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Big ££ from property 4 ever

Ouch, That Raw Nerve Really Stings...........

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Guys,

My other post seems to have dissappeared into the ether?

All I was trying to say was that while you guys keep discussing the facts about the Coming HPC, there are lots, and lots of people that are and will continue to make a nice living from property during the ups and the downs.

I thought that most on here were adults, able to look objectively at both sides of the argument and realise that the topic is not as cut and dried as it may first appear.

You can keep on, and on, and on discussing the negative aspects of the coming crash but what positives are there in that apart from telling your mates i told you so.

So, discuss away chaps, just wanted to open your eyes to the highly profitable world of property WHATEVER the market conditions.

You cannot call yourselves objective investors if you cannot admit that there is money to be made in all markets at all times.

Again, have a good day at the office and enjoy your hour lunch break.

Maynard et al, leave this post where it is to stimulate some objective discussion.

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Guys,

My other post seems to have dissappeared into the ether?

All I was trying to say was that while you guys keep discussing the facts about the Coming HPC, there are lots, and lots of people that are and will continue to make a nice living from property during the ups and the downs.

I thought that most on here were adults, able to look objectively at both sides of the argument and realise that the topic is not as cut and dried as it may first appear.

You can keep on, and on, and on discussing the negative aspects of the coming crash but what positives are there in that apart from telling your mates i told you so.

So, discuss away chaps, just wanted to open your eyes to the highly profitable world of property WHATEVER the market conditions.

You cannot call yourselves objective investors if you cannot admit that there is money to be made in all markets at all times.

Again, have a good day at the office and enjoy your hour lunch break.

Maynard et al, leave this post where it is to stimulate some objective discussion.

you forget to add at the end...

"Register your online banking details right now and let US make the most of these exciting opportunities for YOU..."

Edited by Losing Faith

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aw LF !!.

you shoulndt have posted. this thread was sailing nicely to the bottom with no replies.

its a non question post, just silly childish goading. dont respond to it.

(oh no. ive responded to it myself..)

Edited by right_freds_dead

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Still cant admit it can you guys.

Be adults. Admit there are opportunities EVERYWHERE.

There are oppotunities almost everywhere, even oppotunities for bankrupcy, oppotunities for a debt burdernd life, oppotunities for a negative outcome when you dont know what your doing.

Some bloke at the airport offerd me £10K to take accross a package - apparently loads of other people have in the past so there is definatly money to be made. You would think that this guy would of kept it to himself and taken the package himself if its such a nice money earner.

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Still cant admit it can you guys.

Be adults. Admit there are opportunities EVERYWHERE.

Unfortuantely, we're not all budding property moguls like yourself.

Some of us just want the oppourtunity to buy a house. Hence, why we want the market to correct.

I don't disagree that for some people there is still money to be made, but at this moment in time, that's not my concern.

Well done you. Pull the ladder up Jack, I'm alright.

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Still cant admit it can you guys.

Be adults. Admit there are opportunities EVERYWHERE.

Whether good or bad, in any market there will always be opportunities to be had, if you are a property speculator (and know what you are doing), I've absolutely no doubt there is still money to be made. However I'm an IT specialist, and have little interest in investing in property, other than being able to buy a home I'd be happy to live in at a sensible price. Which incidentally common sense tells me that now is not the time, for me it's simple.

Also you have to remember that having a place to live is fundamentally linked to quality of life, after all everyone needs somewhere to call home, it's hardly surprising that some people may react adversely to others having made a stack of cash...

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I think that the problem her is that we have now been proven right...

it is easy to say that economic forces dictate house prices and all high prices do is gear the economy into making the required changes to bring prices down.

It is possible to write pages to illustrate why this is the case.

I know that some areas have seen minor rises.. and some much higher.

London has seen prices go up 80% which seems massive until compared with areas like devon where we have seen 400% rises.

but our argument cannot be countered while the whole economy is examined.

an argument that focuses on house prices in isolation can hold water until the wider economy is bought into the equation.

Essentially this forum is made up of many different walks of life. but all geared to one belief..

that house prices will do as they have always done, and as the economy dictates.

They will drop.

Edited by apom

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Guys,

My other post seems to have dissappeared into the ether?

All I was trying to say was that while you guys keep discussing the facts about the Coming HPC, there are lots, and lots of people that are and will continue to make a nice living from property during the ups and the downs.

I thought that most on here were adults, able to look objectively at both sides of the argument and realise that the topic is not as cut and dried as it may first appear.

You can keep on, and on, and on discussing the negative aspects of the coming crash but what positives are there in that apart from telling your mates i told you so.

So, discuss away chaps, just wanted to open your eyes to the highly profitable world of property WHATEVER the market conditions.

You cannot call yourselves objective investors if you cannot admit that there is money to be made in all markets at all times.

Again, have a good day at the office and enjoy your hour lunch break.

Maynard et al, leave this post where it is to stimulate some objective discussion.

The cleverest investors are those who know when to enter and more importantly WHEN TO EXIT. The sheep will be left to pick up the pieces.

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So, discuss away chaps, just wanted to open your eyes to the highly profitable world of property WHATEVER the market conditions.

