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Milton

Sky News: More Lies About House Prices

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Just watched Sky News reporting that the Halifax have stated House Prices are at their most Affordable for 12 years. Presenter brings out large percentage figures and charts.

[They just wind me up. They have not put a Link to the story on their website.]

Yet From the Statistics I have been able to source:

In 1997, according to the Office of National Statistics, the national average wage was £16,666.

According to the Nationwide Building Society the Average House price in 1997 was £55k.

£16,666/£55,000 = 3.3x salary [mortgage] The Average First Timer Buyer mortgage in 1997 was just £41.5k [Council Mortgage Lenders]

And the Average FTB mortgage multiple in 1997 was in a range of 2.3x - 2.5x salary. [Firstrung]

************************************************

By 2007, at the peak of the boom [according to the Office of National Statistics] the national average wage had risen to £23.5k

The Average House Price in 2007 was £185k. [Nationwide Figures. Halifax had estimated AHP higher than £185k]

£185,000/£23.5k = 7.8x salary [mortgage]

************************************************

2011 Average House Price £166,764 [Nationwide]

2011 Average Wage £25k

£166,764/£25k = £6.6x salary [mortgage]

*******************************************

[There have been countless examples of 300% increases from 1997-2007 in my area. And Many are still priced at that]

These Mainstream Media Channels are set to transmit. There is not a good enough opportunity for people to comment on their falsifications.

And how do they account for the sharp increase in Utilities, and Household Bills we have seen during the last 12 years?

It was reported here that the average household bill is now higher than the average salary

The Mainstream Media are just lying, vested interest toerags.

**[According to the ONS, over two thirds of taxpayers in the UK earn LESS than average wage]

Edited by Milton

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Halifax - a bankrupt bank casting out perls before the swine.

You'd be up for fraud charges and in prison for doing what they did in any other business.

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And why dont any of these utter B@5tards in the MSM ever look at House Prices from the angle of the 'Priced Out?'

The Millions of people who have already been forced to waste their meagre income, tens upon tens of thousands in rent, working for nothing, no capital, paying for someone else's mortgage and retirement, for over a decade, a direct result of government sponsored bank fraud and theft.

Slaves.

This country is a plutocracy, and I hope someone burns it all down.

Edited by Milton

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Didn't see it but normally these 'affordability' stats they use to pimp overpriced homes (or specifically oversized mortgages) are based on just the interest paid, conveniently forgetting the huge capital sum that future rate rises will be based on.

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Halifax - a bankrupt bank casting out perls before the swine.

You'd be up for fraud charges and in prison for doing what they did in any other business.

Fraud is widespread in corporate Britain. I am badgering my MP to find out what the government are doing to prosecute the big insurance companies for conspiring with ambulance chasing legal thieves (lawyers) to set up false claims and kick back systems all of which runs foul of the Data Protection Act that says Insurance Companies must not share accident details with predator lawyers and "claims helplines." So far, no action appears to be forthcoming--as expected.

Its everyone for themselves in cutpurse Britain. The housing market is a fraud vortex and it has sucked in 70% of our nation's economy.

The trigger can only be job losses. As long as people have a paycheck the banks will accomodate them.

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Fraud is widespread in corporate Britain.

Edited for accuracy. The UK should be somewhere near the top in the world corruption index tbh, but the fact we cover it up and let is slide if you are a big corp or somebody important is pretty damning. At least in corupt places they don't pretend not to be corrupt.

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Halifax - a bankrupt bank casting out perls before the swine.

You'd be up for fraud charges and in prison for doing what they did in any other business.

Don't be silly fraud and prison and crimes even are only for the little people. What are you some kind of terrorist?

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Fraud is widespread in corporate Britain. I am badgering my MP to find out what the government are doing to prosecute the big insurance companies for conspiring with ambulance chasing legal thieves (lawyers) to set up false claims and kick back systems all of which runs foul of the Data Protection Act that says Insurance Companies must not share accident details with predator lawyers and "claims helplines." So far, no action appears to be forthcoming--as expected.

Its everyone for themselves in cutpurse Britain. The housing market is a fraud vortex and it has sucked in 70% of our nation's economy.

The trigger can only be job losses. As long as people have a paycheck the banks will accomodate them.

