad muppetts. gutless. timewasting. bleating sheeple who havent the balls to stand up for your rights.

STR - you made a bad mistake.

FTB - 21st century slave.

the rip off is well deserved. they are welcome to all your savings. please - take them.

your soft in the head. you dont need them. your stupid enough to live like this, acceptable in a modern day democracy - i dont think so.

but then, i seem to be the only one.

You know my views on this Fred.

I consider you a 'friend' (if there can be such a thing without actually meeting someone!)

I hope we can agree to disagree?

Regards

s14

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Whose fault is it, mine or those batsards somewhere plotting against me? I tend to take full responsibility for my own decision, I may prove myself right I may prove to have missed a trick. One thing's for sure though, I'm not blaming anyone else!

... which brings us back to submissively taking it up the a***. :angry: We need to stop thinking of "the market" as some benevolent arbitrator which will come good in the end.

We are not on a level playing field - if there is an opportunity, or some way, to skew things back in our favour, then we should do it

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  • 302 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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