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VERY quiet on the road today.

looks like even here in Colchester, a vast amount of the morning road space is public sector.

It was quieter than school holidays.

bet the shops will be rammed......busiest shopping day in the year ahead....should help the economy boom for christmas and save us all.

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VERY quiet on the road today.

looks like even here in Colchester, a vast amount of the morning road space is public sector.

It was quieter than school holidays.

bet the shops will be rammed......busiest shopping day in the year ahead....should help the economy boom for christmas and save us all.

My solution

Cut all Public sector salaries above 6 trillion by 2% and watch it trickle down without force due to the philanthropic nature of the workers

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That's simply not true. The TUC has been making that point for years now, but then again you're not likely to hear that as most of the media,would prefer to portray all union figures as illiterate oafs only interested in their own members.

Don't forget that unions like Unite represent over a million private sector workers. Their pensions are generally better as a result, but unfortunately union rhetoric has limited influence over non-unionised companies.

I think you'll find the big unions are like the big charities - only really interested in the money that can be earned by the top management. They will whore themselves anyway to get memebership, regardless of the effect on their existing memebers. More members more fees = more to divvi up at the top.

http://www.hrmguide.co.uk/jobmarket/tuc-poland.htm

Edited by OnlyMe
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I really don't get the talk of a race to the bottom, as its a race to reality and noting to do with private vs public pensions. people shouldn’t say "well I'm private sector and I get nothing so you need to get nothing too" that’s just an answer that people who wont or cant think tend to give.

The choices for public pensions are:

  • Go back to historically how they worked, same contribution but a LOT less public sector workers

  • Keep LOTS of public sector workers and take a big cut to the way the pension work (in reality this would bring them inline with private pensions i.e. self funding)

  • Find a half way house

What very few seem to accept is that they can have lots of people, all living longer, paying in very little and getting out a lot and that this is affordable. Clearly the tax payer (both public and private) will be funding the public sector pensions but the current extent to which this takes place can't go on.

Union bosses don't do themselves any favours when they strike about cutting jobs, strike about cutting pensions, strike about upping the age etc etc

I know public sector workers signed up to a package, but the reality is sh*t happens, everyone has to change and flex and its the public sector workers divine right to get what they have always had that seems to make private sector workers feel like they are out if touch with reality (my wife if a nurse and many of my friends are doctors so this isnt just some rant).

The doctors "get it" they are pumping in as much cash as they can as they know they have had it great to too long and know that even if they don't get out at the end what they were expecting (in their own words the daddy of all pensions) they will still be 10 times better off than if they has set up their own SIPP

Very well put - sums it up!

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I was basing that comment on the 61%.

Still think that characterizing the public sector as stuffed with useless slackers is brainless.

Sure I understand, I am not calling all public sector staff brainless slackers just so you know.

They are everywhere in society including the govt.

My frustration and as Brave New World put it so well yesterday, the uk needs to realign itself with a competitive and not ' just a whats in it for me' attitude and a costly public sector doesn't help this cause.

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My solution

Cut all Public sector salaries above 6 trillion by 2% and watch it trickle down without force due to the philanthropic nature of the workers

make it 3% and we will solve the national debt problem in a trice. assuming ive counted my zeros correctly.

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Roads were fantastic this morning.

I would put them all on defined contribution with the rest of us. Current accruals protected and if they don't like it they can find another job.

This would be the perfect time for the government to make a stand as I have not heard one person back this strike.

The unions are having a laugh if they think they should get more than the last offer. I wouldst have even offered then that much.

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Only 8 people waiting at my stop for the last train to get into Glasgow before 9, whereas normally there would be around 50. It's the last stop where there is normally a chance of getting a seat. Today there were several groups of four unoccupied.

It's not a good sign for our economy but, on a selfish note, it was a much nicer journey.

Shame there is no picket line. I could have told them that there was no longer any race to the bottom with pensions. The private sector won that contest 7 or 8 years ago thanks to Gordenron's attempts to redirect the entire economy into the public sector.

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My frustration and as Brave New World put it so well yesterday, the uk needs to realign itself with a competitive and not ' just a whats in it for me' attitude and a costly public sector doesn't help this cause.

Whenever I hear the word "competitive" used it sounds like someone wants to push people into slave labour so a few can make themselves very rich thank you very much, probably buggering up a lot and causing all sorts of long-term problems. It smacks of the other extreme. I would much prefer it if we could try to aim for comfortable sustainability, which we'd be perfectly capable of right now if we weren't constantly caught up in a battle between the lazy and the greedy.

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Whenever I hear the word "competitive" used it sounds like someone wants to push people into slave labour so a few can make themselves very rich thank you very much, probably buggering up a lot and causing all sorts of long-term problems. It smacks of the other extreme. I would much prefer it if we could try to aim for comfortable sustainability, which we'd be perfectly capable of right now if we weren't constantly caught up in a battle between the lazy and the greedy.

Well said.

