@contradevian Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 This type of stimulant is always going to raise eyebrows but I think people just need to take context into consideration. I don't use them often for obvious reasons (sleep etc) and I may take half a dozen a year when absolutely necessary. Even this gets looked down on my mates who slam their liver on a weekly basis with copious amounts of alcohol. I might be joining them this winter at this rate. Or copious amounts of caffeine in tea and coffee, or so called "energy drinks" for that matter? Also I think Ephedrine is used to treat hay fever and other allergy's. Wandering back onto topic I wonder if "SAD" is merely a dumping ground for a whole range of modern malady's brought by excess drinking, overeating, eating junk/processed food etc though I've no doubt get out more in the fresh air is good for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eight Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Or copious amounts of caffeine in tea and coffee, or so called "energy drinks" for that matter? Also I think Ephedrine is used to treat hay fever and other allergy's. Wandering back onto topic I wonder if "SAD" is merely a dumping ground for a whole range of modern malady's brought by excess drinking, overeating, eating junk/processed food etc though I've no doubt get out more in the fresh air is good for you. I'm more inclined to believe it's an actual medical condition brought on by the fact that the north of England has received no significant sunshine for at least five years now. Maybe you have to live here to realise how bad it has been. In fact you should see the view from my window now. I really could do with the lights on indoors, and yet our house is south facing, with an enormous bay window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWantItNow Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 Or copious amounts of caffeine in tea and coffee, or so called "energy drinks" for that matter? Also I think Ephedrine is used to treat hay fever and other allergy's. Wandering back onto topic I wonder if "SAD" is merely a dumping ground for a whole range of modern malady's brought by excess drinking, overeating, eating junk/processed food etc though I've no doubt get out more in the fresh air is good for you. This is the kicker for me, I also suffer badly from hay fever from mid June to early August so even if we did by some miracle actually have a summer in the North, I wouldn't be able to enjoy it anyway! My only hope is to move to the coast and then you have problems like the lack of jobs and the fact that property prices in any decent coastal area with jobs will be sky high thanks to BTL'ers and the like. Didn't know Ephedrine helped it. I'll test next summer. I'm more inclined to believe it's an actual medical condition brought on by the fact that the north of England has received no significant sunshine for at least five years now. Maybe you have to live here to realise how bad it has been. In fact you should see the view from my window now. I really could do with the lights on indoors, and yet our house is south facing, with an enormous bay window. This is my thinking too and a quick Google searched kicked up this study, I specifically searched Alaska as an extreme example of daylight fluctuation throughout the year. OBJECTIVE: The goals of this study are to provide estimates of the prevalence of seasonal affective disorder in Alaska, to examine sociodemographic correlates, and to evaluate the relation between seasonal affective disorder and general depression. METHOD: A random sample of 283 residents of Fairbanks who had lived in Alaska for 3 years or more were interviewed with the Seasonal Pattern Assessment Questionnaire and the Center for Epidemiologic Studies Depression Scale (CES-D Scale). RESULTS: Twenty-six (9.2%) of the subjects met diagnostic criteria for seasonal affective disorder, one of the highest figures yet reported. These cyclic winter affective disorders occurred more often in women than men (ratio = 3:2) and were less prevalent among residents who were older than 40 years of age. Assessment of depression with the CES-D Scale supported the diagnostic classification of respondents and the differentiation of seasonal affective disorder from other depression. CONCLUSIONS: This study supports the conclusions that seasonal affective disorder is prevalent in northern populations and that sex and age may represent the major risk factors that differentiate it from the general experience of depression in northern communities. Looking at this almost 1 in 10 of us are suffers which seems high, I didn't expect that. Also looks like when I reach 40 I'll be that miserable about other things that I won't be affected as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bossybabe Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Had you thought of hibernating? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWantItNow Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 Had you thought of hibernating? Even more than I already do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eight Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Had you thought of hibernating? In a manner of speaking you have to. For instance there's no point attempting anything like decorating or household maintenance, or even some indoor hobbies, during the winter (and by winter I mean from about two weeks ago till about April) - there just isn't enough light. You basically go into a six month work/eat/TV/sleep lockdown, unless you can get out of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@contradevian Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I'm more inclined to believe it's an actual medical condition brought on by the fact that the north of England has received no significant sunshine for at least five years now. Maybe you have to live here to realise how bad it has been. In fact you should see the view from my window now. I really could do with the lights on indoors, and yet our house is south facing, with an enormous bay window. I do live in the North of England, Huddersfield, West Yorkshire in fact. I know exactly what its like. I got a tan this year. You can get a tan even on overcast days. However being "self employed" does give me greater freedom to get out for a walk or on the bike when I want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austin Allegro Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I do live in the North of England, Huddersfield, West Yorkshire in fact. I know exactly what its like. I got a tan this year. You can get a tan even on overcast days. However being "self employed" does give me greater freedom to get out for a walk or on the bike when I want to. I've found that just making the most of natural daylight helps - get out as much as you can. St John's Wort and Omega 3 fish tablets seem to lift the mood too. Also, a week or two in the Balearics in January is just beautiful - about 60f, blue skies, sunny, dirt cheap flights and hotels, and NO chavs. I even went swimming in the mediterranean one January, though it was bloody cold. As someone else said it really 'breaks the back' of winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I do live in the North of