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Just looking for some good advice and life experience comments from you good lot. :) I’m becoming increasingly exposed to the economic downturn in a way I never expected; my job has become really stressful with a huge hike in workload, as leaving staff are not replaced and company funds dry up everywhere. As an example, I’ve had to ruin this bank holiday weekend with achieving deadlines :(

In short, I’m experiencing the disappearance of the fun and challenging aspects of my job that used to make worklife enjoyable as there is a focus on core employer activities that are dull and, career-wise, pretty deadend. I guess the company is trying to survive the turmoil of the economy by focusing on core activities. This is making the high flying or ambitious staff leave as and when they can.

Here’s my dilemma. Do I see the writing on the wall and leave for an exciting but risky opportunity that has arisen, initially with a one year contract elsewhere – pay £30k. Or do I stay in my secure job that earns £45k and sit this one out, despite the work problems. Advise and anecdotal experience greatly sought.

Circumstances : Mid- to-late 30’s with a secure job, North West. Savings of around £90k, renting, no kids, partner settled in the NW. Likely to emigrate in a few years (so looking to keep my skillset up-to-date). New job in start up company.

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Just looking for some good advice and life experience comments from you good lot. :) I'm becoming increasingly exposed to the economic downturn in a way I never expected; my job has become really stressful with a huge hike in workload, as leaving staff are not replaced and company funds dry up everywhere. As an example, I've had to ruin this bank holiday weekend with achieving deadlines :(

In short, I'm experiencing the disappearance of the fun and challenging aspects of my job that used to make worklife enjoyable as there is a focus on core employer activities that are dull and, career-wise, pretty deadend. I guess the company is trying to survive the turmoil of the economy by focusing on core activities. This is making the high flying or ambitious staff leave as and when they can.

Here's my dilemma. Do I see the writing on the wall and leave for an exciting but risky opportunity that has arisen, initially with a one year contract elsewhere – pay £30k. Or do I stay in my secure job that earns £45k and sit this one out, despite the work problems. Advise and anecdotal experience greatly sought.

Circumstances : Mid- to-late 30's with a secure job, North West. Savings of around £90k, renting, no kids, partner settled in the NW. Likely to emigrate in a few years (so looking to keep my skillset up-to-date). New job in start up company.

Do you have any debt ? If no - then I would think the answer is a no brainer. If you are planning on leaving in a few years anyway then why not.

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Do you have any debt ? If no - then I would think the answer is a no brainer. If you are planning on leaving in a few years anyway then why not.

Thanks ccc. To clarify - no debt.

But the emigration fund will not be topped up much every month, and its a very secure job to sit the recession out in. Do I risk or play safe? Other comments welcomed.

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“And after your death, when most of you for the first time realize what life here is all about, you will begin to see that your life here is almost nothing but the sum total of every choice you have made during every moment of your life. Your thoughts, which you are responsible for, are as real as your deeds. You will begin to realize that every word and every deed affects your life and has also touched thousands of lives.”

“We run after values that, at death, become zero. At the end of your life, nobody asks you how many degrees you have, or how many mansions you built, or how many Rolls Royces you could afford. That’s what dying patients teach you.” Elisabeth Kubler-Ross

“When I was 17, I read a quote that went something like: “If you live each day as if it was your last, someday you’ll most certainly be right.” It made an impression on me, and since then, for the past 33 years, I have looked in the mirror every morning and asked myself: “If today were the last day of my life, would I want to do what I am about to do today?” And whenever the answer has been “No” for too many days in a row, I know I need to change something.

“Remembering that I’ll be dead soon is the most important tool I’ve ever encountered to help me make the big choices in life. Because almost everything — all external expectations, all pride, all fear of embarrassment or failure — these things just fall away in the face of death, leaving only what is truly important. Remembering that you are going to die is the best way I know to avoid the trap of thinking you have something to lose. You are already naked. There is no reason not to follow your heart.” Steve Jobs

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Thanks ccc. To clarify - no debt.

But the emigration fund will not be topped up much every month, and its a very secure job to sit the recession out in. Do I risk or play safe? Other comments welcomed.

Emigrate now while the £90k is still worth something abroad.

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As some of you lot know I have been ill the last few years.

I have gone from earning a very fortunate and generous amount of money to opting to stay at home, get well and live off my savings. I have been very fortunate to have savings to live off.

I will share with you some things.

Most of the people who are in my life now were not in my working life. In fact, only 2 people truly still remain friends from that time.

I think I have become a better, broader and more emotionally intelligent person in the last few years. At time it was like going through hell and I did not think I would make it out the other side. But hey, here I am.

