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Pensions Loophole Lets 220,000 People Living Abroad Claim A State Pension Despite Never Having Worked In The Uk


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On radio 4 this morning there was a man that had done 22 years in the RAF and then freelancing around the world to retirement. He was bemoaning the fact that his foreign widow would not be protected.

I hardly think that 22 years and a bit of freelancing is going to pay to keep some foreign widow, especially as there is no recycling into the UK tax system of the welfare payouts.

Edited by crashmonitor
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I don't quite understand how this is considered to be a loophole. Surely it is reasonable that the receipt of a spousal pension (insofar as a spousal pension exists) should not be dependent on where said spouse lives. What happens, for example, if the spouse moves into or out of the UK while receiving the pension?

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Are spouse's pensions really paid to spouses who are younger than the UK retirement age? I think that they should be changed so that the spouse can only claim them when they are at retirement age. I'm amazed that this isn't the main point..

There is nothing unreasonable at all about a Spouse's pension even if the spouse never made any NI contributions and its definitely not a loop-hole or anomaly.

If a spouse has been bringing up children and a home-maker in the UK then they have contributed to UK society. Some would say that home-makers should be paid. If the spouse has never stepped foot in the UK then its a bit more dubious that they should get anything, but again not unreasonable because the UK citizen with a full NI contribution record has a right to expect his wife and family to be looked after.

I agree with an earlier poster that its more about forcing home-makers into the workplace. Not exactly conservative.

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Are spouse's pensions really paid to spouses who are younger than the UK retirement age? I think that they should be changed so that the spouse can only claim them when they are at retirement age. I'm amazed that this isn't the main point..

There is nothing unreasonable at all about a Spouse's pension even if the spouse never made any NI contributions and its definitely not a loop-hole or anomaly.

If a spouse has been bringing up children and a home-maker in the UK then they have contributed to UK society. Some would say that home-makers should be paid. If the spouse has never stepped foot in the UK then its a bit more dubious that they should get anything, but again not unreasonable because the UK citizen with a full NI contribution record has a right to expect his wife and family to be looked after.

I agree with an earlier poster that its more about forcing home-makers into the workplace. Not exactly conservative.

Missing the point. Why should a married person have this ability to pass on a pension to a spouse who has made no contributions. Its a bias against a single person. Lets not forget that any married man can pay the contributions on behalf of a wife who will then have the pension in their own right. How many choose to do this i wonder.

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Missing the point. Why should a married person have this ability to pass on a pension to a spouse who has made no contributions. Its a bias against a single person. Lets not forget that any married man can pay the contributions on behalf of a wife who will then have the pension in their own right. How many choose to do this i wonder.

+1

it is unfair to single people.

to quote from a torygraph article

"Currently, women with a poor record of National Insurance contributions (NICs) are entitled to a minimum basic state pension of 60pc of their husband's entitlement. This looks likely to be abolished when the flat-rate state pension is introduced.

For example, a couple in which the man has a full basic state pension and his wife has no record of making NICs currently gets about £172 a week in state pension. This consists of the man's pension of £107.45 a week, plus his wife's entitlement to 60pc of that figure."

this is not the same as a widow/widower inheriting spouse's pension - which is justifiable.

if this situation was left in place with the flat rate pension married couples would receive £145 + 60% of 145 (about £232) as a basic state pension

hence the squealing - they may have to rely on pension credit if they are short of the magic £220 under the new rules

Edited by olliegog
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Missing the point. Why should a married person have this ability to pass on a pension to a spouse who has made no contributions. Its a bias against a single person. Lets not forget that any married man can pay the contributions on behalf of a wife who will then have the pension in their own right. How many choose to do this i wonder.

I am not missing the point - I know its a bias towards married people, that's the very point of it. The conservatives are very fond of reminding us that raising children within a marriage is most beneficial for society and on one hand they try to encourage marriage, so that's why it beats me why they are doing this.

In theory I am quite pro-marriage but really there are massive financial dis-incentives to it especially if one person stays at home to bring up children and be a homemaker, or just earns a lot less than the main bread-winner. If you are the bread-winning spouse you have a massively increased legal financial responsibility for looking after your spouse and children in all circumstances compared to a single bread-winner with a partner. If, for example, a single male bread-winner with or without children decides to separate from the wife. The wife will get child support (if children are involved), most likely nothing else, and most likely end up on state benefits. If you are married, the financial obligation is to provide for your wife for the rest of your life to avoid them ever claiming any benefits even when you separate. That's just one reason why favorable pension terms were offered to married people because married couples cost the state less in many other ways.

Edited by DavidSWP
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The existence of the married persons pension is hardly a 'loophole'. It has existed in some form since the Pensions Act of 1908. Abolishing it is just one part of the changes being introduced by the new Pension Act of 2013 which will create quite a few losers amongst the population including many who have paid in for the second state pension. Far more people are gong to be impacted than just those who are married partners with no or little Class 1 NIC records. Most just do not realise it yet.

Agreed. The media of course are dutifully playing their part by perpetuating the spin that this is a measure to stop evil, scrounging foreigners from stealing our money but it is window dressing for disadvantaging lots of potential pension claimants, most of whom will likely be in the UK.

The fact that TPTB say that they can't (i.e. won't) actually put a figure on how many of these scheming foreigners are benefiting and how much it is currently costing the public purse kind of gives it away for anyone bothering to pay attention. Which of course excludes your average member of the GBP who'd rather watch TV and knock back cheap booze.

Of course, it'll take years for it to become obvious to the sheep that they've been fleeced (again) and too late by then to do anything about it.

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  • 433 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

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