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Whenever I hear the word "competitive" used it sounds like someone wants to push people into slave labour so a few can make themselves very rich thank you very much, probably buggering up a lot and causing all sorts of long-term problems. It smacks of the other extreme. I would much prefer it if we could try to aim for comfortable sustainability, which we'd be perfectly capable of right now if we weren't constantly caught up in a battle between the lazy and the greedy.

Good post. Scandinavian countries broadly manage it, don't know why we find it so difficult.

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Well we share a car park with Ofqual, they have a massive picket line of 4 people stood in the car park where none of the general public will see them. Its a bit chilly so I'm sure they'll go home soon :D

lol sooner than I thought as they disbanded the picket line just after 10am

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If the 1% hadn't of stolen capital from labour productivity over decades perhaps everyone would still afford to make retirement AND shelter provision for themselves, comfortably without any private/public subsidy.

Just a thought.

you cant have exponential pension commitments...it will bust as resources are NOT exponential, although money could be, but that is a token of resource, not the resource.

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I'm going to spend Wednesday writing up a consultancy report for which I'll earn around £3k after taxes, .. [on top of public sector wage]

Added to which, I typically only get 3-4 such jobs a year, the proceeds of which are not enough to live on.

Compare and contrast:

RPI and LPI escalation

For a pension income to maintain its value in the future, it needs to rise with inflation. This means that the annuity must be indexed-linked to the Retail Price Index (RPI). Alternatively, the pension annuity could also be escalated by limited price indexation (LPI) which is inflation rises limited to a maximum of 5% growth. ..

In order for the insurance company to be in a position to pay the annuitant, it must purchase index-linked gilts that provide an index-linked income and redemption values in the future. The cost of RPI escalation depends on inflation and therefore could be cheaper or more expensive than a fixed rate annuity, but certainly more expensive than a level annuity.

For example, a £100,000 pension fund after taking the tax free lump sum could, with RPI escalation, use an open market option to purchase a single life annuity for a male aged 60 of £3,366 income a year in 2011. This is compared to a level annuity that would provide a pension income of £5,944 a year in 2011. ..

Fixed rate escalation

A pension annuity is usually paid on a fixed rate basis over the life of the annuitant, either as a level annuity or escalating at a fixed percentage. Although any percentage can be selected for an open market option, the usual rates are 3% or 5% per year.

Money Purchase Pensions

Edited by Sledgehead
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Only 8 people waiting at my stop for the last train to get into Glasgow before 9, whereas normally there would be around 50. It's the last stop where there is normally a chance of getting a seat. Today there were several groups of four unoccupied.

It's not a good sign for our economy but, on a selfish note, it was a much nicer journey.

Shame there is no picket line. I could have told them that there was no longer any race to the bottom with pensions. The private sector won that contest 7 or 8 years ago thanks to Gordenron's attempts to redirect the entire economy into the public sector.

the sign for the economy is that it appears that for 50 people working, 42 of them are supported by the other 8.

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Government should do away with funded pensions altogether.

Save all that money and put it into a better basic state pension.

If you want to save extra put it into a boosted ISA scheme that you can access at any time.

Gets rid of a whole rotten industry and the false promises of employers (state and private) who do not have to carry the can when they can't be met.

That would be the perfect solution if it could be phased in

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Pensions are paid for !!!??????? Which part of ponzi scheme do you not understand. Paying ~4% of you salary 'pays for' a pension that would cost anyone else 40%. Lets hope you are not a maths teacher!!!

I pay for your pension not you, I am supposed to pay ~£100K for your pension, or if not me my children. No one who is numerate could possibly have ever thought this would pay out. It is like me promising you that next door's 3 year old will buy you a Ferrari.

It is mathematically impossible for these pensions to be paid. A default of some kind by the government is a certainty whatever they agree now. The current deal on the table is still an impossibility, and so there will be further cuts in future.

We the private sector are supposed to pay £1.2 trillion into your 'paid for' pensions, and you don't understand that it is theft.......

Actually it is about 15% when employee (7%) and employer contributions are added together

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Actually it is about 15% when employee (7%) and employer contributions are added together

oh well, 7% then for a 40% normal contribution.

your exponential expectation is about to halve every 10 years.

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the sign for the economy is that it appears that for 50 people working, 42 of them are supported by the other 8.

What a cosy , warm feeling europbaron will have in his chest the next time he sees the platform full. A bit like the one you get on Children In Need night after making a donation and then watching the "thanks to you" package.

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you cant have exponential pension commitments...it will bust as resources are NOT exponential, although money could be, but that is a token of resource, not the resource.

I would be genuinely interested to hear from strikers today about where they think the money from their pensions comes from.

As far as I can tell, most people seem to think there is a. a bottomless state money pot which never runs out, perpetually refilled by 'taxing the rich', or b. an account book somewhere with their name on it showing all the money they have 'paid for their stamp' over the years which will somehow be refunded to them in the form of a generous pension.

The idea that pensions, like property, are a pyramid/ponzi scheme subject to demographic laws doesn't seem to occur to many people.

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  • 433 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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