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Defence Job Cuts Could Hit 33,000, Warns Trade Body Ads

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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/industry/defence/8790686/Defence-job-cuts-could-hit-33000-warns-trade-body-ADS.html

BAE, Britain's biggest manufacturer, is expected to confirm on Tuesday morning that it is cutting up to 3,000 jobs, with 2,300 of these focused on its aerospace division in Warton and Samlesbury in Lancashire, and Brough in Yorkshire.

The plants are involved in making the Eurofighter Typhoon, with final assembly at Warton. However, BAE is planning to slow down production of the fighter jet as orders from European partner nations slow and are yet to be replaced with export orders.

Trade union Unite said the job losses will be a "hammer blow to the UK defence industry", while the GMB said it was a "disgrace" that news of the cuts had leaked before they had been confirmed to workers.

.......

Ian Godden, chairman of ADS, said: "There is real concern in the industry that recent news of potential job losses are only the tip of the iceberg. Defence spending 20 years ago was around 10pc of Government spending and 4.5pc GDP, while today it is 5pc of Government spending and around 2.3pc of GDP."

And 20 years ago the phoney economic war with the big bad USSR had finally drawn to a close.

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Unfortunately the world is hostile place and if you can’t look after yourself you’ll be taken advantage of; take the Palestinians for example…

Good. I don't know how these people sleep at night.

Great example of brainwashing language - 'Defence' - hmmm, shouldn't that be 'War' ...

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When our armed forces have been whittled away to practically nothing and all the skilled engineering trades have evaporated away (our ability to manufacture to wage war) then it will be easy for any such inclined state to walk in whenever they want.

The last 70 odd years are a departure from the norm of the previous few hundred when the Country was pretty much at war with someone through out that time usually one of our Euro partners....

If you subscribe to the theory that House Price inflation in the last decade or two is 'beyond the norm' then it would be sensible to take the same view about the peace which has endured since 1945 give or take a few short limited conflicts....

When the Eurozone falls and again most here would subscribe to that view that it will then individual states will look to instigate protectionist measures, these create the slippery path to war....

The fact Germany would never be allowed to develop Nuclear Weapons is testimony even to this day demonstrating the concern there is at the most highest levels that the return to times like the 1930's could be swift and unstoppable.

edit typo

Edited by geezer466

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Good. I don't know how these people sleep at night.

Great example of brainwashing language - 'Defence' - hmmm, shouldn't that be 'War' ...

That doesn't change the fact the the aerospace and defence industry in the UK is one of the last strongholds of design and engineering skills and a big supporter of small and medium sized manufacturing firms throughout the country.

Perhaps you'd rather that everyone worked in call centres for banks and mail order companies?

Countries will always buy weapons - it's so much part of the human condition that you might as well moan about people having toes. For the most part, platforms like Typhoon (which the Saudis, for example, have bought in large numbers) are used as objects of national prestige as much as they are for defence purposes. Yes, that's wasteful - but so is all consumption. We don't need PS3s to exactly the same extent that nations don't need weapons!

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I heard on R4 this morning that our beloved Govt. is somehow going to step in and save this skill base, which means we'll almost certainly lose more of the skill base than if they'd simply stayed the hell away.

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This is a typical example of how the private sector has to take losses while the Public sector staff moan and strike about reduced pension pots/wage freezes etc

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Good. I don't know how these people sleep at night.

Great example of brainwashing language - 'Defence' - hmmm, shouldn't that be 'War' ...

They sleep at night due to not knowing their handy work is used to attack countries who do not have a private central bank.

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Perhaps you'd rather that everyone worked in call centres for banks and mail order companies?

What a pathetic straw man statement. False dichotomy as well.

So everyone who doesn't work in the defence industry will have to work in call centres for banks and mail order companies?

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British Aerospace before BAESYSTEMS used to manufacture civil aircraft like ATP, 146 etc but due to lack of investment in previous decades in jigs, fixtures etc resulting in crap interchangability of parts resulting in poor reputation from customers they cancelled civil aircraft programmes and turned to more profitable defence projects.

At least the handy work of people who decided to switch from civil to defence projects helped in this scenario.

Is private ownership of a country's Central Bank a good thing?

Throughout history, there has been a concerted effort by 'Money Lenders' to control peoples and nations through currency. This is documented going back to pre-biblical times. Any efforts to instill systems of currency fair to a population seem to be quashed... by war, assassination, politics, etc.

