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Why Are Most People Not Even More Outraged?

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I know that we on HPC have been banging the drum about house prices for years, and we seem to be getting a bit more outrage in the media, but why do most people seem so accepting and supportive or high prices?

This house really bought it home to me today:

http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/29559483?search_identifier=6b4ba6b28c23555705e219de87c041b3

This is a small terraced house in quite a poor part of an outer London suburb. It sold for £240k in 2010 has clearly had no money spent on it since then and is now on the market three years later for £410k.

Even ignoring the fact that is a 70% increase on an already inflated 2010 price, this asking price represents over £55k ANNUAL increase in price. So that is the equivalent of someone earning an £80k salary for doing absolutely nothing. What is the point of working - just but a house, don't bother refurbishing it, don't bother renting it out and still make far more than most people will ever dream about!

The main problem is that they will probably get this price as well.

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Asking prices are not the same as selling prices. These are kite flyers. People who don't need to sell, but would just like it if someone would kindly pay them their £80k salary thankyou very much. There probably are people around stupid enough to pay it, doubt they will be native though.

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I know that we on HPC have been banging the drum about house prices for years, and we seem to be getting a bit more outrage in the media, but why do most people seem so accepting and supportive or high prices?

This house really bought it home to me today:

http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/29559483?search_identifier=6b4ba6b28c23555705e219de87c041b3

This is a small terraced house in quite a poor part of an outer London suburb. It sold for £240k in 2010 has clearly had no money spent on it since then and is now on the market three years later for £410k.

Even ignoring the fact that is a 70% increase on an already inflated 2010 price, this asking price represents over £55k ANNUAL increase in price. So that is the equivalent of someone earning an £80k salary for doing absolutely nothing. What is the point of working - just but a house, don't bother refurbishing it, don't bother renting it out and still make far more than most people will ever dream about!

The main problem is that they will probably get this price as well.

Londoners who know London know the different areas and know what is good value and not so good value depending mainly on the area, what makes a good area against a not so salubrious area is another question/topic......so the chancers are hoping incomers who know little will think all places are the same, all places make money, all places are a store of value, all places will get better, there will be more a demand for....people can't get enough of enough of enough. ;)

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Guest eight

Asking prices are not the same as selling prices. These are kite flyers. People who don't need to sell, but would just like it if someone would kindly pay them their £80k salary thankyou very much. There probably are people around stupid enough to pay it, doubt they will be native though.

I don't want to worry you but, as a northerner, if I had just seen the picture and location of that house and had to guess the price I might well have said 650K. To an outsider anything other than a flat or with more than two bedrooms anywhere in London for less than half a million looks a bit like a "bargain".

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At least it helps to boost the rightmove indices so it's not all bad ;)

Might as well make it £1 million as it's a nice round figure and just for good luck :P

Don't give them ideas.

Edited by billybong

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Is X factor on yet?

Lewis Hamilton and Nicole fit looking pussycat doll bird have split up.... again... Why aren't we talking about this?

Um, what he said. When it comes down to talking to EAs who do not know what the monthly mortgage repayments would be on the houses they are selling, how do you expect the rest of the country to care?

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I know that we on HPC have been banging the drum about house prices for years, and we seem to be getting a bit more outrage in the media, but why do most people seem so accepting and supportive or high prices?

This house really bought it home to me today:

http://www.zoopla.co...5e219de87c041b3

This is a small terraced house in quite a poor part of an outer London suburb. It sold for £240k in 2010 has clearly had no money spent on it since then and is now on the market three years later for £410k.

Even ignoring the fact that is a 70% increase on an already inflated 2010 price, this asking price represents over £55k ANNUAL increase in price. So that is the equivalent of someone earning an £80k salary for doing absolutely nothing. What is the point of working - just but a house, don't bother refurbishing it, don't bother renting it out and still make far more than most people will ever dream about!

The main problem is that they will probably get this price as well.

sounds like its a shared ownership, with help to buy thrown in.

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This is a small terraced house in quite a poor part of an outer London suburb. It sold for £240k in 2010 has clearly had no money spent on it since then and is now on the market three years later for £410k.

