Nhs Dentists Shake-Up? Anyone Know About This?

[Si1]

a few people have told me that NHS dentistry seems to be expanding and it is becoming easier to register at an NHS dental practice

anyone know any reasons behind this, political, economic, organisational etc motivations or causes? insider info?

Edited May 2, 2013 by Si1

[Stop The Ride]

a few people have told me that NHS dentistry seems to be expanding and it is becoming easier to register at an NHS dental practice

anyone know any reasons behind this, political, economic, organisational etc motivations or causes? insider info?

From memory the national dental contract was rewritten a few years back. I expec,t to quote Nye Bevan, the NHS 'stuffed their mouths with gold'.

[Karelian]

a few people have told me that NHS dentistry seems to be expanding and it is becoming easier to register at an NHS dental practice

anyone know any reasons behind this, political, economic, organisational etc motivations or causes? insider info?

I think PCTs (now CCGs) are increasingly providing dental services themselves by directly employing dentists instead of relying on private dentists to accept NHS patients.

I also think that private dentists have priced themselves out of the market charging extortionate rates for dental treatment that people just cannot afford however desperate they are for that treatment. With their private patient numbers declining the private practices are having to take on more NHS patients.

[StainlessSteelCat]

I saw some evidence of new NHS practices setting up in West Yorkshire. Sadly, Wales seems to be a dry spot. Nearest NHS dentist taking patients is 40 miles away. I guess I'll have to hope my teeth hold out another 25 years without needing to go.

DTMark's account elsewhere on the forum, together with those of friends in the real world - frankly give me the fear far more than having some guy poking around in my mouth without any accountability. There's no way dental treatment should cost the price of new car or leave you in pain for weeks. If we applied the same principle to every other part of our anatomy needing maintenance and care - it would make house prices look like bargains.

The NHS may have many faults - but if privatisation looks anything like private dentistry I'll happily keep it as is.

Edited May 2, 2013 by StainlessSteelCat

[wonderpup]

obviously not enough private patients any more.

That's the likely answer- I notice a sudden enthusiasm for NHS patients in my neck of the woods- from dentists who previously seemed to regard NHS patients as a lower life form.

[Oliver Sutton]

Dental tourism as well.

[tc9604]

I've never understood why mouths and eyes are not considered part of the national health and good old taxpaying citizens have to go begging for appointments and paying for the privilege. It's almost worth packing in work to get some of the treatments on offer.

[tomwatkins]

I saw some evidence of new NHS practices setting up in West Yorkshire. Sadly, Wales seems to be a dry spot. Nearest NHS dentist taking patients is 40 miles away. I guess I'll have to hope my teeth hold out another 25 years without needing to go.

DTMark's account elsewhere on the forum, together with those of friends in the real world - frankly give me the fear far more than having some guy poking around in my mouth without any accountability. There's no way dental treatment should cost the price of new car or leave you in pain for weeks. If we applied the same principle to every other part of our anatomy needing maintenance and care - it would make house prices look like bargains.

The NHS may have many faults - but if privatisation looks anything like private dentistry I'll happily keep it as is.

Go over the border to Chester and you can tick your pick of four that I know within the city walls alone.

[tomwatkins]

That's the likely answer- I notice a sudden enthusiasm for NHS patients in my neck of the woods- from dentists who previously seemed to regard NHS patients as a lower life form.

Must admit it's nice...throwback to when you got a lollypop from the nice dentist as a kid (although I always thought it an odd practice for a dentist).

[Executive Sadman]

I've never understood why mouths and eyes are not considered part of the national health and good old taxpaying citizens have to go begging for appointments and paying for the privilege. It's almost worth packing in work to get some of the treatments on offer.

Its a bit odd given they give boob jobs, and yet teeth can be painful like almost nothing else.

[StainlessSteelCat]

Must admit it's nice...throwback to when you got a lollypop from the nice dentist as a kid (although I always thought it an odd practice for a dentist).

Yes, imagine that. You have a guy who's paid to fix problems, and the worse they are, the better he gets paid. He is in no way encouraged to create more work for himself in the future.

Edited May 3, 2013 by StainlessSteelCat

[Frank Hovis]

I think PCTs (now CCGs) are increasingly providing dental services themselves by directly employing dentists instead of relying on private dentists to accept NHS patients.