Err, 'market conditions' is a term for whether the market is profitable or not, no? So you've contradicted yourself by saying that even if the market may be loss-making, then there's profit to be made. Err, no. It would be a good idea to keep your money in a BETTER market, ie be relatively property-short, in such circumstances. This is why some here and in other forums are debating the relative merits of foreign currency, cash, bonds, gold etc.

If you have made money out of the favourable property market in the past then fair enough, and I suspect that at the point when nobody but nobody is investing in property, buying in 'at the bottom' may be a savvy idea if you can time it, however now will probably prove to be a bad time.

You actually don't seem to understand what you are saying! Classic!

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Still cant admit it can you guys.

Be adults. Admit there are opportunities EVERYWHERE.

Go on the floor is yours, tell me just how you can make money from property starting from today and let`s say in 4 months time, end Feb 2006, demonstrate a reasonable return. Let`s say by using 200k and getting a 10% return, after tax. That would get you a reasonable income of 60K p.a. before tax and deducting loan charges. You are not allowed to use the phrase BMV, insult our intelligence that you can flip after buying at auctions, that you have inside track knowledge and are clubbing togther to buy half of a new 2 bed block that no one will ever live in at the absurd prices originally paid (no room for a return on rental yield either) .....I`m sure I`ve left out other possibilites. Fact is a lot of money has been made in property, Has. Those times are over. If I had a portfolio with equity of 1 mil right now I would be selling it all before it reaches a low of perhaps 750K. There may be relative bargains for individuals to: buy, do up, and heh..get this..a bit radical I know, but actually live in themselves.

Now if someone had a portfolio that demonstrated positive yields, a portfolio that was built up over 15-20 years that had interest payments half the rental income, then yes they will continue to make money. However, an industry contact tells me that the average BTL player portfolio is 650K, the BTLetters valuation, spread over 5 properties. They have mainly bought in the last three years and they believe they have approx. equity of 30-35%. How are these guys going to make money? By diversifying into buying BMVs :lol:

Edited by Converted Lurker

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You are quite correct. There is, and will always be, money to be made in property. In the LONG term if you bought today and sold in 25 years you would make money - its called inflation. The arguement that people get across is that in the SHORT term the prices are going to drop. You are buying a deflating commodity.

The market was flooded with amateur BTL's who basically just bought a property and sold for a profit. The profit was not down to the work that they done on the house per se, it was partly just 'demand' and high expectations from asking prices that were achieved.

We, the bears, argue that you could STILL make money out of property if the prices were 50% cheaper. The return may not be as much but you could flip 4-5 houses a year if the prices were available to more people. IE Cheaper.

Hope you make money - good luck to you. All I am saying is this, "If you feel confident that you can make money in todays market - then good luck to you. I certainly believe that whereas 1-2 years ago there was people queuing up to buy property at any price, today there are people saying I AM NOT PAYING IT. The buyers control the market now!

TB

PS I do agree that GOOD property will ALWAYS sell, ALL OF TIME. Just dont expect the profit margins you are accustomed to!

Edited by teddyboy

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You can keep on, and on, and on discussing the negative aspects of the coming crash but what positives are there in that apart from telling your mates i told you so.

This site spends most of it's time discussing the positive sides of the crash.

We tend to belong to the crowd who think that good quality, affordable property should be within the reach of the average person.

I pesonally think that if I can buy a really nice 4 bed house in London for £250k that would be great.

If I was into BTL I would be happier if the prices were lower, as this would increase my income generated from the property.

The real doom-mongers are the ones who think I should be paying £500k for a 3 bed in a crummy road.

Taken to it's logical conclusion, it's the doom mongers (like Kirstie) who seem to think that if we all had to pay £500k to live in a 1 bed sh!thole then we'd all be endlessly happy.

Personally I'd be far happier if a nurse working in a Putney hospital could afford a modest apartment in the area.

But apparently, according to Kirstie and the like, this makes me a "doom-monger".

It's a very screwed up world.

Edited by BandWagon

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Well what a refreshing change.

Rather than being ridiculed and deleted immediately by the powers that be as was the last post,a bit of level headed and two sided debate has ensued.

[ Moderator: I have investigated the alleged deletion of your post and can inform you it was not deleted. ]

One thing that my post has made me realise is that there are a lot of people out there that need a "crash" purely to be in a position to afford to buy a property. Although aware of this fact, I've never really considered it properly.

To me, this would stand as a valid argument & I hope that things move in your favour. The fact that I and many other will stand to make money from the correction is an added bonus.

But, there are also people on here judging from comments that feel that anyone that speculates on property whether in a falling or a rising market is a wrongun and is just making money at the expense of others. This isn't right.

To answer you all,one by one:

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Losing Faith

"Register your online banking details right now and let US make the most of these exciting opportunities for YOU..."

Thanks very much for the kind offer but I would never trust my money to someone that only considers the negative side of the market.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

right_freds_dead

"its a non question post, just silly childish goading. dont respond to it.(oh no. ive responded to it myself..)