I think we've all missed the important features here which make this beautifully appointed property well worth £410k of anyone's money. Haven't you looked at the lovely lawn to the rear, and the flowering twigs in a vase in front of the period fire place?

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It's quite simple to explain although difficult for people with any sense to acknowledge. I have often heard from people or seen in forums words to the effect "we just bought a house, they previous buyer made £40k since buying two years ago, so we should be able to do that too". Joe Public likes to buy appreciating assets and doesn't like to "over"-analyse decisions. This is the same reason many people pile into stocks near the top - "it's been going up for ages so it must mean it'll carry on going up". There is a kind of logic to it.

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outraged about what?

homepage.png

HPC well underway, in many areas price to income ratios back to the long run average, plus ultra cheap mortgages on offer.

Anyone north of Watford should be cheering to the rafters.

So why is the silence deafening?

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I rant at every opportunity, slating high house prices as damaging, the crap planing system, the landownership elite etc.

The problem is I sound like a marxist revolutionary after a while. It's really difficult to hold back when meeting new people as well, to the detriment of my wife's sanity.

I should shut up really.

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I know that we on HPC have been banging the drum about house prices for years, and we seem to be getting a bit more outrage in the media, but why do most people seem so accepting and supportive or high prices?

This house really bought it home to me today:

http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/29559483?search_identifier=6b4ba6b28c23555705e219de87c041b3

This is a small terraced house in quite a poor part of an outer London suburb. It sold for £240k in 2010 has clearly had no money spent on it since then and is now on the market three years later for £410k.

Even ignoring the fact that is a 70% increase on an already inflated 2010 price, this asking price represents over £55k ANNUAL increase in price. So that is the equivalent of someone earning an £80k salary for doing absolutely nothing. What is the point of working - just but a house, don't bother refurbishing it, don't bother renting it out and still make far more than most people will ever dream about!

The main problem is that they will probably get this price as well.

Can't you find a job out side of London?

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Outraged? No chance in the UK. Just look at the other cr@p the UK population accept without question from a bloated and overfunded Royal family to a media industry who treat adults like 5 year olds.

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Asking prices are not the same as selling prices. These are kite flyers. People who don't need to sell, but would just like it if someone would kindly pay them their £80k salary thankyou very much. There probably are people around stupid enough to pay it, doubt they will be native though.

The problem is that there are even native people around who are paying this type of money. They are the type that have been priced out of nearby Kingston and Surbiton and view Tolworth as 'good value'. It probably is in relative terms, but a lot of 'gentrification' is required there and unlike areas closer in to London it still won't be an area with many facilities - that was why it was much cheaper than the surrounding areas in the first place.

I reckon that this will sell in excess of £375k unless something changes quite rapidly. I'd like to be proved wrong, though!

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When the bubble was full-on (about ten years ago), commentators like the BBC's 'money box' were celebrating a statistic that the average family made more in a year from HPI than from earned income.

Take heart from the change in mainstream opinion since that was something to celebrate!

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Londoners who know London know the different areas and know what is good value and not so good value depending mainly on the area, what makes a good area against a not so salubrious area is another question/topic......so the chancers are hoping incomers who know little will think all places are the same, all places make money, all places are a store of value, all places will get better, there will be more a demand for....people can't get enough of enough of enough. ;)

This is a good point and is probably a large part of the reason. Prices are going up so fast that people seem to be getting worried about missing out. It is impossible for Londoners to know all of London and I think this house is probably marketed towards people who have had friends priced out of more central areas and bought in a nice leafy part of Surbiton next to the river, see this place with the same postcode for only £400k and wonder how different it can be.

The problem is that the answer is 'very different'.

I don't want to worry you but, as a northerner, if I had just seen the picture and location of that house and had to guess the price I might well have said 650K. To an outsider anything other than a flat or with more than two bedrooms anywhere in London for less than half a million looks a bit like a "bargain".

Wow, £650k!! I know what you mean, though, some of the examples of London prices on here are quite amazing, but the price differential between the good and bad parts of London is even more marked than anywhere else. If you moved that house a mile up the road, £650k would be quite realistic, certainly as realistic as £410k in the position it actually is.