England, Huddersfield, West Yorkshire in fact. I know exactly what its like. I got a tan this year. You can get a tan even on overcast days. However being "self employed" does give me greater freedom to get out for a walk or on the bike when I want to. I got a tan too in Oldham but that was months ago and it's fading. August was crap weather for allotmenting. Sept about the same and so far October is a washout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I got a tan too in Oldham but that was months ago and it's fading. August was crap weather for allotmenting. Sept about the same and so far October is a washout. Only a week and a half or so ago from some absolutely wonderful weather. I find it hard to believe that it was great in Stockport but cloudy in Oldham. So I got out on the bike the day it turning cloudy again and got rained on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Only a week and a half or so ago from some absolutely wonderful weather. I find it hard to believe that it was great in Stockport but cloudy in Oldham. So I got out on the bike the day it turning cloudy again and got rained on # Oh aye ok the 1st Oct was spectacular. Was at wedding on the wirral and it could have been June! (But sadly was on the wirral and not on allotment) Was ok for a day or two around then - I have been on and done some weeding but I suspect it's ducks only at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWantItNow Posted October 12, 2011 Author Share Posted October 12, 2011 Only a week and a half or so ago from some absolutely wonderful weather. I find it hard to believe that it was great in Stockport but cloudy in Oldham. So I got out on the bike the day it turning cloudy again and got rained on It was great weather no doubt, but that's two days plus a couple in April and that's been it, summer over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cartimandua51 Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I support light boxes- when I was working I blagged one out of my boss, and sitting under one for two or three hours a day while working at a computer I was fine. Now I've retired and have nowhere convenient to put one I notice the difference, even though I can get outside more. Memo to self - get one that doen't take up so much space, BEFORE the clocks go back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eight Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I support light boxes- when I was working I blagged one out of my boss, and sitting under one for two or three hours a day while working at a computer I was fine. Now I've retired and have nowhere convenient to put one I notice the difference, even though I can get outside more. Memo to self - get one that doen't take up so much space, BEFORE the clocks go back! The clocks haven't gone back yet? Jesus, why is it so effing dark? Just took the advice and walked to Lidl and back, about three miles round. Wore the dog out anyway. It's not going to get light at all today by the looks of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@contradevian Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I support light boxes- when I was working I blagged one out of my boss, and sitting under one for two or three hours a day while working at a computer I was fine. Now I've retired and have nowhere convenient to put one I notice the difference, even though I can get outside more. Memo to self - get one that doen't take up so much space, BEFORE the clocks go back! Why an expensive light box? Why not just get the natural light bulbs on extension leads, or deck out the house with them? Admittedly a lightbox lots better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 I'm a member of a mine exploration group, and one time we were digging through a collapse in a mine in the Lakes to see what was on the other side*. This carried on for a long time (a couple of years of more IIRC, but only turning up once a month to do a bit of work). In the middle of winter it was a bit depressing to spend most of the day underground (didn't start early enough for it to be dark and came out for lunch), to emerge as it started to get dark, and usually in lousy weather. Funnily enough the mile or so back to the car helped a little - still outside, even if there wasn't much to look at. * not much as it turned out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swissy_fit Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Why an expensive light box? Why not just get the natural light bulbs on extension leads, or deck out the house with them? Admittedly a lightbox lots better. To mimic the effect of being outside in pale spring sunshine you need 10,000 Lux (a measure of brightness) for a minimum of 20 minutes. Even with the lightboxes, they can only generate this up to a range of about 25cm for the weaker ones and 50cm for the big ones. So unless you want to climb inside the lightbox to have the desired effect, get the biggest most powerful one available. All the small ones are more or less useless in practice, they are placebos, like your natural daylight bulbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@contradevian Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 To mimic the effect of being outside in pale spring sunshine you need 10,000 Lux (a measure of brightness) for a minimum of 20 minutes. Even with the lightboxes, they can only generate this up to a range of about 25cm for the weaker ones and 50cm for the big ones. So unless you want to climb inside the lightbox to have the desired effect, get the biggest most powerful one available. All the small ones are more or less useless in practice, they are placebos, like your natural daylight bulbs. Average Lux on a typical overcast day at midday is 10,000 to 25,000 Lux. The luminance recommendation for "general offices" is just 500 Lux. Puts artificial lighting "in the shade"me thinks! Go stand outside for 20-30 minutes or so and/or go on a regular course of sunbed treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swissy_fit Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 Average Lux on a typical overcast day at midday is 10,000 to 25,000 Lux. The luminance recommendation for "general offices" is just 500 Lux. Puts artificial lighting "in the shade"me thinks! Go stand outside for 20-30 minutes or so and/or go on a regular course of sunbed treatment. Sure, being outside is best. The lightboxes are for folks who can't or won't, for whatever reason, and I must say I like reading/sleeping in front of mine whether I need it or not(I run or do other outdoor sport most lunchtimes). Unfortunately pesky wife doesn't like it. My point was that light therapy can only be achieved at 10k lux and above afaik, so daylight bulbs and low-powered lightboxes are just placebos. Sunbeds, hmm, they're probably alright but I'll stick with the Vitamin D3 droplets and snowboarding-when-possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger Woods? Posted October 12, 2011 Share Posted October 12, 2011 It does exist. Exercise and natural light do help. +1 I used to get it very bad in my 20s. Mid-Autumn and again late winter were just awful. Now I'm depreseed all the time, so hardly notice it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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