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longtomsilver

Fined At Motorway Services, Help!

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My wife had a customer meeting down south and parked up at a motorway services beforehand to meet her salesperson and align over breakfast. After about an hour they then drove on in separate cars to meet the customer and a few hours later returned to the same service station for a debriefing coffee. Wife paid £30 for two breakfasts on first visit and £15 for god only knows on the way back (coffee and cake).

She has just been hit with a fine of £90 for overstaying the 2hour limit even though she stayed for less than this on both occasions. A great way to treat paying customers.

The car lease company automatically paid the fine and HR are deducting this from her next pay cheque.

Any redress? This fine seems both wrongly applied (missed the out and return) and unlawful!!!

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My wife had a customer meeting down south and parked up at a motorway services beforehand to meet her salesperson and align over breakfast. After about an hour they then drove on in separate cars to meet the customer and a few hours later returned to the same service station for a debriefing coffee. Wife paid £30 for two breakfasts on first visit and £15 for god only knows on the way back (coffee and cake).

She has just been hit with a fine of £90 for overstaying the 2hour limit even though she stayed for less than this on both occasions. A great way to treat paying customers.

The car lease company automatically paid the fine and HR are deducting this from her next pay cheque.

Any redress? This fine seems both wrongly applied (missed the out and return) and unlawful!!!

I would probably make it a resignation matter.

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I don't think so, we had the same with a guy wanting to challenge (he claimed he only stopped in the bus lane to check his satnav, "so what" thought I) but we had an agreement with the hire co that we pay anything plus an admin fee, and then deduct it from their pay.

Also by the time the paperwork got to us it was nearly too late to challenge.

Your redress, and I said this to him, is that you personally take this to a solicitor, if you win they will refund the hire car co. who will then refund us (less another admin fee) and we will then refund you.

He didn't bother and I don't think I would.

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It's not a fine, it's a speculative invoice. Anything with "Penalty Charge Notice" written on it is a fine, this will have had something similar but not identical written on it.

The problem is that the leasing company have taken the easy option of paying it. If a private motorist gets one, they can be safely ignored.

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My wife had a customer meeting down south and parked up at a motorway services beforehand to meet her salesperson and align over breakfast. After about an hour they then drove on in separate cars to meet the customer and a few hours later returned to the same service station for a debriefing coffee. Wife paid £30 for two breakfasts on first visit and £15 for god only knows on the way back (coffee and cake).

She has just been hit with a fine of £90 for overstaying the 2hour limit even though she stayed for less than this on both occasions. A great way to treat paying customers.

The car lease company automatically paid the fine and HR are deducting this from her next pay cheque.

Any redress? This fine seems both wrongly applied (missed the out and return) and unlawful!!!

As far as the fine goes, there is an appeals process, but perhaps the rental firm has closed that avenue by coughing up. I'd be inclined to have a few words with HR and the rental company via the firm.

Some carparks do impose this condition of 1 visit per day, it's a disgrace given the whole purpose of service stations is to encourage people to take breaks. Woe betide anyone who actually needs to have a few hours kip, the system means you are encouraged to drive on tired rather than stop.

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My wife had a customer meeting down south and parked up at a motorway services beforehand to meet her salesperson and align over breakfast. :blink: After about an hour they then drove on in separate cars to meet the customer and a few hours later returned to the same service station for a debriefing coffee :ph34r: . Wife paid £30 for two breakfasts on first visit and £15 for god only knows on the way back (coffee and cake).

Was it something like this ?

mqdefault.jpg

Modesty forbids "Googling" anything about debriefing, although I do have a very good DoE quote about the subject, which I can't share either, most unfortunately

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Go see a lawyer.

The car hire contract probably talks about paying fines.

These parking charges are not fines..they are invoices so the hire company should not have paid without asking you.

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It's worth finding out what employment law has to say about this, the issue here is whether the deduction from your wife's pay is lawful or not, it sounds dodgy if there is no written procedure in place for appealing these penalty charges, and the company might find that they cannot deduct this from an employee's salary. Obviously whether your wife takes this any further or not depends on how much she wants the job!. The company I work for is finding it increasingly difficult to find employees willing to take hire cars or pool cars out on business, precisely because of this sort of thing.