Something is really bothering me about all this, am I alone in that feeling? Most recent history now shows that back in 2001 there were only only 7 nations left who did not have a privately owned Central Bank. After the invasion of Afghanistan in 2001 there were six nations without a privately owned central bank. After the invasion of Iraq in 2003 there were five nations without a privately owned central bank. The five remaining nations at that time were: Iran; North Korea; Sudan; Cuba; and Libya. In August 2009, the Lockerbie bomber was released at the behest of the British Government. There were many allegations that it had alot to do with trade deals, specifically oil.

Interestingly enough, Libya opens its country to foreign banks to do business in February 2010. Something strange here? This now leaves only Iran, North Korea, Sudan and Cuba... Ironically all identified by worldwide media as some kind of 'axis of evil'. The central bank owners also control the majority of worldwide media. So, I need to know... Is private ownership of a country's Central Bank a good thing? Should the people of the world's nations be demanding investigation into this matter and Establishment of truly government owned (not private) Central banks, and control of their own currencies (sovereignty, self-determination, freedom and future)?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20101226041514AAXWNF7

Edited by fiddlethefigures

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That doesn't change the fact the the aerospace and defence industry in the UK is one of the last strongholds of design and engineering skills and a big supporter of small and medium sized manufacturing firms throughout the country.

Perhaps you'd rather that everyone worked in call centres for banks and mail order companies?

Countries will always buy weapons - it's so much part of the human condition that you might as well moan about people having toes. For the most part, platforms like Typhoon (which the Saudis, for example, have bought in large numbers) are used as objects of national prestige as much as they are for defence purposes. Yes, that's wasteful - but so is all consumption. We don't need PS3s to exactly the same extent that nations don't need weapons!

Weren't British Leyland a government backed manufacturer ? :lol:

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What a pathetic straw man statement. False dichotomy as well.

So everyone who doesn't work in the defence industry will have to work in call centres for banks and mail order companies?

Okay, so it's a bit of a generalisation, but it isn't as false dichotomy. I run a software company and have several clients in the aerospace industry. I personally know many people who have lost jobs in that sector and found themselves struggling to get jobs other than low-grade service sector positions of the type typified by call centres and the like.

The view from your high horse is a little cloudy I fear.

Edited by andybee33

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I know many people that used to work in skilled positions at a local aero engine manufacturer; since it closed down over twelve ago many of them have been working in lower paid service sector jobs.

Okay, so it's a bit of a generalisation, but it isn't as false dichotomy. I run a software company and have several clients in the aerospace industry. I personally know many people who have lost jobs in that sector and found themselves struggling to get jobs other than low-grade service sector positions of the type typified by call centres and the like.

The view from your high horse is a little cloudy I fear.

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I know many people that used to work in skilled positions at a local aero engine manufacturer; since it closed down over twelve ago many of them have been working in lower paid service sector jobs.

Thanks for sharing your experience. It's a worrying trend. I don't believe you can build an economy on powerpoint and 'have a nice day' - but that's just me.

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I run a software company and have several clients in the aerospace industry. I personally know many people who have lost jobs in that sector and found themselves struggling to get jobs other than low-grade service sector positions of the type typified by call centres and the like.

If they've been kept in a job on the back of the taxpayer then I have no sympathy, they should be grateful to us for providing them with work for so many years.

You shouldn't expect the taxpayer to pay for something that's not needed just to keep people in a job they feel they deserve.

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If they've been kept in a job on the back of the taxpayer then I have no sympathy, they should be grateful to us for providing them with work for so many years.

You shouldn't expect the taxpayer to pay for something that's not needed just to keep people in a job they feel they deserve.

I totally understand your point and, as a small businessman (my business is small, I'm of average build!) I'd tend to agree. BUT this overlooks the fact that literally 10s of billions of pounds flood into the UK from defence export programmes. 72 Typhoons at £65million quid each - plus the same again in support and spares - that's just one contract!

Yes ALL defence spending is by governments, but much of the revenue of BAE Systems and its ilk comes from cash rich overseas nations (especially in the Middle East). Believe me, without it our balance of trades deficit would look a heck of lot worse!

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I suspect the real plan is to export our 'financial services' sector as a fifth column and destroy our enemies from the inside.

Anyone messes with us and we deploy those weapons of mass financial destruction. "In debt we trust"

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  • 335 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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