This post has been edited by right_freds_dead: Today, 01:33 PM

Why not respond to it. Why is it just silly childish goading? If it's because you need a crash to be in a position to afford a property then sorry, but thats life. If it is because you can't accept the fact that there are people that will make cash regardless, then tough.

And it's a good avatar wasted.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Bart of Darkness

Well done. Really funny. My wife was in bits when I told her. Keep it up...........

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Jeff Ross

Bravo. Priceless. Keep on keeping on.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Losing Faith

Total Crap Posts - Brilliant. Nearly fell of the sofa. Well done. Brilliant :D

_________________________________________________________________________________________

theChuz

"There are oppotunities almost everywhere, even oppotunities for bankrupcy, oppotunities for a debt burdernd life, oppotunities for a negative outcome when you dont know what your doing"

If you don't know what your doing then yes theChuz, you'll lose money. But why be so negative? Bankrupcy, debt burdernd life, for a negative outcome.

This comment could relate to ANY market that you are involved in.

If you can not assess and balance the risk for whatever you are doing then you should stay employed.

Good luck.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Maynard

Valid point. I'm sorry that currently things arent good for what you want to do.

Things are to change and you and I wil be laughing :blink:

_________________________________________________________________________________________

right_freds_dead

We all work. Just some smarter than others.

Don't understand your post but I'm sure that it's funny for those in the know.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

zoid

Good point. But why does no one react when people make a mint from utility providers that have increased their prices by over 30% over the past couple of years?

_________________________________________________________________________________________

the end is nigh & right_freds_dead

Remember, slip, slap, slop.....

_________________________________________________________________________________________

dom

Grow up......

_________________________________________________________________________________________

apom

"They will drop" - good news for FTB on here & good news for me - Win win

_________________________________________________________________________________________

karhu

"The cleverest investors are those who know when to enter and more importantly WHEN TO EXIT. The sheep will be left to pick up the pieces" - a MASSIVE generalisation. The whole point that you miss is that ALL of the div investors are rushing to leave the market. This means loads of BMV properties to flip but more importantly, due to the lack of rental properties, voids are reducing to next to nothing. Result.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Si1

Your post is fantastically blinkered and sums up the general feeling of most of the non FTB posters on this site. Thank you.

"Err, 'market conditions' is a term for whether the market is profitable or not, no? So you've contradicted yourself by saying that even if the market may be loss-making, then there's profit to be made. Err, no. It would be a good idea to keep your money in a BETTER market, ie be relatively property-short, in such circumstances. This is why some here and in other forums are debating the relative merits of foreign currency, cash, bonds, gold etc."

Err, no. Sorry but your really silly. Silly, silly, silly.

When has market conditions related soley to whether the market is profitable or not?

I may be financially better rewarded for having my money in other markets but why invest in markets I know nothing about? As you seem to do?

If you can't argue eloquently then please do not.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Converted Lurker

Your right. The floor IS mine.

To start, lets NOT use your figures. Lets assume a + £20k per 1\4 year profit after costs. Thats one property sold every 3 months. Piece of p**s at the right price.

These are properties bought BMV - to insult your intelligence. Why are you so paranoid. Are you worried about your IQ?

There is ho HAS. Only if you believe that properties HAVE been made. But then youll always be lagging behind. Is that you?

CL, who cares what your industry contact tells you? the fact that you rely on second hand info ( £650k over 5 properties or £130k per place - Nice) Either you are a fool or your adviser and his clients are fools. Either way, you lose. Most of my people paid £30k for a place and are getting 13%.

Good luck.............

_________________________________________________________________________________________

teddyboy

There WILL be profit to be made short & long term. Dont believe the neg heads.

"You are buying a deflating commodity" - as you do with a car. LOTS of my pals have made ££££ dealing in 2nd hand cars.

Nothing fits all markets in all circumstances.

Cheers for the positive vote. Yes I can make a profit in the current market :lol:

________________________________________________________________________________________

So there you go.

Seems like a split between those that want a crash to afford a house and those that want a crash to prove that they know they are right.

For those looking to buy. Sorry. I hope the coming correction puts you in a position to buy.

For all those market speculators that "know best" and like to post the fact on here. You lose.

Though you may well be right that there will be a crash, I, unlike you, will still make loads of money rather than posting on here.

The property market is multi faceted whatever the timescale. The pro's will stilll make loads by doing next to nothing. I know it greives you "hands on" investors but hey, thats life.

Anyway, good luck to you FTB, stay bitter to you "no money in property investors".

CRASH you win - CRASH I win - It hurts SO good...........

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What a strange man.

Yeah, I thought he was PropertyGuru back to haunt us again, but he does seem to have more intelligent comments (although that isn't too difficult)

Edited by BandWagon

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Tatty (good name - sums you up) & Bandwagon,

If you have an agrgument that is valid, please post.

The only reson that I may be strange to you is because I am not currently pressing my shirt in readiness for my 8 hours at the office tomorrow.

Please, strange, expand. if you can.

Dont miss the bus tomorrow :lol:

It sums this and a lot of other boards up.

One line replies from one line losers.

Sorry, but it seems true.

Nothing to say - nothing to give.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0...1979205-2774045

may help

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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