I also think that private dentists have priced themselves out of the market charging extortionate rates for dental treatment that people just cannot afford however desperate they are for that treatment. With their private patient numbers declining the private practices are having to take on more NHS patients.

Yes, both of those IMO. I registered this year with a NHS dentist in the same practice as the private dentist I stopped going to because he kept upping his rates.

[Pindar]

There's not that much difference between the rates charged between private and NHS dentists as far as I can see and I had a terrible experience with an inexperienced NHS dentist who ended up costing me 3 times as much to fix the problem she created. I've always had better treatment when paying for a private dentist, if you can find a good one they're as rare as hens teeth.

[crashmonitor]

There's not that much difference between the rates charged between private and NHS dentists as far as I can see and I had a terrible experience with an inexperienced NHS dentist who ended up costing me 3 times as much to fix the problem she created. I've always had better treatment when paying for a private dentist, if you can find a good one they're as rare as hens teeth.

In my area it is Denplan or NHS. the former costs about £250 a year. In the 1990s when we had to decide I opted for NHS. In a normal year I pay about £15 check up fee, and I confine these examinations to once a year. Two years ago I broke a tooth and needed a crown, which cost £204 on the NHS. My aggegate spend in the last twenty years is probably less than £500.

Two years of Denplan or twenty years cover on the NHS with a crown thrown in? Denplan is rather like insuring a £2040 car for £2500 premium every year if my crown is anything to go by.

Edited May 3, 2013 by crashmonitor

[Lagarde's Drift]

Is that all the value you ascribe to your teeth / health?

More like insuring a £100k car for £2k vs paying £200 servicing costs.

[winkie]

There's not that much difference between the rates charged between private and NHS dentists as far as I can see and I had a terrible experience with an inexperienced NHS dentist who ended up costing me 3 times as much to fix the problem she created. I've always had better treatment when paying for a private dentist, if you can find a good one they're as rare as hens teeth.

Yes I agree.....NHS dentists that are well established with lots of experience that do both private and NHS work are the dentists to look for.....the one minute wonder private practices that employ high a t/o of solely just out of training NHS dentists on not so good wages or benefits and charge you £17.50 to open your mouth to count your teeth stay well clear imo.....just saying.

[pjw]

a few people have told me that NHS dentistry seems to be expanding and it is becoming easier to register at an NHS dental practice

anyone know any reasons behind this, political, economic, organisational etc motivations or causes? insider info?

Mass immigration of dentists from Pakistan? Has anyone ever met a dentist who was English?

[dragonfly]

Mass immigration of dentists from Pakistan? Has anyone ever met a dentist who was English?

My NHS dentist seems to refer anything remotely difficult to one of the most expensive private practices in town.In my case the private dentist she referred me to is an Indian who also owns a bank in India and another business. To have a 35 year old root filling re-done the charge is likely to be £900 + and then £214 nhs charge for a new pin and crown.I was not confident or wealthy enough to proceed so asked my dentist to refer me to a NHS dental hostpital but she said it was not allowed. I then asked my GP to refer me, to which he agreed, as long as my dentist sent the original referal letter to my GP. However my dentist is not co-operating. An x-ray revealed a circular shadow near the root tip which may be infection or even a cavitation/ necrosis and may be the cause of the many years of lower jaw pain which has been diagnosed as Trigeminal Neuropathy. Does my dentist care? evidently not. I believe she may receive a fee from the private dentist and is having a strop at the expense of my heath. This should not be happening in NHS dentistry and I am not the only one being treated in this way. My dentist is not English.

[crashmonitor]

Is that all the value you ascribe to your teeth / health?

More like insuring a £100k car for £2k vs paying £200 servicing costs.

If i can get away with paying 90% less on NHS pay as you go as opposed to denplan then I will. A denplan dentist isn't going to alter the outcome of your oral health, that is down to you.

Edited May 4, 2013 by crashmonitor

[Lagarde's Drift]

If i can get away with paying 90% less on NHS pay as you go as opposed to denplan then I will. A denplan dentist isn't going to alter the outcome of your oral health, that is down to you.

Oh I don't blame you for choosing the cheapest route. Just queried your value/risk assessment to your decision. As you probably know, having dental problems / pain is really not worth bearing for anyone who can afford the treatment.

