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For Those Waiting For An Hpc


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Now you really sound like an estate agent :rolleyes:.

I am paying for a roof over my head.

We all have to pay for a roof over our heads and there are three ways of doing it. Whichever way you choose it costs money.

1. Buy a house with cash and lose the interest on the money you no longer have in the bank.

2. Buy a house with borrowed money and pay interest to a lender.

3. Rent a house from a landlord.

For me not owning a home over 30 would cramp my lifestyle. It's difficult to start a family in someone else's home.

I just wouldn't have the patience by then to wait around for a golden period of buying a house that may never arrive. I'd certainly be damned to keep coughing up any money to a landlord knowing that same money could be going on my own abode irrespective of it's appreciation/depreciation.

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If they didn't keep asking the same question they wouldn't keep getting the same answer :lol:.

I know, and I understand.

I don't have money in the bank, and I'm not getting interest on it. However, the amount I'm paying in rent is way less than what I'd be paying on a mortgage for a similar property.

My rent is £825 / month, for a property that wqould be on the market for over £300k. Plus, I don't have the worry about maintenance, and my Landlord looks after all the white goods, too.

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I know, and I understand.

I don't have money in the bank, and I'm not getting interest on it. However, the amount I'm paying in rent is way less than what I'd be paying on a mortgage for a similar property.

My rent is £825 / month, for a property that wqould be on the market for over £300k. Plus, I don't have the worry about maintenance, and my Landlord looks after all the white goods, too.

Now that's a handy boyfriend/girlfriend to have. :P

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Provided I can sell, I will be trading up/moving away from TOWIEwood in 2013. I will know where the youngest is going to secondary school by then and life is ticking by. 12 wasted years already. Another 12 and my kids will be grown up and I'll be getting old (er/too old).

Edited by General Melchett
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Only true if the amount you save in mortgage interest is more than returns on the same money invested.

Also if you have substantial savings then that brings certain lifestyle bonuses of its own: you never have to "worry about money", about paying bills or not working (for years at a time possibly), you never have to think "oh I cant afford xyz this month, Ill have to wait till next pay day" etc etc etc. I dont know about other people in the same position think but personally I'm not desperate to swap that position to being a net-debtor and having to live month to month with no cash reserve.

Pretty much where I am. It takes a lot of stress out of your life having a big wodge of cash to fall back on. I could buy a crap place for cash now, but why? My interest on savings even at these levels covers half my monthly rent and regardless of the indices, prices ain't going to go up any significant amount for donkeys. Even if they stagnate, I'm adding to the cash pool, meaning each month I can buy a better and better place for cash. I'm not beholden to my job and I can get the **** out of dodge any time I choose should it be necessary. That's a lot of flexibility and I'm pretty comfortable with it, more so than just diving into the market now and tying myself up with now flexibility.

The only thing I need to worry about is either the banks collapsing and me losing what I have, or hyper-inflation, meaning I will stand around watching my hard earned go up in smoke just to keep warm for a bit longer. But I'm sure there will be plenty of other stuff to be worrying about should either situation occur, so I'll kep on the sidelines for now.

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For me not owning a home over 30 would cramp my lifestyle. It's difficult to start a family in someone else's home.

I just wouldn't have the patience by then to wait around for a golden period of buying a house that may never arrive. I'd certainly be damned to keep coughing up any money to a landlord knowing that same money could be going on my own abode irrespective of it's appreciation/depreciation.

AWOOOGA

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I know, and I understand.

I don't have money in the bank, and I'm not getting interest on it. However, the amount I'm paying in rent is way less than what I'd be paying on a mortgage for a similar property.

My rent is £825 / month, for a property that wqould be on the market for over £300k. Plus, I don't have the worry about maintenance, and my Landlord looks after all the white goods, too.

Exactly.

Not really, infact it makes perfect sense to me. If you've just spent X amount of years saving to buy, waiting around for a potential crash when you can comfortably buy now strikes me as an enormous waste of time.

The bottom line is not having your own house over the age of 30 is a cramp on your lifestyle, hence why I will be buying at that point or before.

Except for the first 20 years of your mortgage where your frontloaded repayments are for interest only. You'd better hope that it appreciates in value or you're stuffed, financially, by the time you are 50.

Edited by Toto deVeer
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For me not owning a home over 30 would cramp my lifestyle. It's difficult to start a family in someone else's home.

I just wouldn't have the patience by then to wait around for a golden period of buying a house that may never arrive. I'd certainly be damned to keep coughing up any money to a landlord knowing that same money could be going on my own abode irrespective of it's appreciation/depreciation.

My home is my home, it is a house owned by someone else but it's my home. The interest on the money I have in the bank, rather than tied up in an illiquid, depreciating asset, more then covers the amount I pay out in rent and I am more than £100K in pocket as a result.

