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Care Homes On The Brink As Bailiffs Move In

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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/care-homes-on-the-brink-as-bailiffs-move-in-8591828.html

Thousands of Britain’s most vulnerable elderly people face rising bills and the prospect of forced relocation from struggling care homes, because record numbers of providers are slipping into administration.

The total of private care home operators going bust grew by 12 per cent in the past 12 months. The annual rate of failures among private providers has more than doubled since the economic crisis began, with 250 residential care operators shutting.

Councils, a vital source of income for private-care providers, are slashing referrals and now seeking to shut their own facilities to meet savings targets. Andy Burnham, the shadow Health Secretary, called the wave of closures a “crisis”.

Providers are said to be caught in a perfect storm of diminishing income while struggling with fixed costs and debts left behind from their rapid expansion during the economic boom. Campaigners claim it will be elderly people – many dementia sufferers – who suffer.

And yet when in power Labour did nothing to prevent this inevitable crisis from happening.

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Providers are said to be caught in a perfect storm of diminishing income while struggling with fixed costs and debts left behind from their rapid expansion during the economic boom.

Greed. A bit like the the HPC 'hero' Serpico which his four dealerships, for 4 seperate marques, and his new cars every 3 years, Bentley, racing horses, grooms, live-in staff, and private plane. People who've over-expanded in the attempt to own much of the market. Because they are worth it.

Unfortunately some residents might be affected in the short term, but overall, best to wrest control and allowing many smaller providers back into the market, charging residents and local authorities prices which better reflect the ability to pay.

Better that than some stimulus and bail-outs and forbearance for those who've greedily over-expanded.

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Councils and private residents demand a cheaper service. Care homes can't provide a service at that price. Care homes close.

Prices should just have risen until it was financially viable.

There was clearly some sort of market manipulation by councils... along the lines of "this is what we are paying and you legally have to provide a service".

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Guest eight

And yet when in power Labour did nothing to prevent this inevitable crisis from happening.

Tory MP Michael Fallon used to be knee deep in care homes, wonder if he still is?

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That is what happens when public money dries up, too many bailouts encourage more dependence on more bailouts.....people will have to start paying their own way, prices charged and debt taken on will have to reflect this.

Less of the private gains, public losses in the future, has to be a good thing. ;)

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Just thought I'd make the obvious point - this is the long-anticipated ageing population/ care crisis we've heard so much about but not really seen yet. People don't have enough money to pay for their own care, and now there isn't enough public funding to cover it.

There isn't a lot of fat to trim out of the care sector business model, especially in care of the elderly and there truly isn't anywhere else for people to go if these firms fail.

Not a lot that can be done in terms of restructuring either...we could always go back to the old model of people living at home with their families, but something tells me that will be a bit too much of an 'ask' for many modern families...

Watch this space

P

Under the 'old' model, people did not live so long - they were not kept alive many years beyond their best-by dates with endless pills and treatments for this and that. Now they go on and on and on and on, so often with dementia, and in modern families where both partners need to work there is often nobody at home to give the 24/7 care people with dementia need. And that is quite apart from the fact that caring for anyone with dementia past the very early stages is often unbelievably stressful and exhausting. 99 times out of a 100 it is absolutely NOTHING like that recent TV ad of a gentle old soul gradually fading away. If only.

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Not a lot that can be done in terms of restructuring either...we could always go back to the old model of people living at home with their families, but something tells me that will be a bit too much of an 'ask' for many modern families...

OK I'll bite.

I take it you have had to look after an elderly relative with dementia?

An elderly relative of mine has it, despite having 4 care visits a day in her own home and her daughter visiting every day she has had to go into 24 hour care.

With medication she could probably live another 15 years quite easily. That would basically be 15 years where she couldn't be left alone by her own elderly daughter. As an example she set fire to her own kitchen in the 30 minutes between being left alone and her next carer arriving.

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Just thought I'd make the obvious point - this is the long-anticipated ageing population/ care crisis we've heard so much about but not really seen yet. People don't have enough money to pay for their own care, and now there isn't enough public funding to cover it.

There isn't a lot of fat to trim out of the care sector business model, especially in care of the elderly and there truly isn't anywhere else for people to go if these firms fail.

Not a lot that can be done in terms of restructuring either...we could always go back to the old model of people living at home with their families, but something tells me that will be a bit too much of an 'ask' for many modern families...

Watch this space

P

Does anyone know how the costs break down?

Property - rent / debt on bought price

Insurances (must be several?)

Staff

Other?

