Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum
mfs1959

Soak The Rich Foreigners

Recommended Posts

Just read an interesting article in 'The Spectator'.

Apparently, in 2008, when the last government introduced a tax on high-earning foreigners of £30k it was paid by 5,400 foreign nationals, thus raising £162m.

Unfortunately 16,000 such nationals left the country rather than pay. The Exchequer lost out on the £800m tax that they would have paid.

Score another plus to Gordon and Alistair for a tax policy designed for its electoral appeal rather than to raise any cash.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just read an interesting article in 'The Spectator'.

Apparently, in 2008, when the last government introduced a tax on high-earning foreigners of £30k it was paid by 5,400 foreign nationals, thus raising £162m.

Unfortunately 16,000 such nationals left the country rather than pay. The Exchequer lost out on the £800m tax that they would have paid.

Score another plus to Gordon and Alistair for a tax policy designed for its electoral appeal rather than to raise any cash.

That makes no sense.

The deal is you pay a fixed 30K or declare your earnings and pay the correct amount. The idea that those that left would have already been paying a "correct" amount of 50K is complete nonsense.

It also assumes that those that left took their jobs with them. This isn't the normal case, if a foreigner leaves a UK based post another person gets the job that they have left behind.

ISTM that 16,000 foreigners leaving the UK is just normal foreigner worker turnover.

tim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just read an interesting article in 'The Spectator'.

Apparently, in 2008, when the last government introduced a tax on high-earning foreigners of £30k it was paid by 5,400 foreign nationals, thus raising £162m.

Unfortunately 16,000 such nationals left the country rather than pay. The Exchequer lost out on the £800m tax that they would have paid.

Score another plus to Gordon and Alistair for a tax policy designed for its electoral appeal rather than to raise any cash.

You live here , work here or invest here you pay tax simple as . Well thats the way it should be but for some reason many global rich get away with paying nothing. WHY ?

With the pound low against many world curriences buying property in England especially London has become a new investment of people accross the globe . It is not just in prime central London but all accross London in the less affleuent areas as well. It is being bought with foreign cash and rented back to the British who have been priced out of buying .

What kind of govenment lets their own people be abused in this way letting outsiders take advantage of the plight of British people . Then to add insult to to the situation they can even get around paying stamp duty. Many countries have put high taxes on situations like this but not us we carry on taking the tax from our little people and let others get away with paying none or very little.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You live here , work here or invest here you pay tax simple as .

Saying this doesn't make it true. I paid about 9% tax on my income last year, completely legally, and I'm not even a millionaire nondom. Those guys can move where they please, and the taxman would be wise to court them, not attack them, for the reasons in the OP.

Tax them and they leave, and nobody gains. Not 'fair', but thats life, rightly so (economically)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Saying this doesn't make it true. I paid about 9% tax on my income last year, completely legally, and I'm not even a millionaire nondom. Those guys can move where they please, and the taxman would be wise to court them, not attack them, for the reasons in the OP.

Tax them and they leave, and nobody gains. Not 'fair', but thats life, rightly so (economically)

I did not say it was true I said that is the way it should be. Read the post .

Yes they can move where they please and in most places they want to be they will pay more tax than they do here. Read post 2.

Economically if they are not paying someone else is like the low paid Brit who saw his NI and Vat go up last year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Saying this doesn't make it true. I paid about 9% tax on my income last year, completely legally, and I'm not even a millionaire nondom. Those guys can move where they please, and the taxman would be wise to court them, not attack them, for the reasons in the OP.

Tax them and they leave, and nobody gains. Not 'fair', but thats life, rightly so (economically)

Like bo**cks should they. You don't solve tax evasion problems by appeasement. The appeasement policy is how the evaders have managed to gradually whittle away the taxes they pay. They have little/no fear of the repercussions.

Institute an underlying principles based tax system. If it looks like tax avoidance and smells like tax avoidance then it is tax avoidance. If the avoidance is done outside of the 'normal' tax credit / deductions system, which HMRC can publish, then the tax man has the 100% right to claim back the avoided tax + interest + investigation costs + penalties. Institute a 20% transaction tax on transfers of funds to and from known tax havens. Then watch the rats scurry.

Edited by alexw

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like bo**cks should they. You don't solve tax evasion problems by appeasement. The appeasement policy is how the evaders have managed to gradually whittle away the taxes they pay. They have little/no fear of the repercussions.

Institute an underlying principles based tax system. If it looks like tax avoidance and smells like tax avoidance then it is tax avoidance. If the avoidance is done outside of the 'normal' tax credit / deductions system, which HMRC can publish, then the tax man has the 100% right to claim back the avoided tax + interest + investigation costs + penalties. Institute a 20% transaction tax on transfers of funds to and from known tax havens. Then watch the rats scurry.

Scurry abroad, taking their taxable wealth/income with them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You make no sense

In post #4 you said that much of the wealth/income ISN'T taxed

Flip...flop

Makes perfect sense. I'm saying that getting a little tax off them is better than zero when they leave. Nice strawman though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Makes perfect sense. I'm saying that getting a little tax off them is better than zero when they leave. Nice strawman though.

