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DownsizingDiva

I Give Up

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Many economists are now suggesting that there will be no significant rise in interest rates until 2014 at the earliest.

When I sold up in 2008 (through circumstance, not choice), I wasn't too worried about renting for a while. Had a sizeable chunk of equity (over £150K) to invest. I figured that the interest on that would more than cover rental payments, whilst I waited for property prices to fall to a more realistic level.

Having "sat it out" now for nearly 3 years, and having paid out a HUGE amount in rental payments, and seen my equity eroded by savings rates of around 3-4% (albeit tax free in ISAs/Index Linked stuff), and living in a part of the south east where demand still outstrips supply on the desirable housing front thus keeping prices at around the 2006 level, I give up.

I shall buy a house shortly. It does not make economical sense to remain in rented accommodation and wait any longer. I just wondered how many others are thinking the same?

Who could have imagined that the feckless government and MPC could have gone to such lengths to bail out the over-indebted?

Having never owed anything in my life (apart from a £35K mortgage on our first property nearly 20 years ago), and never lived beyond my means, it really does sicken me that it seems the only way to beat them is to join them.

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Having "sat it out" now for nearly 3 years, and having paid out a HUGE amount in rental payments, and seen my equity eroded by savings rates of around 3-4% (albeit tax free in ISAs/Index Linked stuff), and living in a part of the south east where demand still outstrips supply on the desirable housing front thus keeping prices at around the 2006 level, I give up.

This is exactly the effect that low interest rates are calculated to have i.e. to force savers to spend their money in order to ''help the economy'' and help support over priced houses. But I fully understand that you must do what you feel that have to do.

Good luck!

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This is why this forum always ends up discussing gold or stock market issues these days. Low interest rates are here to stay for several years probably, and high inflation will continue being engineered from that , conveniently eroding public and private debt, at the cost of savers.

In this negative real interest rate environment, saving in a bank account in one's own currency makes no sense IMHO. This forces non-home owners who may be in a position to buy to either:

1) Join the bandwagon, and take up a huge home loan. The risk here is that the ZIRP environment is insufficient to protect houses into the future,and some form of collapse begins anyway, or that prices slowly drop for many years. Hence you buy at peak or near-peak.

2) Buy gold, as it historically rises during periods of negative interest rates, as you can see from graphs in the gold forum. The downside here is volatility - entry and exit points greatly determine profit unless you hold long term.

3) Stocks and shares. A casino unless you know what you are doing, and a bit of a casino still for the experts, although there are still good dividend payers out there.

4) RPI-linked certs - only £15000 per person and really not that great a return, but will help fight inflation.

A portfolio of 2,3 and 4 may be a sensible mix, chosing a single option if you wish to be more aggressive.

Even if houses do not fall much in cash terms in the years ahead, I can see much more scope for aggressive bidding in the next year or two, as unemployment/inflation-squeezed costs of living shake out the financially-stretched.

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But if IR are kept low and incomes stagnate or fall, and are eroded by inflation, as is the situation now and the situation going forward, surely the economy is in a death spiral as real incomes are eroded further and further on an ongoing basis.

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But if IR are kept low and incomes stagnate or fall, and are eroded by inflation, as is the situation now and the situation going forward, surely the economy is in a death spiral as real incomes are eroded further and further on an ongoing basis.

Quite so.

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Wage rises would need rising external demand for our products and services.

Eurozone?

China?

US?

Japan?

Well that's just about sums up the wages UNLESS we get a price / wage spiral induced by the imploding pound.

So a negative out look on housing.

Is renting really costing you that much every month? It it costing you more than a 8% capital loss on housing each year?

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Many economists are now suggesting that there will be no significant rise in interest rates until 2014 at the earliest.

When I sold up in 2008 (through circumstance, not choice), I wasn't too worried about renting for a while. Had a sizeable chunk of equity (over £150K) to invest. I figured that the interest on that would more than cover rental payments, whilst I waited for property prices to fall to a more realistic level.

Having "sat it out" now for nearly 3 years, and having paid out a HUGE amount in rental payments, and seen my equity eroded by savings rates of around 3-4% (albeit tax free in ISAs/Index Linked stuff), and living in a part of the south east where demand still outstrips supply on the desirable housing front thus keeping prices at around the 2006 level, I give up.

I shall buy a house shortly. It does not make economical sense to remain in rented accommodation and wait any longer. I just wondered how many others are thinking the same?

Who could have imagined that the feckless government and MPC could have gone to such lengths to bail out the over-indebted?

Having never owed anything in my life (apart from a £35K mortgage on our first property nearly 20 years ago), and never lived beyond my means, it really does sicken me that it seems the only way to beat them is to join them.

I'm in a similar situation, given up thinking about house prices because the game is rigged in favour of the reckless. Not buying however because I'm stuck in a 12 month tenancy. I sold at a loss and have been renting at £1200 previously years, £1350 this year. Rental costs and inflation are destroying my house deposit.

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I did the same in December 2009, bought a property with my wife (after renting for several years - sold last property in 2005 (split with ex)).

Ensured we got a mega bargain (2003 value) . Mortgage is 1.8x our combined salary.

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Many economists are now suggesting that there will be no significant rise in interest rates until 2014 at the earliest.

When I sold up in 2008 (through circumstance, not choice), I wasn't too worried about renting for a while. Had a sizeable chunk of equity (over £150K) to invest. I figured that the interest on that would more than cover rental payments, whilst I waited for property prices to fall to a more realistic level.

