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cashinmattress

Scumbag Florida

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Florida quietly shortened yellow light standards & lengths, resulting in more red light camera tickets for you

A subtle, but significant tweak to Florida's rules regarding traffic signals has allowed local cities and counties to shorten yellow light intervals, resulting in millions of dollars in additional red light camera fines.

The 10 News Investigators discovered the Florida Department of Transportation (FDOT) quietly changed the state's policy on yellow intervals in 2011, reducing the minimum below federal recommendations. The rule change was followed by engineers, both from FDOT and local municipalities, collaborating to shorten the length of yellow lights at key intersections, specifically those with red light cameras (RLCs).

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But FDOT claims it had no financial motive to shorten yellow lights; the agency doesn't receive any direct payments from RLC fines.

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Clemens said he just wants the state to follow national standards. But he also admitted RLCs have allowed states to create new revenue streams without raising taxes.

Outside of the surreal Disney bit in Orland, Florida is a crime ridden crap hole.

Hardly a surprise that their councils are equally as criminal.

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Outside of the surreal Disney bit in Orland, Florida is a crime ridden crap hole.

Hardly a surprise that their councils are equally as criminal.

That Disney bit is very surreal indeed lol!

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people forget that amber means STOP....not put your foot down and chance it.

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Outside of the surreal Disney bit in Orland, Florida is a crime ridden crap hole.

Key West is amusing but aside from that, I'd pretty much agree.

In the words of Homer Simpson - 'Florida ... that's America's wang'

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OK... I am going to out myself as a complete nerd and anorak over this, but, here goes...

If you take the stopping distances in the highway code, it is possible to calculate the assumptions the Code makes about the rate of deceleration of a car in good dry road conditions, and then work out the corellating stopping distances and times for any other speed.

Obviously, if lights change green-red-orange too quickly, then many drivers will have insufficent time to stop before the line, nor sufficient time to cross the line before the red. Taking this to the nth degree, for example, when if the yellow phase lasted 0 seconds, drivers travelling at any speed above 0 mph could be caught, and any reasonable person would call it entrapment.

A yellow phase, to be fair, must last at least as long as it takes for the driver to stop. If the lights are in, say, a 40mph zone, the lights must stay yellow for at least as long as it takes a driver to think, and then bring the car to a halt from 40mph. This is because, I would argue, it is reasonable for a driver to approach lights at green at 40mph in a 40mph speed zone.

If the yellow period is too short, then they may go from green to amber when the driver has already passed the point where there is sufficient distance to stop before the line (if they choose to brake), and yet also insufficient time to cross the line before the lights change to red if the driver instead decides to continue at 40mph. Either way, the driver is doomed.

Even though I have never had a ticket for jumping traffic lights, curiosity got the better of me a couple of years ago, and I spent a few minutes timing the phases of some traffic lights on a roundabout near where I live... and found out some curious things.

I found that most amber periods in the 30mph zone were set to the exact period it would take to stop from 30mph in good conditions, most amber periods in the 40mph zone were set to the exact period it would take to stop from 40mph in good conditions. This suggests that someone else had previously done the same calculations that I had, and set the amber period to the very barest minimum.

However I found that some lights in the 40mph zone were amber only long enough to stop from 30mph...

I contacted the DOT and asked them what laws or regulations laid down the minimum amber period in the UK. According to them, there is no law defining it, and the periods they used were effectively just determined custom & practice.

Traffic light cameras are apparently set to photograph cars jumping lights only a period after lights tthe turn red, not just as lights turn red. This effectively gives drivers a short period of 'grace' where they would not be snapped by a traffic camera if they cross the line a little too late. However, the DOT will not reveal how long this period of grace is.

So I think that entrapment is probably already happening in the UK, and has been for a long time.

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people forget that amber means STOP....not put your foot down and chance it.

Yet, as I explain, sometimes the amber period is still not long enough. If they change to amber after you have passed the point where you could brake in time to stop before the line (and thus, cannot stop before the line), they may also then go on to change to red before you reach the line, and thus you inevitably cross the line, and cross it when the lights are red.

The only way to escape this is to approach the lights at a speed below the speed limit, but you cannot find out just how much slower you must drive to be absolutely sure to never be caught out.

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Outside of the surreal Disney bit in Orland, Florida is a crime ridden crap hole.

Hardly a surprise that their councils are equally as criminal.

Drug dealers on one side of the state, retirees on the other, alligators in the middle. Thats what ive always been told.

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people forget that amber means STOP....not put your foot down and chance it.

Highway code

AMBER means ‘Stop’ at the stop line. You may go on only if the AMBER appears after you have crossed the stop line or are so close to it that to pull up might cause an accident.

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Yet, as I explain, sometimes the amber period is still not long enough. If they change to amber after you have passed the point where you could brake in time to stop before the line (and thus, cannot stop before the line), they may also then go on to change to red before you reach the line, and thus you inevitably cross the line, and cross it when the lights are red.

The only way to escape this is to approach the lights at a speed below the speed limit, but you cannot find out just how much slower you must drive to be absolutely sure to never be caught out.

the highway code stopping distances and times are for emergency stopping.

I guess by your theory, they expect cars to stop at max deceleration to hit the red.