The point about flats is interesting as well and one that I have remarked about on here before. Of course people prefer a house for it's lack of neighbour noise and leasehold issues, ability to extend etc, but there surely must be a limit to the price difference? For roughly the same price as that house in the depths of Tolworth, you could buy this mansion flat in the best part of Surbiton - right by the river, shops/facilities and near the station. It is also quite a bit bigger than the Tolworth house, although I appreciate there is the ability to extend that one.

http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/28975162?search_identifier=3a2d47c722b79cce2985e83fd7045d6c

The feel of the area is so much nicer than Tolworth that you genuinely would not know you are only a mile or so away. For me, this is one of the nicest parts of suburban London compared to Tolworth which is one of the worst. I have also chosen one of the most expensive flats available - you could actually get a flat bigger than this house for more like £300k.

Like for like, the between a flat and a house is now approaching 100% in this area (£300k for a 900sqft house, the best part of £600k for a house of the same size). For me, that is too much of a differential, but I am not sure what is 'right'.

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When the bubble was full-on (about ten years ago), commentators like the BBC's 'money box' were celebrating a statistic that the average family made more in a year from HPI than from earned income.

Take heart from the change in mainstream opinion since that was something to celebrate!

True, I remember those articles too.

The thing is that this is really not rocket science! If the average family earns £50k gross (£40k net) and a home like this is going up in value by £80k each year then their affordability is going backwards by two years each year.

I know that there are ultra cheap loans to bridge the gap a bit, but even if these average earners borrow five times their joint salary, they still need to find a £150k deposit just to buy the place, plus another chunk to make it reasonable.

How many people who have that kind of cash on the hip are looking to move to Tolworth? I guess I have already answered that question....

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The UK govt is spending at an even faster clip than it had been even during the boom years.

It's as if Brown's 'economic miracle' never stopped.

net-debt-billion-nominal-500x428.png

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Londoners who know London know the different areas and know what is good value and not so good value depending mainly on the area, what makes a good area against a not so salubrious area is another question/topic......so the chancers are hoping incomers who know little will think all places are the same, all places make money, all places are a store of value, all places will get better, there will be more a demand for....people can't get enough of enough of enough. ;)

Who "Londoners" are is changing all the time. And who Londoners are in any particular part of London is changing too. The ripple effect continues.

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I've never understood the youths lack of outrage and reluctance to rebel against the system. They've been totally shafted. You might earn a decent wage, but still won't be able to afford a home like mum and dad could at your age (who probably also had a decent pension and no student fees to contend with). They all seem quite happy to except the situation, live at home, or rent to keep the BTL steam train running.

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I know that we on HPC have been banging the drum about house prices for years, and we seem to be getting a bit more outrage in the media, but why do most people seem so accepting and supportive or high prices?

This house really bought it home to me today:

http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/details/29559483?search_identifier=6b4ba6b28c23555705e219de87c041b3

This is a small terraced house in quite a poor part of an outer London suburb. It sold for £240k in 2010 has clearly had no money spent on it since then and is now on the market three years later for £410k.

Even ignoring the fact that is a 70% increase on an already inflated 2010 price, this asking price represents over £55k ANNUAL increase in price. So that is the equivalent of someone earning an £80k salary for doing absolutely nothing. What is the point of working - just but a house, don't bother refurbishing it, don't bother renting it out and still make far more than most people will ever dream about!

The main problem is that they will probably get this price as well.

I thought there is a Kingston Grammar and Tiffins Girls in that area ?

None of the 3 bed house on the street sold for £240k in 2010 according to RM - where did you get the £240k figure from ?

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detail.html?country=england&locationIdentifier=POSTCODE^433907

Most of the wealth inequality over the past 30 years were the result of Asset Price inflation - thanks to the credit bubble + central bank.

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How many people who have that kind of cash on the hip are looking to move to Tolworth? I guess I have already answered that question....

I don't know Tolworth. Maybe it's an up-and-coming area?

The people who made the biggest money from the rise of Islington were the bohemians who moved there when it was totally rough and bombed-out. Not the champagne socialists who came later, when it was already known as up-and-coming.

The areas with the most potential for profit are precisely the ones that look and feel like Detroit to ordinary people.

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  • 242 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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