I was in the pub about 2 months back where my friends told me that they think I am a much better, more emphatic and grounded person. Not that I was not caring before, but I was certainly wrapped up, for a variety of legacy reasons, in ego, in career and in trying to prove myself to a whole bunch of people who, now, I realise just were not worth my time.

If I had been earning my previous salary for the past 5 years I would now be retired or well on the way to it... or burdened with a huge expensive house. But I would not be the chilled out, happy person I am now.

Which is the better?

;)

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I would be sorely tempted to sit it out, and keep the skills and enjoyment up through courses. I would never had said this before I found such great difficulty in getting a new job, and the fair amount of chancer kite flying employers out there.

A colleague has just handed in his resignation with nothing to go to 'because he's never had a problem getting a job before'. The deed was done so I bit my tongue.

I had an interview the other week, but I have become far more thorough in my questioning and what appeared to be a great job at a great brand, had an enormous amount of legacy issues and frustrations to fix over two years, meaning little for creativity or advancement.

Are you very sure about the new company? On what evidence?

Edited by Tonkers

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With savings of £90k I'm guessing you could survive for at least 5 years comfortably with no loss of standard of living even without any work at all. That gives you a lot of flexibility, and in my view makes the decision not overly financial (that is to say you shouldn't let the financial side of it decide for you).

You say you hate your job. You say the new opportunity is risky but exciting. If it is as clear cut as that, hate vs excitement, then make the move. Besides, if you stick at the boring deadend job then in a year you'll be a year older, have spent 12 months being bored/stressed, and have... £100k in savings? Is it worth it...?

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I had an interview the other week, but I have become far more thorough in my questioning and what appeared to be a great job at a great brand, had an enormous amount of legacy issues and frustrations to fix over two years, meaning little for creativity or advancement.

Are you very sure about the new company? On what evidence?

I had a telephone interview a couple of weeks back with some big IT consultancy that were setting up a new division.

I got all this new opportunities, rise to the top, be a mover and shakers, challenging, demanding, stressful, bull, bull, bull.

I tried to interrupt them but they were on a role so I sat back and listened to his heart-attack inducing job.

Eventually they asked me whether I was interested so, basically, I told them what I thought. I told them it sounded a cr*p job and only an idiot or a really sad person would take it. I asked them if this is how they wished to spend their life.

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As some of you lot know I have been ill the last few years.

I have gone from earning a very fortunate and generous amount of money to opting to stay at home, get well and live off my savings. I have been very fortunate to have savings to live off.

I will share with you some things.

Most of the people who are in my life now were not in my working life. In fact, only 2 people truly still remain friends from that time.

I think I have become a better, broader and more emotionally intelligent person in the last few years. At time it was like going through hell and I did not think I would make it out the other side. But hey, here I am.

I was in the pub about 2 months back where my friends told me that they think I am a much better, more emphatic and grounded person. Not that I was not caring before, but I was certainly wrapped up, for a variety of legacy reasons, in ego, in career and in trying to prove myself to a whole bunch of people who, now, I realise just were not worth my time.

If I had been earning my previous salary for the past 5 years I would now be retired or well on the way to it... or burdened with a huge expensive house. But I would not be the chilled out, happy person I am now.

Which is the better?

;)

Obviously staying on in the same job would have better. Even your mates are politely telling you that you have lost your edge.

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I'd stick it out. There is never a guarantee the grass is greener, I'd only suggest moving if you were going to get at least another £8k on what you get now.

In one sense your current employer may be vulnerable, if they are low on staff, it could be you leaving could tip them over the edge - would you consider yourself invaluable to the operation?

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Life can be strange and you never know what's around the corner.

In the 70s I accepted a permanent staff position, on about half the money, at the company where I was working on a self employed basis, because of the looming recession. Sure enough, the recession hit, but they made the lower paid permanent staff redundant and kept the subbies on :(.

I found another job that I hated so much that it spurred me on to start looking in earnest and as a result found a well paid job that I not only loved, but led me into my own business.

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Just looking for some good advice and life experience comments from you good lot. :) I’m becoming increasingly exposed to the economic downturn in a way I never expected; my job has become really stressful with a huge hike in workload, as leaving staff are not replaced and company funds dry up everywhere. As an example, I’ve had to ruin this bank holiday weekend with achieving deadlines :(

In short, I’m experiencing the disappearance of the fun and challenging aspects of my job that used to make worklife enjoyable as there is a focus on core employer activities that are dull and, career-wise, pretty deadend. I guess the company is trying to survive the turmoil of the economy by focusing on core activities. This is making the high flying or ambitious staff leave as and when they can.