Seems to me they get a huge free ride off the benefit of the UK's rule of law and quality of life (which they don't get back home) and they should pay up for it

Stop believing everything you read in the DT maybe (its owned by a couple of tax dodging billionaires)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Scurry abroad, taking their taxable wealth/income with them.

How? how exactly do you take topshop, or vodaphone, or google, or amazon, or etc, or etc, abroad?

As for the general citizenry let them leave there are plenty more who will fill their jobs.

Numerous other countries have principles based taxation, and seem to have no trouble finding replacements for the few who do actually leave.

And if you mean the few non-dom parasites who set up shop in london, having them leave would be great for the london economy. Cheaper property prices for all. Cheaper everything for all, no more bidding up the price of goods and services.

And the argument that they will all suddenly leave is a myth. The numbers that actually leave are tiny. I'm still waiting for them to leave after the 50% tax rate was put in place. Do i have to wait much longer?

Also it does seem that the principles based taxation system will be put in place within the next year or two. So as for yourself come on hurry up and leave, threats aren't any use unless you back them up.

Edited by alexw

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The tax itself may have been introduced for political reason to make New Labour look good in the run up to the elections, but the reasons for keeping it need to be looked at in some depth. As expected the media, in particular Sky News reduced this matter to a simple yes/no, rich versus poor debate.

For sure, the 50% tax rate on high earners is a disincentive to remain in the UK and for that reason, in part, I understand the reason for abolishing it. Perhaps the reason some wish to keep it is to punish people they tacitly suspect of avoiding or even evading tax. That's not a reason for keeping the 50% rate. Tax evasion is dealt with by enforcement of existing laws and not by raising the tax rate.

However, on the flipside, the highly paid do not have a monopoly on being incentivised by a lower tax burden. Everyone is incentivised by lower taxes. When I see wealthy vested interests and their smug Amercian economist shills on television, insulting our intelligence with their weasle words I am reminded that while some beneficiaries of this policy do pay their taxes honestly, many others employ accountants to use smoke and mirrors and avoid and evade their responsibilities.

Take away the top rate for sure, but tighten up the loopholes, enforce the law and consider other, fairer means of raising revenue such as Land Value Tax.

Edited by nmarks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That makes no sense.

The deal is you pay a fixed 30K or declare your earnings and pay the correct amount. The idea that those that left would have already been paying a "correct" amount of 50K is complete nonsense.

It also assumes that those that left took their jobs with them. This isn't the normal case, if a foreigner leaves a UK based post another person gets the job that they have left behind.

ISTM that 16,000 foreigners leaving the UK is just normal foreigner worker turnover.

tim

It's not quite that simple. Non-doms are people who live in the UK temporarily, having been born and lived abroad.

The UK has a loop-hole whereby non-doms are allowed to earn money in their home country (taxed by their home country) and keep it overseas, without declaring it to HMRC. Obviously, any money earned in the UK, or any money brought in from their home country must be declared and taxed, like a UK citizen. The labour government changed the law to require a payment of £30k per year per person, to stay in the UK.

If the person was living in the UK, and earning money in the UK, then that income would be fully taxed as for a UK citizen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The tax itself may have been introduced for political reason to make New Labour look good in the run up to the elections, but the reasons for keeping it need to be looked at in some depth. As expected the media, in particular Sky News reduced this matter to a simple yes/no, rich versus poor debate.

For sure, the 50% tax rate on high earners is a disincentive to remain in the UK and for that reason, in part, I understand the reason for abolishing it. Perhaps the reason some wish to keep it is to punish people they tacitly suspect of avoiding or even evading tax. That's not a reason for keeping the 50% rate. Tax evasion is dealt with by enforcement of existing laws and not by raising the tax rate.

However, on the flipside, the highly paid do not have a monopoly on being incentivised by a lower tax burden. Everyone is incentivised by lower taxes. When I see wealthy vested interests and their smug Amercian economist shills on television, insulting our intelligence with their weasle words I am reminded that while some beneficiaries of this policy do pay their taxes honestly, many others employ accountants to use smoke and mirrors and avoid and evade their responsibilities.

Take away the top rate for sure, but tighten up the loopholes, enforce the law and consider other, fairer means of raising revenue such as Land Value Tax.

My own opinion on this is to reform tax to make it much much harder to avoid while adjusting downwards all brackets. For example <15K 0%, 15-38K 20%, 38-100k 30%, 100K+ 40%. Also at the same time introduce policy measures to gradually but drastically reduce the wealth and income gap. You don't need high redistribution and the concomitant high taxes in a much less unequal society.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's not quite that simple. Non-doms are people who live in the UK temporarily, having been born and lived abroad.

:)

The usual authoritative post but wrong.

Having grand parents born abroad and some form of symbolic foreign roots to go with that is sufficient to become a non-dom.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • 332 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.