I understand your feelings but you have to be a little careful. When people signed up with insurance companies there was that check box that said they could share the information with partners and third parties. I suspect that is exactly what they did, so it wouldnt be illegal.

What is troublesome though is the ethics. Namely that insurance rises were blamed on increases in such claims and claims companies. When all along the insurance companies were in fact creating the work and passing on the leads for them as well as taking comission. That is corrupt. But again, is it illegal? Not so sure, but it ought to be when car insurance is a legal requirement to drive.

EDIT: Here's the thing. Large companies are rewarding individuals for being 'clever' and creating schemes that take more and more money from the masses, without actually providing anything of value. Mortgages, trip and fall, car accidents etc. All these things have been around for ages and previously been serviced ethically. Now though it seems the concensus it to create the next legal scam to package these up and commoditise them and make them mass market rip-offs. It's this that is the problem in society. We all throw our money into these schemes through increased house prices, increased insurance, increased taxes etc.

And yet we call these activities legal, whereas stealing a bottle of water carries severals years prison sentance. Where's the 'justice' in that?

Edited by Redcellar

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A while back, some one produced alternative 'affordability' stats, based on 25 yrs repayment, wage inflation etc. Can't remember which organisation it was. Sufficed to say they produced alternative results...

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The big wigs really are trying to keep the farce going arn't they?. I wonder if they've realised that the only industry we have in England in building flats and with out mugs to buy them we would be in real trouble.

God help those sucked in.

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Affordable if you have a low tracker rate. And only while rates stay low (? 5 years - a lifetime).

Unaffordable for everybody else.

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http://news.sky.com/home/business/article/16057891

Here it is.

Its basically total crap to say

Buying a home is now more affordable than at any time in the past 12 years

is the same as

Home buyers spent 28% of their income on mortgage payments between April and June - down from 48% in 2007

Why?

Because it only consider's those actually buying homes and not those priced out of the market.

Its like saying 'Porsche's are now more affordable because we've this year we've decided to sell them only to people who earn more than £1m a year, thus a smaller proportion of their income is spent on the car, thus its more affordable, even if the price has doubled since last year.

People spend less of their salaries on mortgages because banks are only giving mortgages to those on high salaries, a complete reversal of 2007, where someone on NMW could get a six figure loan.

Gutter journalism. Misleading spin at its worst. However, very easy to get suckered in if you dont look behind the figures.

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As has already been pointed out is that it's as if society now just accepts fraud as a valid form of commercial activity. :angry:

I don't know if anyone saw the program "Fraud Squad" on TV last night, here's the L I N K . What is interesting is its the City of London police that they are filming in the first place. Why is is it so wrong to operate a boiler room when all over the square mile other forms of fraud are being perpetrated day in day out. It appears that what is cause these individuals to be investigated is that they are operating from Spain and are making NO attempt to cover up their crime.

I wonder whether the City's fraud squad could ever be forced into investigate some of the other fraud. If anyone has any clear thoughts on questions that could be posed in the form of a FOI to them I'd be only to happy to follow it up. Maybe something along the lines of different types of fraud investigated and their conviction rates. I need someone would knows what categories of fraud there are to find where they are listed.

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Just watched Sky News reporting that the Halifax have stated House Prices are at their most Affordable for 12 years. Presenter brings out large percentage figures and charts.

[They just wind me up. They have not put a Link to the story on their website.]

Yet From the Statistics I have been able to source:

In 1997, according to the Office of National Statistics, the national average wage was £16,666.

According to the Nationwide Building Society the Average House price in 1997 was £55k.

£16,666/£55,000 = 3.3x salary [mortgage] The Average First Timer Buyer mortgage in 1997 was just £41.5k [Council Mortgage Lenders]

And the Average FTB mortgage multiple in 1997 was in a range of 2.3x - 2.5x salary. [Firstrung]

************************************************

By 2007, at the peak of the boom [according to the Office of National Statistics] the national average wage had risen to £23.5k

The Average House Price in 2007 was £185k. [Nationwide Figures. Halifax had estimated AHP higher than £185k]

£185,000/£23.5k = 7.8x salary [mortgage]

************************************************

2011 Average House Price £166,764 [Nationwide]

2011 Average Wage £25k

£166,764/£25k = £6.6x salary [mortgage]

*******************************************

[There have been countless examples of 300% increases from 1997-2007 in my area. And Many are still priced at that]

These Mainstream Media Channels are set to transmit. There is not a good enough opportunity for people to comment on their falsifications.