Here’s my dilemma. Do I see the writing on the wall and leave for an exciting but risky opportunity that has arisen, initially with a one year contract elsewhere – pay £30k. Or do I stay in my secure job that earns £45k and sit this one out, despite the work problems. Advise and anecdotal experience greatly sought.

Circumstances : Mid- to-late 30’s with a secure job, North West. Savings of around £90k, renting, no kids, partner settled in the NW. Likely to emigrate in a few years (so looking to keep my skillset up-to-date). New job in start up company.

Of course, the bottom line is that only you can decide since it is a value judgement on your own life and its style. So I will try not to point in either direction. There are a few points that spring to mind and one is what Tonkers asked 'Are you very sure about the new company? On what evidence?'. In fact I think Tonker's post should be considered well. The second point is that the stress level has risen, but a person can be surprisingly adaptable and you could become more efficient by virtue of the pressure. In time, you might then find yourself coping with the new pressure but without the stress. Another point is do you like the company and management where you work? Would you expect to like the other company's management? And again, on what evidence? If you are likely to leave in a few years I personally would try to stick it out in the present company.

A start-up company? Do you think it will survive?

Again, only you know how much you dislike the present job and what would suit you.

Good luck whichever you choose.

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Just looking for some good advice and life experience comments from you good lot. :) I’m becoming increasingly exposed to the economic downturn in a way I never expected; my job has become really stressful with a huge hike in workload, as leaving staff are not replaced and company funds dry up everywhere. As an example, I’ve had to ruin this bank holiday weekend with achieving deadlines :(

In short, I’m experiencing the disappearance of the fun and challenging aspects of my job that used to make worklife enjoyable as there is a focus on core employer activities that are dull and, career-wise, pretty deadend. I guess the company is trying to survive the turmoil of the economy by focusing on core activities. This is making the high flying or ambitious staff leave as and when they can.

Here’s my dilemma. Do I see the writing on the wall and leave for an exciting but risky opportunity that has arisen, initially with a one year contract elsewhere – pay £30k. Or do I stay in my secure job that earns £45k and sit this one out, despite the work problems. Advise and anecdotal experience greatly sought.

Circumstances : Mid- to-late 30’s with a secure job, North West. Savings of around £90k, renting, no kids, partner settled in the NW. Likely to emigrate in a few years (so looking to keep my skillset up-to-date). New job in start up company.

A few things to bear in mind .

That is a massive pay cut, and is the excitment worth £15k ? how long before the excitment wears off ? How risky is the new job ? When you say risky could it dissapear altogether ? then you will be on Zero and breaking into the £90k .

Money is a weird and wonderfull thing £90k is a lot of money and hard to come by , however once it is being used to live while no month in month out pay is going into your bank it soon starts to look a lot less than it does now and is very easy to get rid off it goes easeir than it comes. While working you can add to it when not working you have to start breaking into it . Take it form me I had a great redundancy a few years back and took a year off , the money soon dwindles and it is no fun paying bills, food and rent from savings.

The grass is always greener on the other side , untill you get there .

Better the devil you know .

If the new job decideds that is does not like you it can let you go with no notice or redundancy . How much notice and redundancy would you get if the job you are in now lets you go ?

Your mid to late 30's not old not young but if you find yourself without a job it is different to being mid to late 20's.

Ask yourself this . you are not happy in your current job , thats fine most people do not like their jobs , are you looking to leave and jumping for the sake of it into something less well paid that is risky as you are gagging for an easy way out ? The easy way out might be a lot harder in the long run especially if the new job does not live up to expectations and getting up in the mornings to go there is not paying the dosh the job you have now is.

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Thanks ccc. To clarify - no debt.

But the emigration fund will not be topped up much every month, and its a very secure job to sit the recession out in. Do I risk or play safe? Other comments welcomed.

Indeed - I suppose to me it seems a simple choice. But then we are different. Personally I would see it from the view below. Then again you could move to the new job - it goes teets up in a week - and you cannot find any work for the next year. That is the very worst scenario though. And you would still have a big chunk of savings left.

With savings of £90k I'm guessing you could survive for at least 5 years comfortably with no loss of standard of living even without any work at all. That gives you a lot of flexibility, and in my view makes the decision not overly financial (that is to say you shouldn't let the financial side of it decide for you).

You say you hate your job. You say the new opportunity is risky but exciting. If it is as clear cut as that, hate vs excitement, then make the move. Besides, if you stick at the boring deadend job then in a year you'll be a year older, have spent 12 months being bored/stressed, and have... £100k in savings? Is it worth it...?