Is it another case of overpriced assets and resultant debt causing yet more problems - or is this different because of the high staffing needs / costs?

The expansion mentioned makes me think they overpaid for property or leases.

Starting again with lower property prices and rents would seem to make it better?

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OK I'll bite.

I take it you have had to look after an elderly relative with dementia?

An elderly relative of mine has it, despite having 4 care visits a day in her own home and her daughter visiting every day she has had to go into 24 hour care.

With medication she could probably live another 15 years quite easily. That would basically be 15 years where she couldn't be left alone by her own elderly daughter. As an example she set fire to her own kitchen in the 30 minutes between being left alone and her next carer arriving.

This is the thing - even when people are in the most pitiful state with dementia, with just about zero quality of life, incontinent, no clue about anything, not recognising any family any more, they still pump them with pills and tablets to keep them alive that little bit longer. Even when they no longer want to eat or drink - surely a sign if ever there was one that they've had enough - they are often badgered and cajoled with special thickened drinks (on prescription) and God knows what.

As someone put it recently, it's often not so much a case of prolonging life, as of prolonging death.

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This is the thing - even when people are in the most pitiful state with dementia, with just about zero quality of life, incontinent, no clue about anything, not recognising any family any more, they still pump them with pills and tablets to keep them alive that little bit longer. Even when they no longer want to eat or drink - surely a sign if ever there was one that they've had enough - they are often badgered and cajoled with special thickened drinks (on prescription) and God knows what.

As someone put it recently, it's often not so much a case of prolonging life, as of prolonging death.

How about prolonging a stream of money for some, care homes, doctors, care workers, insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies...the list is endless. ;)

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Just thought I'd make the obvious point - this is the long-anticipated ageing population/ care crisis we've heard so much about but not really seen yet. People don't have enough money to pay for their own care, and now there isn't enough public funding to cover it.

There isn't a lot of fat to trim out of the care sector business model, especially in care of the elderly and there truly isn't anywhere else for people to go if these firms fail.

Not a lot that can be done in terms of restructuring either...we could always go back to the old model of people living at home with their families, but something tells me that will be a bit too much of an 'ask' for many modern families...

Watch this space

P

Is their room in the rabbit hutch?

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Is their room in the rabbit hutch?

no, even the rabbits get to live in the house cos there's no garden room.

Edited by SarahBell

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How about prolonging a stream of money for some, care homes, doctors, care workers, insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies...the list is endless. ;)

Maybe, but from exp. it's not infrequently the relatives, horrified and indignant if medics/professionals suggest someone should be allowed to die. Recently I've heard of someone appalled and furious that a man with advanced dementia who could no longer swallow (happens in late stages) was denied PEG feeding. 'How dare they treat my dad like this?' Yet PEG needs a surgical operation and constant expert care, and how on earth do you make someone with dementia understand/remember that they mustn't pull out that tube in their stomach? You can't, and unless you tie their hands or watch them every single second you can't stop them trying. It was bad enough with my FIL when he needed a catheter. 'What's this darn thing?' over and over - he yanked it out repeatedly.

So often IMO it's a case of medics prolonging life because they're terrified of being sued/stories in DM on lines of 'CALLOUS DOCTORS LET MY DAD DIE!'

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I would be in favour of a living will that doctors and family would abide by if the time ever came where it might be needed and actioned on.......I can't see how keeping a person alive with absolutely no quality of life and knowing they had no chance of any future quality of life be good for that person, anyone close to that person, who cares for that person or has an interest in that persons well being......I am sure plenty would have different opinions, but you have to ask yourself why if they cared enough would they have a different opinion. ;)

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Councils are setting prices and fees based on what they can afford post-spending-cuts...

This is the problem. Buyer has only 1 supplier, but strangely, the buyer still sets the prices.

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I've looked after 40 of them at a time, working in a typically understaffed dementia home. I will say it's much, much harder to look after relatives with dementia than it is to look after other people's parents. It's easier to stay detached.

My point was exactly that - the social structure has changed and people don't have the time, patience or understanding to care for ageing loved ones anymore. That's fine and dandy if we can farm out care...until the funding dries up.

I watched a two-part C4 documentary a few years ago (2009) about granny farming and dementia care, with Gerry Robinson. Totally depressing with the exception of at least one well run home, both for the staff in many instances and the residents. The fees involved were in all instances high, even where the local authorities paying.

'Anyone can buy a property and run a granny farm, so long as they have the cash.'

One of the care-owners took Gerry back to his house. A mansion, beautifully restored, plush fittings, top end cars. Gerry seemed genuinely astonished at the care-owner's house. He was trying to sell it at the time as well, for £4m.

