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Ed Milliband

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Exactly. That's why he needs Labour to lose the next election and precipitate a new leadership contest.

Well, you'd think that by talking utter sh1te at every opportunity he'd be pushing Labour towards an election defeat but the great British public seems to be lapping it up. He should see if he can remember what the truth is - a concept he lost touch with a long time back if, indeed, he was ever familiar with it - and try that approach instead. That would scare people away for sure.

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It seems to me that as soon as Osborne got into no11 he cut the tax's for people that earn over £500,000 a year. Although it could be argued that paying 50% in tax is to much I think there should have been more pressing things to do before helping out his rich mates.

It took a year and a half, so I wouldn't exactly say 'as soon as'. I don't think Osborne is a great chancellor by any means, nor do I think he's a particularly righteous person, but you might want to consider that he wants to keep the tax on high earners at least close to being below the 50% mark (it's still well above once you include employer's NI) on the basis that the overall tax take will quite likely increase not decrease as a result.

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Liam "sorry we pissed all the money away" Byrne or Andy "actually I spent mine on mascara" Burnham? I don't think either of them are Labour's best hope.

I met Burnham when he was at the Home Office. He's a chancer.

John Mann would be a breath of fresh air but he's got zero chance of even making it into the shadow cabinet. He's like Frank Field – too outspoken to get very far.

Edited by Spork of Damocles

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He keeps repeating "millionaires, millionaires, millionaires" :rolleyes:.

And, as my wife says, he looks like a budgie :lol:.

That is very unkind to budgies.

Must say it's Nick Clegg that makes me think of budgies - looking in the mirror and saying, 'Who's a pretty boy, then?'

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Blair - changed the labour constitution

Cameron - bullingdon boy

Ed M - moneyed toff champagne socialist with a bad semi-plummy accent

can't get much worse

Cameron, Clegg, Millipede, Balls and countless others: Oxford PPE sociopaths.

Only Ed Milliband sounds and looks like he's special needs which I think will be a big issue at the next election. Not that I've anything against special needs people running for public office.

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Only Ed Milliband sounds and looks like he's special needs which I think will be a big issue at the next election. Not that I've anything against special needs people running for public office.

Well we did give Gordon Brown a go.

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Labour had their chance and they made a right pigs ear of it.....any trust has evaporated, there is nothing there to prove otherwise...all hot air and empty promises.....waste of time. ;)

What people are realising is that this "mess" that the Conservatives have kept referring to as if they were going to clean it up, is an even bigger mess. By the time of the next election, the UK will have inevitably lost its AAA rating and any credibility that Osborne had would vanish. Of course, they could attempt to find a more competent chancellor but that might not repair the reputational damage.

This government had their chance and have already made a right pigs ear of it within 2 years.

Whereas the previous government were not allowed to claim that the credit crisis and the weight of the financial services industry in the British economy meant that the UK was always going to be severely hit, I don't see why this government should be able to claim that the Euro crisis is the only cause of all growth in the economy having been killed off and the debt issue actually worsening.

They wanted to reduce the debt as fast as possible by reducing the size of the State for ideological reasons but instead have made the deficit problem even worse: the result being a shrinking economy AS WELL AS a debt mountain that is no more under control than it was during the credit crisis.

I've never seen a government lose credibility so fast to be totally honest.

Remember those calls from the previous government not to cut too fast... some people actually remember these quotes (as well as those from famous Tories about our economy not being liberal enough and not being easy enough on the banks just a few years before the crisis. Somehow Ireland was the model we were supposed to follow? Smart guys, we have in power)

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Cameron, Clegg, Millipede, Balls and countless others: Oxford PPE sociopaths.

Only Ed Milliband sounds and looks like he's special needs which I think will be a big issue at the next election. Not that I've anything against special needs people running for public office.

Only Ed Miliband?

Osborne and Cameron both seem very intellectually limited and it is pretty noticeable (and the outcome of their ideas or lack thereof are already showing) as soon as they talk EXCEPT for Southern England middle-class folk.

It reminds me of the years I lived in the US and had to explain to people that from outside the US, George W Bush seemed like a complete moron simply after listening to him try to say a few sentences. A number of Republicans were genuinely convinced that he sounded perfectly normal and was just taking his time to be clear in what he said.

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"Ed Balls calls for stamp duty break" - idiot.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-19779395

Shadow chancellor Ed Balls is to call for 100,000 new affordable homes and a two-year stamp duty holiday for first-time buyers to kick-start the economy.

Mr Balls will say the £3-4bn needed to fund the move should come from the sale of the 4G mobile spectrum.

"Add to that a stamp duty holiday for first-time buyers, and we can deliver real help for people aspiring to get on the property ladder."