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IMO a lot of this comes down to how many other interests and relationships you have outside of work. If those are both strong and could continue to be in the new environment, then not everything in your life changes at once. Who knows how the job situation will turn out? It will matter less if it is only one area of your life that's important to you.

Have you (or anyone else) ever read 'Who moved my cheese?'. Very challenging and refreshing. I started flicking through it on a friend's recommendation and ended up reading the whole book (it's not huge) in one go.

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Some great comments here - please keep them coming :) - I will comment later once more have built up. Thanks.

Anyone else in the same boat - job still alive but working conditions increasingly poor ?

Somewhat similar - jobs elsewhere are actually paying more though. As it most often turns out, i like the people i work with but not much about the company that i work for. What's keeping my job secure isn't what i'm actually paid to do, but the massive amounts of peripheral knowledge that i tend to pick up about the companies operations wherever i work. Basically if anything stops working, i'm one of the first people to get asked for help.

So... stay where i am, secure job but getting bored, and company isn't rewarding me too well, or go somewhere else for better pay, but with the knowledge that i'd be first out the door if recession really did start to hit.

I'm figuring wait and see a bit longer :)

Edit:

The big unknown for me is always the people i'd be working with day in, day out. Pretty hard to get a feel one way or another for if you'll get on with them.

Edited by rw42

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With savings of £90k I'm guessing you could survive for at least 5 years comfortably with no loss of standard of living even without any work at all. That gives you a lot of flexibility, and in my view makes the decision not overly financial (that is to say you shouldn't let the financial side of it decide for you).

You say you hate your job. You say the new opportunity is risky but exciting. If it is as clear cut as that, hate vs excitement, then make the move. Besides, if you stick at the boring deadend job then in a year you'll be a year older, have spent 12 months being bored/stressed, and have... £100k in savings? Is it worth it...?

On the other hand if the new job goes wrong he could spend 12 months with no work and the £90k is now £72k instead of the £100k it would have been had he stayed put . If he then finds new work how long will it take to make up the lost £28k ?

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On the other hand if the new job goes wrong he could spend 12 months with no work and the £90k is now £72k instead of the £100k it would have been had he stayed put . If he then finds new work how long will it take to make up the lost £28k ?

Agreed, but whether he has £72k, £90k, £100k or anything similar is perhaps not too important. All three numbers represent a large amount of security and allow the decision taken to be based on what he wants, what'll make him happy. In that context, if he really hates his job, then why stay? You only live once.

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No such thing as a permanent job nowadays. All it needs is a merger/takeover or loss of big orders, and the "safe" job can suddenly disappear.

If you have a job opportunity, why not take it? I get the feeling it will affect your health adversely if you stay where you are. Just try and leave on good terms (even offer a bit of coaching for your replacement), so you have good references (and even the possibility of asking for your old job back) if the new startup flounders...

Btw, I envy you your choice.

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There is good advice here in researching the company more, and I will do that. One of the problems is my age and personal circumstances - being well into my 30s, taking such a risk is a lot more complex. I will need to live away from home during the week - an extra cost to now where me and the mrs live together and pay a single rent. That adds to the big pay cut. It has been living away from the south east, sharing living costs with a partner and earning well above my usual £30k salary that has created this savings pot anyway (with help from some Au/Ag action). In the days of £30k, I scrimped and saved as a singleton for little real savings accumulation.

In terms of taking money abroad to South America (possibly by 2013/14) to start a family, I'm deciding between toughing it out in this dead-end job with possibly £120k of savings to take, or emigrating with possibly half that, but with the chance of a better skillset and more exciting career when I get there. Its really a tough call.

More comments welcome, thanks to all who have posted. Some great stuff here. Any more in a similar boat?

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Agreed, but whether he has £72k, £90k, £100k or anything similar is perhaps not too important. All three numbers represent a large amount of security and allow the decision taken to be based on what he wants, what'll make him happy. In that context, if he really hates his job, then why stay? You only live once.

£100K is much better than £72k as £28k is a lot of money . To save the £90k he has already got which is 2 years of his gross pay tells me that money is quite important to him and breaking into it will not make him happy even if he has removed himself from the job he hates. Yes you only live once and earning good money and adding to savings makes that living easier . Especially now with the economy and jobs the way they are , he is late 30's has not bought a house so that £90k is the sum total of his working life gambling that security on swapping a boring job for one that spells excitment but has no Guarantee is not something to be taken without thinking long and hard , easy to say much harder to live with if the new job goes wrong.

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  • 284 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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