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Just apply at your local council and start bidding on properties. More chance if you are single I guess. By the way I'm not saving £60 entirely due to social. I was paying a lot for a "luxury apartment" with a gym and concierge before so not exactly comparing like with like.

Thanks Steed, but surely I have to qualify as being in some sort of category? Don't I have to be pregnant (a bit difficult at the moment, but I may get a sex change if it reduces my rent bill), or don't I have to be beneath a certain level of savings in the bank? Or from abroad with 46 children? Or seeking asylum from a foreign regime, a recovering alcoholic or domestic abuse victim, ex-con or summink? As a single Brit male with no form and no kids, am I not outside of any categories considered "worthy"???

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I became somewhat wary of the rate of increase in residential property prices in the later part of 2003 and in 2004. Prices in my district had, after languishing for a decade, begun to rise markedly from around 1999, with a noticeable pick up in the rate of increase in the 2001-2003 period.

There is no doubt that prices had become historically low in the middle part of the 1990s and it appeared clear to me that the correction had overshot by 2004. Price rises were much more muted in 2005 but In the second half of 2006 there was another blip upwards. At that stage I was happy to exit (selling in October 2006) and wait.

My opinion is that the 'crash' has essentially come and gone. From the third quarter of 2007 to the second quarter of 2009 residential prices fell 18.7% (Nationwide quarterly series - see charts), a healthy correction by any standards and greater in real terms given that prices generally were rising throughout the period.

I expect that people who are waiting for material nominal price reductions are likely to be waiting in vain although real residential property prices may well ease somewhat even from here.

Aailable flats and houses in my district are offering better value now than they have at any time since the late 1990s and I think it's very hard to argue a persuasive case for significant declines from here.

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I became somewhat wary of the rate of increase in residential property prices in the later part of 2003 and in 2004. Prices in my district had, after languishing for a decade, begun to rise markedly from around 1999, with a noticeable pick up in the rate of increase in the 2001-2003 period.

There is no doubt that prices had become historically low in the middle part of the 1990s and it appeared clear to me that the correction had overshot by 2004. Price rises were much more muted in 2005 but In the second half of 2006 there was another blip upwards. At that stage I was happy to exit (selling in October 2006) and wait.

My opinion is that the 'crash' has essentially come and gone. From the third quarter of 2007 to the second quarter of 2009 residential prices fell 18.7% (Nationwide quarterly series - see charts), a healthy correction by any standards and greater in real terms given that prices generally were rising throughout the period.

I expect that people who are waiting for material nominal price reductions are likely to be waiting in vain although real residential property prices may well ease somewhat even from here.

Aailable flats and houses in my district are offering better value now than they have at any time since the late 1990s and I think it's very hard to argue a persuasive case for significant declines from here.

Base rate to 5% or more? A sudden reversal of forebearance? Removal of SMI?

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I became somewhat wary of the rate of increase in residential property prices in the later part of 2003 and in 2004. Prices in my district had, after languishing for a decade, begun to rise markedly from around 1999, with a noticeable pick up in the rate of increase in the 2001-2003 period.

There is no doubt that prices had become historically low in the middle part of the 1990s and it appeared clear to me that the correction had overshot by 2004. Price rises were much more muted in 2005 but In the second half of 2006 there was another blip upwards. At that stage I was happy to exit (selling in October 2006) and wait.

My opinion is that the 'crash' has essentially come and gone. From the third quarter of 2007 to the second quarter of 2009 residential prices fell 18.7% (Nationwide quarterly series - see charts), a healthy correction by any standards and greater in real terms given that prices generally were rising throughout the period.

I expect that people who are waiting for material nominal price reductions are likely to be waiting in vain although real residential property prices may well ease somewhat even from here.

Aailable flats and houses in my district are offering better value now than they have at any time since the late 1990s and I think it's very hard to argue a persuasive case for significant declines from here.

Whereabouts did you say your estate agency branch was based?

;)

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Whereabouts did you say your estate agency branch was based?

;)

Ha ha

I don't have an estate agency branch and am simply reporting my experience. The local estate agents have been conspicuously busy for the last three months with stale offers being taken up. Both of the flats adjoining the one I'm currently staying in have been sold in this period. One is a lovely flat which would sell at any time but the other is a very ordinary one that had failed to sell in the previous four years and, I must say, I was quite surprised to see it sell when it did.

There are still pockets of very good value for prospective buyers to be had locally but they are assuredly becoming fewer.

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I became somewhat wary of the rate of increase in residential property prices in the later part of 2003 and in 2004. Prices in my district had, after languishing for a decade, begun to rise markedly from around 1999, with a noticeable pick up in the rate of increase in the 2001-2003 period.

There is no doubt that prices had become historically low in the middle part of the 1990s and it appeared clear to me that the correction had overshot by 2004. Price rises were much more muted in 2005 but In the second half of 2006 there was another blip upwards. At that stage I was happy to exit (selling in October 2006) and wait.