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I'd also suggest writing to the company that runs the service station to complain. Ultimately it's that company that has hired whoever it is that's issuing the excessive parking charges, the whole thing seems ridiculous considering it's a service station offering a rest stop for travellers.

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It's worth finding out what employment law has to say about this, the issue here is whether the deduction from your wife's pay is lawful or not, it sounds dodgy if there is no written procedure in place for appealing these penalty charges, and the company might find that they cannot deduct this from an employee's salary. Obviously whether your wife takes this any further or not depends on how much she wants the job!. The company I work for is finding it increasingly difficult to find employees willing to take hire cars or pool cars out on business, precisely because of this sort of thing.

That is why I would probably make it a resignation matter. Heavy handed and impersonal, not the sort of company I would wish to work for, although having said that they're probably all like that these days.

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That is why I would probably make it a resignation matter. Heavy handed and impersonal, not the sort of company I would wish to work for, although having said that they're probably all like that these days.

Not even the same soft of company that pays my wife a very good salary? I.e. the fine represents less than 3% of her net monthly salary so no point rocking the boat with them.

I think we will write to the company running the services and the coffee chain where they had repeat custom. She has receipts for both visits and annoying I see my wife filled up with fuel there on the way back at 15p a litre more than our supermarket fill up. An expensive lesson then at £150. If the response is unsatisfactory I am incensed enough to start my own mobile web site where you can intuitively find good places to eat, not far off the beaten track convenient to fuel stations with latest or most recently updated prices displayed. Only problem is I don't develop, wouldn't mind part funding one though :P

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Not even the same soft of company that pays my wife a very good salary? I.e. the fine represents less than 3% of her net monthly salary so no point rocking the boat with them.

I think we will write to the company running the services and the coffee chain where they had repeat custom. She has receipts for both visits and annoying I see my wife filled up with fuel there on the way back at 15p a litre more than our supermarket fill up. An expensive lesson then at £150. If the response is unsatisfactory I am incensed enough to start my own mobile web site where you can intuitively find good places to eat, not far off the beaten track convenient to fuel stations with latest or most recently updated prices displayed. Only problem is I don't develop, wouldn't mind part funding one though :P

55K SALARY for a rep? wot, no bonus?

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The Bill of Rights of 1688 Clause 12 reads:

"that all grants and promises of fines and forfeitures of particular persons before conviction are illegal and void"

In other words, all fixed penalties are illegal – and always have been. Anyone being threatened with a fixed penalty must be convicted of an offence in a court of law first.

If it was described as a fine or penalty on any notice displayed, or terms & conditions issued by the car park operators, that would be an admission that it is a penalty, and they could be sued.

If however it was described as a charge then it could be construed as a lawful part of a contract, in some circumstances. Possibly.

The complication is that the hire company and the employer are inserted in this chain, and thus there is also the contractual relationship between all of these. I think, technically, the employer is fining the employee.

You would arguably need access to the car park Ts & Cs, the car rental agreement and the terms & conditions of employment to unravel this.

If I were the driver, and recieved such a demand to pay a 'fine' directly, I would ignore it. If it were a Parking Fine or Penalty Charge (depending on the regime the parking is operated under) I would refuse to pay and challenge the invoice.

I have only had one such 'fine' in the past 15 years or so, and successfully challened it. Pain in the a*** though (local council). If I was minded to, I could cost my council many hundreds of thousands, I found so many legal holes in their documents and notices. It wasn't worth the trouble though.

I do note, incidentally, that in the case of on-street parking, regulated either by the police or local government, parking restrictions are usually reasonable, and though one may actually have a legal right to ignore the fines and restrictions, it usually involves parking dangerously or selfishly. So I tend to go along with the restrictions anyway.

For more info on such things take a look at www.pepipoo.com, a well-known and useful site on these matters.

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It's worth finding out what employment law has to say about this, the issue here is whether the deduction from your wife's pay is lawful or not, it sounds dodgy if there is no written procedure in place for appealing these penalty charges, and the company might find that they cannot deduct this from an employee's salary. Obviously whether your wife takes this any further or not depends on how much she wants the job!. The company I work for is finding it increasingly difficult to find employees willing to take hire cars or pool cars out on business, precisely because of this sort of thing.