And how do they account for the sharp increase in Utilities, and Household Bills we have seen during the last 12 years?

It was reported here that the average household bill is now higher than the average salary

The Mainstream Media are just lying, vested interest toerags.

**[According to the ONS, over two thirds of taxpayers in the UK earn LESS than average wage]

This kind of posting does the forum no favours.

Affordability, as someone has pointed out, is a function of the ability to pay for a house. In a stably low interest rate environment, which we are in and will be for some time, repayments are low. Might be hard to find the deposit, but otherwise houses are more affordable now than they were previously.

Hardly lies.

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This kind of posting does the forum no favours.

Affordability, as someone has pointed out, is a function of the ability to pay for a house. In a stably low interest rate environment, which we are in and will be for some time, repayments are low. Might be hard to find the deposit, but otherwise houses are more affordable now than they were previously.

Hardly lies.

Affordability has to take into account the total cost. I couldn't care less if I'm only paying 50p a month now if I won't be able to afford it in 10 years when the rates have gone up. You can't predict the future but neither can you ignore it. Take the same house, bought by someone doing the same job, at various times, and have a look over the total lifetime of the mortgage. That's the only way you can really measure affordability if you're not talking about cash buyers. It's a guess, true. It's also why sensible people don't pay much attention to the current rate and judge whether a house is affordable or not by how much they've got and earn and how much they'll have to stump up for the house, because the X times salary measurement is a much better long-term guide.

To say houses are affordable simply because rates are currently low is to argue for the disastrous and idiotic short-termism that's ruined us.

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Its basically total crap to say

Buying a home is now more affordable than at any time in the past 12 years

is the same as

Home buyers spent 28% of their income on mortgage payments between April and June - down from 48% in 2007

Why?

Because it only consider's those actually buying homes and not those priced out of the market.

Its like saying 'Porsche's are now more affordable because we've this year we've decided to sell them only to people who earn more than £1m a year, thus a smaller proportion of their income is spent on the car, thus its more affordable, even if the price has doubled since last year

Gutter journalism. Misleading spin at its worst. However, very easy to get suckered in if you dont look behind the figures.

In complete agreement. Exactly my point. For a new borrower, it is an absolute lie to state that house prices are more affordable now than they have been at any point during the last 12 years.

When In fact the exact opposite is true.

This kind of posting does the forum no favours.

Affordability, as someone has pointed out, is a function of the ability to pay for a house. In a stably low interest rate environment, which we are in and will be for some time, repayments are low. Might be hard to find the deposit, but otherwise houses are more affordable now than they were previously.

[No they are not!! You have not taken into consideration 300% capital gains in housing in the last 12 years. Which makes you absolutely incorrect.......:rolleyes: My god man, you're a HPC'er brainwashed by the MSM!!]

Are you a homeowner? Or a STR?

Unfortunately sensationalist house price articles are the bread and butter of our MSM.

That headline, houses are the most affordable in 12 years, was reported in the Telegraph, The Independent, Orange, The Guardian, The BBC etc etc.........

Those newspaper articles all presented the data, with different angles. Some were extremely bullish, and included the Halifax data, in amongst the article, with the obvious intention of spinning the article, to pull new FTB's into the Ponzi........[Nothing new there then.]

The major implication in the articles being that now is the best time to buy in over a decade

Some articles, included the VI Halifax quote, aimed specifically at new borrowers, whilst pushing 'Mates Mortgages' !!

And reminding weekend browsers, or potential new borrowers, of the extortionate rise in house prices, and previous levels of affordability, is never a waste of time............ :rolleyes:

Edited by Milton

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Look for distressed sales. Ignore the b****r kite flyers and wide eyed boys looking to flip - so that's 95% of the market. Someone on here pointed out that the difference between auction and EA prices is narrowing a lot, so theres no need to trawl the auctions either. The haliwide propaganda departments are paid to write whatever that generates fees. Don't fall for it, set a plan and stick to it.

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  • 284 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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