Clearly, not comfy for passengers, and more than likely a cause of more rear enders as the front car emergency stops instead of carrying on through.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_digitalassets/@dg/@en/documents/digitalasset/dg_070561.pdf

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Highway code

AMBER means 'Stop' at the stop line. You may go on only if the AMBER appears after you have crossed the stop line or are so close to it that to pull up might cause an accident.

yes a conditional stop.

I wonder what the law is in Florida...probably the same....so a good defence would be to show that the amber was way to short to stop before the red and crossing the red meant preventing an accident.

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This is all going to become mute when the 118 incar modems become embedded after 2019..... Euro wide.

Whole journey speed fines

Variable peak hour road use charges

The whole of the UK becomes a variable congestion charge/ parking peak hour zone

The governments next major finance boost source is already on track.

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This is all going to become mute when the 118 incar modems become embedded after 2019..... Euro wide.

Whole journey speed fines

Variable peak hour road use charges

The whole of the UK becomes a variable congestion charge/ parking peak hour zone

The governments next major finance boost source is already on track.

LOL, there wont be any cars on the road after a week..everyone will be banned on the points system...Of course, in France, they will ignore it, italy wont implement it, germany will up the speed limits, etc etc.

UK will gold plate it of course.

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the highway code stopping distances and times are for emergency stopping.

I guess by your theory, they expect cars to stop at max deceleration to hit the red.

Clearly, not comfy for passengers, and more than likely a cause of more rear enders as the front car emergency stops instead of carrying on through.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/prod_consum_dg/groups/dg_digitalassets/@dg/@en/documents/digitalasset/dg_070561.pdf

Indeed, and they assume good road conditions. So in anything less than good road conditions, even setting the amber period to the stop time for a given speed limit makes it impossible to stop in time, in some circumstances where you are approaching a green light within the speed limit. By the time the light changes to amber, you are already doomed to technically break the law, whether you continue at the speed limit, or brake as hard as possible, or drive at any speed inbetween.

You can be transformed instantly from someone approaching a green light lawfully within the speed limit, to someone who will inevitably break the law no matter what you do in response to the light changing to amber.

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Indeed, and they assume good road conditions. So in anything less than good road conditions, even setting the amber period to the stop time for a given speed limit makes it impossible to stop in time, in some circumstances where you are approaching a green light within the speed limit. By the time the light changes to amber, you are already doomed to technically break the law, whether you continue at the speed limit, or brake as hard as possible, or drive at any speed inbetween.

You can be transformed instantly from someone approaching a green light lawfully within the speed limit, to someone who will inevitably break the law no matter what you do in response to the light changing to amber.

The good news is that most modern vehicles are capable of stopping well inside the highway code distances.

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The good news is that most modern vehicles are capable of stopping well inside the highway code distances.

Bad news is that most modern people have p1ss poor reaction times, especially fat, sweaty, and stupid Floridians.

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When I have passed a light on amber I frequently see one, two or even three cars go through after me. For this reason I check my mirror as I approach lights because I will choose to go through late to avoid being shunted. If the car behind is at safe distance I will stop on amber,

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Indeed, and they assume good road conditions. So in anything less than good road conditions, even setting the amber period to the stop time for a given speed limit makes it impossible to stop in time, in some circumstances where you are approaching a green light within the speed limit. By the time the light changes to amber, you are already doomed to technically break the law, whether you continue at the speed limit, or brake as hard as possible, or drive at any speed inbetween.

You can be transformed instantly from someone approaching a green light lawfully within the speed limit, to someone who will inevitably break the law no matter what you do in response to the light changing to amber.

You're right, traffic lights on some sections can change through amber within the stopping time required. It also occurs in other areas, eg the time pedestrians have to cross on a 'green man'. I vaguely recall a tragic incident where a lady was killed as a pedestrian in exactly those circumstances.

Of course, approaching a green light at speed should always make one cautious of the fact that speed limits are limits not orders, but it is not good practice to set the timings of lights in such a manner that someone can be done while obeying the limit.

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You're right, traffic lights on some sections can change through amber within the stopping time required. It also occurs in other areas, eg the time pedestrians have to cross on a 'green man'. I vaguely recall a tragic incident where a lady was killed as a pedestrian in exactly those circumstances.

Of course, approaching a green light at speed should always make one cautious of the fact that speed limits are limits not orders, but it is not good practice to set the timings of lights in such a manner that someone can be done while obeying the limit.

best to lose 10mph on the approach to a hazard.

Around here, some pedestrian lights are set so that the pedestrians have long walked out of site before they are red again.

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best to lose 10mph on the approach to a hazard.

Around here, some pedestrian lights are set so that the pedestrians have long walked out of site before they are red again.

Indeed, I suspect that not a lot of thought has gone into many junctions, resulting in some where traffic is delayed needlessly and others where the mandated limit is not safe through the junction.

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There are possibly some good reasons for having an amber that's on for less than the stopping distance. The shorter the amber period the longer the greens; if you've got a busy enough junction that the traffic is slow most of the time then the amber might be on for quite a bit longer than most vehicles need to stop, and you're wasting road capacity due to longer times when no-one is going anywhere. Perhaps modern traffic-sensing lights can determine whether there's still a queue or not and adjust the amber accordingly.

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OK... I am going to out myself as a complete nerd and anorak over this, but, here goes...

<snip>

Even though I have never had a ticket for jumping traffic lights, curiosity got the better of me a couple of years ago,

That is, to be fair, a belting bit of nerdery- inspired, in fact! Respect, sir! :lol:

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  • 238 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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