Having "sat it out" now for nearly 3 years, and having paid out a HUGE amount in rental payments, and seen my equity eroded by savings rates of around 3-4% (albeit tax free in ISAs/Index Linked stuff), and living in a part of the south east where demand still outstrips supply on the desirable housing front thus keeping prices at around the 2006 level, I give up.

I shall buy a house shortly. It does not make economical sense to remain in rented accommodation and wait any longer. I just wondered how many others are thinking the same?

Who could have imagined that the feckless government and MPC could have gone to such lengths to bail out the over-indebted?

Having never owed anything in my life (apart from a £35K mortgage on our first property nearly 20 years ago), and never lived beyond my means, it really does sicken me that it seems the only way to beat them is to join them.

+1

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Many economists are now suggesting that there will be no significant rise in interest rates until 2014 at the earliest.

When I sold up in 2008 (through circumstance, not choice), I wasn't too worried about renting for a while. Had a sizeable chunk of equity (over £150K) to invest. I figured that the interest on that would more than cover rental payments, whilst I waited for property prices to fall to a more realistic level.

Having "sat it out" now for nearly 3 years, and having paid out a HUGE amount in rental payments, and seen my equity eroded by savings rates of around 3-4% (albeit tax free in ISAs/Index Linked stuff), and living in a part of the south east where demand still outstrips supply on the desirable housing front thus keeping prices at around the 2006 level, I give up.

I shall buy a house shortly. It does not make economical sense to remain in rented accommodation and wait any longer. I just wondered how many others are thinking the same?

Who could have imagined that the feckless government and MPC could have gone to such lengths to bail out the over-indebted?

Having never owed anything in my life (apart from a £35K mortgage on our first property nearly 20 years ago), and never lived beyond my means, it really does sicken me that it seems the only way to beat them is to join them.

The way to beat them is borrow a massive amount of money, work out ways to extract it on the asset and then throw the debt back at them.

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Seriously, if rental costs are eating into your STR fund, why did you sell?

I sold because I thought there would be a house price crash by now LOL. Luckily some of my STR fund is in gold and silver, which will hopefully rebalance things.

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The way to beat them is borrow a massive amount of money, work out ways to extract it on the asset and then throw the debt back at them.

+1 Borrow as much as possible, stash it, go bankrupt and leave the country for a few years travel. If I had nothing, this is the route I would take now. Why fight fair when your opponent repeatedly keeps kicking you in the family jewels.

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Can you get away with this? Seriously? What' to stop me taking out £100k in loans, buying a wad of gold and some shares, declaring bankruptcy and then just moving to work abroad?

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Can you get away with this? Seriously? What' to stop me taking out £100k in loans, buying a wad of gold and some shares, declaring bankruptcy and then just moving to work abroad?

You'd have to prove to the bankruptcy court you were legitimately bankrupt, so you'd need an excuse for what you spent it on. Anything you bought would have to be non-traceable (gold/cash etc). Thats it AFAIK. Pleading gambling addiction would have been my route.

The only thing stopping people doing it is fear, probably fairly because they'd jail you if you were caught, and an outdated sense of honour that its not the 'right' thing to do.

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Wouldn't you have to show some kind of proof or audit trail for your gambling habit though? Also don't the gold sellers have to inform the rev when people make purchases?

Again, AFAIK (which isn't much so if anyone has any facts, chime in) you wouldn't need to show exactly how all the money went.. If you were taking out a grand a week and said you lost on on the horses or whatever, how would they even begin to prove you didn't. It would be a different matter if you were claiming online gambling, but even then I'm not sure they'd go as far to check the records.

Buy gold elsewhere, nice trip away and solves big brother problem here.

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The way to beat them is borrow a massive amount of money, work out ways to extract it on the asset and then throw the debt back at them.

Well, yes. Or just pay it back really slowly , like over 25 years. That's what most non HPC-ers do. 25 years from now, your asset will be worth X and you will have paid back Y. Never in history has Y been greater than X, that is the way the game is rigged.

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Can you get away with this? Seriously? What' to stop me taking out £100k in loans, buying a wad of gold and some shares, declaring bankruptcy and then just moving to work abroad?

Why declare bancruptcy? Just go. I'm not an expert, but I believe you have to make a minimum amount of payments to escape fraud charges and then your scot free. I also think there's some rule on debt being time-limited. If you've had no contact with the company for six years, then you can tell them to go whistle.

I am NOT an debt advisor for CAB however, so I'd check this before basing your life on it!

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Why declare bancruptcy? Just go. I'm not an expert, but I believe you have to make a minimum amount of payments to escape fraud charges and then your scot free. I also think there's some rule on debt being time-limited. If you've had no contact with the company for six years, then you can tell them to go whistle.

I am NOT an debt advisor for CAB however, so I'd check this before basing your life on it!

7 years i think. If you leave the country they try and trace where you have gone to and sell the debt to people in that country.

I'd imagine it would be hard to get enough to make it worth the risk in today's climate.

Certainly an option if your that way inclined though. The system is corrupt, so fair game in my eyes to anyone who done this.

i remember talking to someone who borrowed 100k around 2004 and just changed his name and started over again, never even left the country. Not sure if he was caught but would imagine this would leave a trail. as do all options.

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Just take a leaf out of Grant Bovey's book, stick a few of your assets in someone else's name and hey presto 50 million of debt is all forgotten about.

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  • 312 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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