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And the reason that no-one was prepared to keep lending short to them was that they were watching their mortgage default rates rise to the point where they didn't think they'd get their money back if they did. I don't recall any of the principles keeping their jobs and I don't notice them making any new loans, so I'm not entirely sure what point you're trying to make there...

I think you read the wrong version of the Credit Crisis. Mortgage default rates were hardly rising in the UK in 2007 when the run on Northern Rock occurred and they still are not rising much (when considering how overvalued property was, they should have done). You're thinking of the US.

Northern Rock, unlike other mortgage lenders, did not fund their loans via customer deposits like most retails banks do. They were borrowing directly on the markets to then lend to customers: a highly-leveraged model where essentially they were lending money they didn't have. When the cost of funding suddenly increased and liquidity in the money markets dried up, who's the first casualty in the UK? Northern Rock of course.

So basically they were correcting you for stating that the demise of Northern Rock and others was all down to lending to people who then defaulted. The whole "subprime" malarky is very much an American phenomenon. The term itself was only used in the US until the credit crunch.

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Not in power, he'll make lots of promises.

I highly doubt this one will happen, the big banks won't be happy about being split up.

Go much further and take away the power of the Banks to lend money into existence with interest. Let them earn a more honest living by lending out money on deposit and then they will no longer be able to hold us to ransom. Their bonuses would evaporate and salaries would dive. Produce the politician who would do this and we would stand a chance of avoiding the nighmare that threatens the majority of us.

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Gordon Brown was the captain that drove the ship in to the iceberg. George Osborne is the purser that locked the poor down below where they would be first to go.

If only if he was just guilty of not giving a c*** about the poor. If he had been competent enough to handle the debt while still keeping a healthy economy and looking in the long-term (i.e. how is our country going to operate in 20 years time if we are not investing in higher education and infrastructure rather than caring about house prices for the middle class), it wouldn't so much. He's delivered an economy that is in terrible shape and is not ready for the decades to come now.

The UK will lose its AAA rating from at least one ratings agency in the next few months as its debt increases at an uncontrolled rate partially because of the killing off of any growth.

That will be the nail in the coffin of Osborne's career as one by one each agency retracts that AAA rating (not that it matters but the Tories have bet their careers on this stupid idea) and by then, I think most voters will be fed up of Cameron's spin.

Most likely it will be Ed Miliband as PM with Vince Cable as his chancellor. The British electorate will vote for this by default but will end up with a government that has a heavy Social Democratic tone to it (Cable former member of the SDP as well as Labour and one of the only true Social Democrats in the LibDems and Miliband simply because of his background) which will be pretty absurd.

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Liam Byrne. The most odious of the lot, there are not enough adjectives to describe him.

I can say something good about him.

He's not Blair.

(or in terms of the current lot, he's not Balls).

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That is simply not true. Look up Kensington Mortgages, and many others. GE Capital, GMAC for instance. Most of the major banks had explicit sub prime arms. They were mainly known as 'self certification' or 'non conforming'. Over 50% of all mortgages at the peak were self -certified.

+1

For example, here are reports from 2001 and 2004 about 'subprime' products from Birmingham Midshires -

http://www.mortgagestrategy.co.uk/cmls-offers-95-ltv-sub-prime-tracker-from-birmingham-midshires/77721.article

http://www.mortgagestrategy.co.uk/birmingham-midshires-bops-to-a-new-groove/88320.article

Also this market report from 2005. It contains the interesting statistic that 60% of brokers said that over half their subprime business was self-certification.

http://www.mortgagestrategy.co.uk/Journals/2/Files/2009/10/15/sub-prime_supplement_2005.pdf

Edited by thecrashingisles

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When my then-landlady gave me the boot in 2005, I did the rounds of estate agents. They all wanted to get me a mortgage, and someone was pushy enough to get me an actual in-principle thingey for £150k from Northern Rock.

I was very sub-prime at the time. I was about to start a new contract paying good money, but that was just one client, and a contract they could've terminated at a stroke at any time. My history was of an income of £7k in 2004 and £3k in 2003. The fact they were desperate to give me a mortgage was a huge red flag over the market, and a clear signal (if I had needed one) that it was a Good Idea to turn down the landlady's offer of first refusal on the old flat.

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What people are realising is that this "mess" that the Conservatives have kept referring to as if they were going to clean it up, is an even bigger mess. By the time of the next election, the UK will have inevitably lost its AAA rating and any credibility that Osborne had would vanish. Of course, they could attempt to find a more competent chancellor but that might not repair the reputational damage.

This government had their chance and have already made a right pigs ear of it within 2 years.