Edited by Venger

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I've looked after 40 of them at a time, working in a typically understaffed dementia home. I will say it's much, much harder to look after relatives with dementia than it is to look after other people's parents. It's easier to stay detached.

My point was exactly that - the social structure has changed and people don't have the time, patience or understanding to care for ageing loved ones anymore. That's fine and dandy if we can farm out care...until the funding dries up.

P

However understaffed a care home may be, at least care workers can go home at the end of their shift.

The family member caring at home often gets no break at all, no peace from morning to night, and very often has to cope with constantly disturbed nights, too.

No wonder so many of them get to breaking point.

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This is the thing - even when people are in the most pitiful state with dementia, with just about zero quality of life, incontinent, no clue about anything, not recognising any family any more, they still pump them with pills and tablets to keep them alive that little bit longer. Even when they no longer want to eat or drink - surely a sign if ever there was one that they've had enough - they are often badgered and cajoled with special thickened drinks (on prescription) and God knows what.

As someone put it recently, it's often not so much a case of prolonging life, as of prolonging death.

One of the most depressing tale I heard was about a persons Aunty who has Parkinsons - bad.

She's totally compus, 80. She's constantly shaking. She just wants to die - I just want it to end - but cannot do anything.

She's 80 FFS. Even in the unlikely event they cure Parkinson's, she's still not going to have much life left to enjoy.

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For the folks saying that living with dementia isn't really a life worth living...I'm not so sure. The US leads the world in effective Dementia care, and it is possible to have a good standard of living. It just might not look that way to worried/ guilty relatives and people who don't understand the condition. And it's expensive. And don't forget, dementia sufferers are only a small proportion of the people needing long term care (10/20%). Some of them are just...well...old.

P

It doesn't matter how good, kind, professional and expert the care, the fact is that beyond a certain stage dementia is ALWAYS pitiful - eventually every shred of a person's dignity is stripped away.

I have seen enough of dementia over 15 years or so - one parent, one in-law and an aunt - and all the others in their various care homes (all good) to know what it means in practice.

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Respectfully beg to differ. "The Validation Breakthrough" by Naomi Feil is a great book on this subject. I've seen people in very advanced stages of dementia experience moments of real joy that not many of us young'uns seem to be able to access. It's all about understanding and expectations.

Whether it's socially desirable to extend life is one argument, wether it's possible to have a quality of life is a completely different one. Having had the privilege of giving 24 hour personal care to a number of individuals at different stages of the ageing process, I'm very clear on my own position on this.

It's an emotive subject though.

P

An insightful, well informed poster on the internet! I must be dreaming.

Thank you for sharing your experience and perspective.

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Respectfully beg to differ. "The Validation Breakthrough" by Naomi Feil is a great book on this subject. I've seen people in very advanced stages of dementia experience moments of real joy that not many of us young'uns seem to be able to access. It's all about understanding and expectations.

Whether it's socially desirable to extend life is one argument, wether it's possible to have a quality of life is a completely different one. Having had the privilege of giving 24 hour personal care to a number of individuals at different stages of the ageing process, I'm very clear on my own position on this.

It's an emotive subject though.

P

I don't dispute that moments of real joy may be possible (not that I've seen much of that in late stages) but that doesn't alter the loss of dignity aspect.

I have seen a family member fish a nugget of pooh out of their pants and hold it up. 'Ooh, look!' No idea even of what it was, or that they shouldn't then wrap it up in a tissue and put it in their pocket. No idea that they now need to wash their hands. Then you have to talk to them as if they were a 2 year old, 'Come along, let's wash your hands...' and gently lead them off, that is if they don't decide they don't want to wash their hands and throw a strop.

And this sort of thing is not remotely uncommon in later stages of dementia. If that's any sort of 'quality of life' then I'm a banana.

And the worst of it, when it's someone you know and love, is that you know how utterly horrified and appalled their former selves would be, if they could see what they've turned into.

Edited by Mrs Bear

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My point was exactly that - the social structure has changed and people don't have the time, patience or understanding to care for ageing loved ones anymore. That's fine and dandy if we can farm out care...until the funding dries up.

It's not really that. Lots of family do look after their aging parents. What's changed is what happens when those parents decline goes too far for their children to cope: instead of a timely death, they go into enforced zombiedom.

Today's red tape makes keeping a zombie incredibly expensive.

The topic is an HPC perennial. For example,

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=164302

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=166418

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=174985

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  • 242 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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