Perhaps claim the 'fine' back from the employer as a business expense (parking expenses), pointing out that as a business they have suffered and paid an unlawful invoice, and that they need to sort the matter out with their supplier.

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Guest eight

Deleted as contentious.

By way of retribution, why not just kick the living shit out of a random stranger in the street?

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;)I just park where I like

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Not even the same soft of company that pays my wife a very good salary? I.e. the fine represents less than 3% of her net monthly salary so no point rocking the boat with them.

I think we will write to the company running the services and the coffee chain where they had repeat custom. She has receipts for both visits and annoying I see my wife filled up with fuel there on the way back at 15p a litre more than our supermarket fill up. An expensive lesson then at £150. If the response is unsatisfactory I am incensed enough to start my own mobile web site where you can intuitively find good places to eat, not far off the beaten track convenient to fuel stations with latest or most recently updated prices displayed. Only problem is I don't develop, wouldn't mind part funding one though :P

Already sort of exists...

http://www.offmotorway.com/

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Perhaps claim the 'fine' back from the employer as a business expense (parking expenses), pointing out that as a business they have suffered and paid an unlawful invoice, and that they need to sort the matter out with their supplier.

regardless of the legality of the payment, I trust the deduction was made on the net pay, rather than the gross...as that would mean th whole affair counts as a tax evasion.

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;)I just park where I like

Me too. Then they send me a series of these. Then I ignore them. Then they go away. Job's a good 'un!

scan0015-2_zps890d77b4.jpg

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Problem will be the issue will have to be resolved with the employer as they are behind the financial penalty being incurred by your missus. As you didn't pay the parking co yourself I don't think you'll be able to make a claim against them form a strict legal point of view.

As has been said unless you want to rock the boat with your employer best case scenario is looking like complaining to the services and getting some money off vouchers for their crap food. Personally, I think this deduction from wages is unlawful unless the contract was very well worded. However, I would still think it would be very hard to make a contract clause stick, if you wanted to take it all the way to tribunal, if it allowed no option for the employee to dispute or appeal the claim from the parking co.

Another option, if you want to gamble another few quid on the cost of a county court claim, would be to write to the parking co stating you have since researched and discovered there's no legal basis for their fine and want it back or you will follow up with a county court claim after a reasonable amount of time. I think it's better than 50/50 they'd pay up when a court claim lands on the mat. The law has changed and I think these sort of things will only ever be enforced by the court where it is individual or entity that holds title on the land the vehicle is parked which the parking co almost certainly won't. It's vague as well I think where leaseholders are concerned which is likely what the actual services operator will be in many cases so pretty unlikely they'll want to take it to court and probably have no idea it wasn't you that paid the fine.

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regardless of the legality of the payment, I trust the deduction was made on the net pay, rather than the gross...as that would mean th whole affair counts as a tax evasion.

Not sure about that pretty certain that if there's some system of staff buying additional uniform, for example, it comes out of gross. Obviously in this case there will have been a loss to the revenue on the affair but it's impossible for them to stop or police staff doing unpaid overtime in lieu, for example.

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The Motorway Service Area ( or its agents, CP Plus for example) can't enforce these invoices (and they are invoices, not fines) because....

1. They cannot prove that you agreed to enter into a contract with them, and

2. They cannot prove that they have suffered financial loss through your actions.

Unfortunately lease companies take the path of least resistance and pay up, and it almost certainly is in their contract with their customer that the customer has to pay all invoices received while the customer is in control of the vehicle. For all others, do not pay, do not reply to any of their letters, they will not exercise the only legal option open to them, taking you to the Small Claims Court.

Ignore them and eventually they will ****** off, you have my personal guarantee of that, I've got dozens of these Mickey Mouse pseudo-"fines".

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It's worth finding out what employment law has to say about this, the issue here is whether the deduction from your wife's pay is lawful or not, it sounds dodgy if there is no written procedure in place for appealing these penalty charges, and the company might find that they cannot deduct this from an employee's salary. Obviously whether your wife takes this any further or not depends on how much she wants the job!. The company I work for is finding it increasingly difficult to find employees willing to take hire cars or pool cars out on business, precisely because of this sort of thing.

This. Your wife only has a contractual relationship with her employer so she needs to take it up with her boss and/or HR, the service station or the rental/lease car company and their respective agreements and practices have nothing to do with her.

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  • 241 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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