Whereas the previous government were not allowed to claim that the credit crisis and the weight of the financial services industry in the British economy meant that the UK was always going to be severely hit, I don't see why this government should be able to claim that the Euro crisis is the only cause of all growth in the economy having been killed off and the debt issue actually worsening.

They wanted to reduce the debt as fast as possible by reducing the size of the State for ideological reasons but instead have made the deficit problem even worse: the result being a shrinking economy AS WELL AS a debt mountain that is no more under control than it was during the credit crisis.

I've never seen a government lose credibility so fast to be totally honest.

Remember those calls from the previous government not to cut too fast... some people actually remember these quotes (as well as those from famous Tories about our economy not being liberal enough and not being easy enough on the banks just a few years before the crisis. Somehow Ireland was the model we were supposed to follow? Smart guys, we have in power)

so, as unemployment continues to fall and inward investment increases, as the deficit hits 8% after Labour bequeathed one of 12%, an economic miracle akin to, well, Thatcher's in the early 80s, presumably that will make the current govt even more unpopular?

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Cameron, Clegg, Millipede, Balls and countless others: Oxford PPE sociopaths.

Only Ed Milliband sounds and looks like he's special needs which I think will be a big issue at the next election. Not that I've anything against special needs people running for public office.

like Kinnock, Brown and Foot (the latter was one of those Savants, kinda thing, literature genius, gave brilliant talks on the subject on the side in the commons, heavily patronised by MPs of all colours - Dan Hannan gave a glowing obituary on this very point)

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What people are realising is that this "mess" that the Conservatives have kept referring to as if they were going to clean it up, is an even bigger mess. By the time of the next election, the UK will have inevitably lost its AAA rating and any credibility that Osborne had would vanish. Of course, they could attempt to find a more competent chancellor but that might not repair the reputational damage.

This government had their chance and have already made a right pigs ear of it within 2 years.

Whereas the previous government were not allowed to claim that the credit crisis and the weight of the financial services industry in the British economy meant that the UK was always going to be severely hit, I don't see why this government should be able to claim that the Euro crisis is the only cause of all growth in the economy having been killed off and the debt issue actually worsening.

They wanted to reduce the debt as fast as possible by reducing the size of the State for ideological reasons but instead have made the deficit problem even worse: the result being a shrinking economy AS WELL AS a debt mountain that is no more under control than it was during the credit crisis.

I've never seen a government lose credibility so fast to be totally honest.

Remember those calls from the previous government not to cut too fast... some people actually remember these quotes (as well as those from famous Tories about our economy not being liberal enough and not being easy enough on the banks just a few years before the crisis. Somehow Ireland was the model we were supposed to follow? Smart guys, we have in power)

What I would like to know is how much/percentage the public sector increased under the last labour government?

Things all looked good on paper when people had borrowed money in their pockets to spend, they could consume and use all sorts of services to their hearts content.....now only the few have as much access to money even at our unprecedented low interest rates, the only ones that can spend now is the state....the rest either can't or won't because the time is not right, the conditions are not right, loss of confidence, future uncertainty, demand is low,belts are tightening, sensible people are trying to deleverage..........the economy is tipping to such an extent that it has become lopsided out of kilter.....the haves, the can have and the havenots. ;)

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He keeps repeating "millionaires, millionaires, millionaires" :rolleyes:.

And, as my wife says, he looks like a budgie :lol:.

He certainly does not look like a competent prime minister or leader at all.

I fear it may be post election before the labour party discover this.

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"it's the leader of the opposition stupid"

Whilst Clinton and his advisors claimed the us presidential elections are fought in the economy, I have arrived at the conclusion that uk elections are decided SOLELY on the issue of whether the leader of the opposition is deemed a better bet than those still in office. In 79 the people thought thatchert strong and Callaghan weak, in 83 they could not countenance foot , in 87 and 92 ( Tories should have had a kicking then ) the reason labour lost was Kinnock .

In 97 the economy and mood of the British people had never favoured a sitting government more yet the people liked bliar and liked him better than Hague and Howard in 01 and 05.

Despite millions on the payroll, people wanted brown out but not enough of them liked Cameron enough to give him a landslide .

Funnily enough despite their unpopularity I still think Cameron will win the next one outright as ironically I think people will turn away from milliband when the crunch comes and vote liberal thus splitting the anti Tory vote like in the 80's and early 90's.

No matter how much people don't like the Tories you will find millions will not countenance buzz lightweight in number ten . Soft labour will simply not turn up , hard and soft Tory vote will keep him out .

I predict the lowest turnout ever and a Tory majority by 30 seats

Edited by Sir Harold m

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