My opinion is that the 'crash' has essentially come and gone. From the third quarter of 2007 to the second quarter of 2009 residential prices fell 18.7% (Nationwide quarterly series - see charts), a healthy correction by any standards and greater in real terms given that prices generally were rising throughout the period.

I expect that people who are waiting for material nominal price reductions are likely to be waiting in vain although real residential property prices may well ease somewhat even from here.

Aailable flats and houses in my district are offering better value now than they have at any time since the late 1990s and I think it's very hard to argue a persuasive case for significant declines from here.

the crash will come at light speed the moment the banks run out of cash.

QE is halting the process by letting insolvent banks exist at all....we are going japanese, without a strong economy outside banking.

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Ha ha

I don't have an estate agency branch and am simply reporting my experience. The local estate agents have been conspicuously busy for the last three months with stale offers being taken up. Both of the flats adjoining the one I'm currently staying in have been sold in this period. One is a lovely flat which would sell at any time but the other is a very ordinary one that had failed to sell in the previous four years and, I must say, I was quite surprised to see it sell when it did.

There are still pockets of very good value for prospective buyers to be had locally but they are assuredly becoming fewer.

Can you just indicate where this hive of bullish activity is, please?

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Base rate to 5% or more? A sudden reversal of forebearance? Removal of SMI?

Forgive my ignorance but what is SMI? If by that is meant the housing allowances discussed elsewher today then no, I don't think any of those events would have a material impact here.

A sudden and significant rise in interest rates might serve to limit potential interest although I think that's unlikely to happen.

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When people talk about your ability to decorate an owned home, Swords of Damocles, won't you think of the children, paying you landlords mortgage etc, it boils down to people saying you should buy at all costs. Nevermind that by buying the only thing in life you're getting on with is your promise to transfer your future production to the financial establishment. Back in the days of HPI it made perfect sense as the financial extablishment let you keep some of the profit and there was a willing queue of greater fools to take your liability off your hands.

I'm not the Incredible Hulk, I don't have the cash equivalent of a house in the bank. So for every £10,000 extra I need to borrow so I can buy, I need to earn £30,000. That would take 6+ years to save as cold hard cash out of my disposable income. If I save that over 6 years, it means I have to earn £90,000 less over the following 20 years, the magic of compounding seeing that HPI is no longer compounding. Without rampant HPI, that approach makes sense. So instead of buying and worrying about the cheques I wrote against my soul, I can rent and get on with my life raising my children closer to my own terms even if I can't decorate the nursery like a scene the Ikea catalogue.

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I think it's very hard to argue a persuasive case for significant declines from here.

This is the most uncertain time regarding the financial future of the entire world we have seen for generations. Any damn thing could happen... eurozone is on the precipice, relatively newly elected government here is reducing benefit payments, etc. Id have a go at reading a paper once in a while if I were you.

Anyway, personally Im waiting not because a crash here is just around the corner, but because Im interested to see what happens abroad. It looks like we are on the verge of some shake up in the euro zone which may make a property in the sun a lot more affordable to people in the UK, and with EU member status a move over there would be relatively straight forward.

I wouldn't want to get stuck in some tedious semi in the fog with a ringside seat for the next bout of rioting in the uk when I could be sat in the sun drenched garden of a mortgage free detached farm house sipping wine on the continent. Perhaps thats just me.

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Forgive my ignorance but what is SMI? If by that is meant the housing allowances discussed elsewher today then no, I don't think any of those events would have a material impact here.

Support for Mortgage Interest, paid to over a quarter of a million people behind on their mortgage. It effectively pays the interest on the mortgage (previously also paid off the mortgage capital).

You get it for up to 2yrs if you're not retired. You get it until you die if you're retired. Most of the quarter of a million are in the latter category.

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When people talk about your ability to decorate an owned home, Swords of Damocles, paying you landlords mortgage etc, it boils down to people saying you should buy at all costs

Not at all. Like many things in life, there's a balance to be made, and those are the downsides to be considered when comparing renting with owning. So long as the ups outweigh the downs, no matter what choice you make, you're doing OK.

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To avoid any doubt I did not use the word 'bullish' and I did not say that I thought nominal prices were or would rise.

West Yorkshire

W Yorks and Yorks in general - no experience of those areas. Sales are falling through all over the place in Essex, yet do still get the odd inexplicable fast sale at a price that is no bargain at all. Pretty mysterious stuff, sometimes I wonder what the real deal is

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Support for Mortgage Interest, paid to over a quarter of a million people behind on their mortgage. It effectively pays the interest on the mortgage (previously also paid off the mortgage capital).

You get it for up to 2yrs if you're not retired. You get it until you die if you're retired. Most of the quarter of a million are in the latter category.

Thank you.

I would be very surprised if withdrawal of that subsidy would prove to be a significant factor locally.

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