[pjw]

My NHS dentist seems to refer anything remotely difficult to one of the most expensive private practices in town.In my case the private dentist she referred me to is an Indian who also owns a bank in India and another business. To have a 35 year old root filling re-done the charge is likely to be £900 + and then £214 nhs charge for a new pin and crown.I was not confident or wealthy enough to proceed so asked my dentist to refer me to a NHS dental hostpital but she said it was not allowed. I then asked my GP to refer me, to which he agreed, as long as my dentist sent the original referal letter to my GP. However my dentist is not co-operating. An x-ray revealed a circular shadow near the root tip which may be infection or even a cavitation/ necrosis and may be the cause of the many years of lower jaw pain which has been diagnosed as Trigeminal Neuropathy. Does my dentist care? evidently not. I believe she may receive a fee from the private dentist and is having a strop at the expense of my heath. This should not be happening in NHS dentistry and I am not the only one being treated in this way. My dentist is not English.

This person sounds like a fraudster! If you are in an NHS Dentists, they can do all the work you need. There is no need to refer you to their friend over the road for £900.

Google NHS Emergency Out of Hours and find a hospital anywhere in the country that has such a service and turn up and go.

[Reck B]

Its a bit odd given they give boob jobs, and yet teeth can be painful like almost nothing else.

What what you rather look at, Big tits or straight teeth?

[Guest eight]

Oh I don't blame you for choosing the cheapest route. Just queried your value/risk assessment to your decision. As you probably know, having dental problems / pain is really not worth bearing for anyone who can afford the treatment.

I find I never have anything wrong with my teeth until I visit the dentist.

[crash2006]

My NHS dentist seems to refer anything remotely difficult to one of the most expensive private practices in town.In my case the private dentist she referred me to is an Indian who also owns a bank in India and another business. To have a 35 year old root filling re-done the charge is likely to be £900 + and then £214 nhs charge for a new pin and crown.I was not confident or wealthy enough to proceed so asked my dentist to refer me to a NHS dental hostpital but she said it was not allowed. I then asked my GP to refer me, to which he agreed, as long as my dentist sent the original referal letter to my GP. However my dentist is not co-operating. An x-ray revealed a circular shadow near the root tip which may be infection or even a cavitation/ necrosis and may be the cause of the many years of lower jaw pain which has been diagnosed as Trigeminal Neuropathy. Does my dentist care? evidently not. I believe she may receive a fee from the private dentist and is having a strop at the expense of my heath. This should not be happening in NHS dentistry and I am not the only one being treated in this way. My dentist is not English.

go to the nearest dental hospital, also write a letter to your dentist asking for a referral letter, if you hear no reply tell her you will be seeking legal advice.

A lot of

Dentists like to drill and fill, always go to other dentists for there view. I remember i wen to 3 separate dentists got too of themk to write down on what teeth fillings were needed all 3 dentist had said fillings on different teeth went to the dental hospital and was told I do not need fillings that was 6 years ago.

Edited May 4, 2013 by crash2006

[Pindar]

In my area it is Denplan or NHS. the former costs about £250 a year. In the 1990s when we had to decide I opted for NHS. In a normal year I pay about £15 check up fee, and I confine these examinations to once a year. Two years ago I broke a tooth and needed a crown, which cost £204 on the NHS. My aggegate spend in the last twenty years is probably less than £500.

Two years of Denplan or twenty years cover on the NHS with a crown thrown in? Denplan is rather like insuring a £2040 car for £2500 premium every year if my crown is anything to go by.

I used denplan for a few years until I realised it was just like paying protection money. You keep your payments up to date the the dentist will leave your teeth alone and it basically covers an annual check-up plus hygienist appointment. I found a private Polish dentist in 2000 and he re-filled some teeth then which have lasted until recently. He did an exceptional job, the surface of the filled tooth felt like a real tooth. With dentistry, you depend on the honesty/integrity of the dentist and trust that he/she won't do unnecessary work. If you are paying them piecemeal, they'll be more tempted to do unnecessary work whereas an NHS or Denplan dentist will do the minimum necessary to keep you on the books. I'm not sure which is better, but I think it's a good idea to get a second opinion in the world of dentistry, that way you can be pretty sure that the work actually needs doing and then you can take your pick of private dentists. I know this takes time, but I believe it's worth it in the end.