CokeSnortingTory Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Isn't that the goldbug/silverbug conspiracy theory though - people wanting to believe it? As far as I can see the price of gold - be it physical or in a paper ETF - is plunging. The goldbugs want to believe that there is a difference between GLD and physical gold but is there? If people were selling 'paper' GLD and buying physical gold then why would the price of gold be falling? What you have to understand is that Austrian economics/Libertarianism is an eschatological belief system. Hyperinflation performs the same function in their religious worldview that Revolution does for Marxists and that The Second Coming does for Christians. It is were a corrupt system is slain, and a new paradise on Earth can be created. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Hmmm... just found this comment on ZH: As Olivia Newton-John said.. "Let's Get Physical" Surely you can read that as the physical dealers now realise that gold is crashing but they know there are plenty of tin foil haters out there... so they will raise their physical prices enough to make a profit and then will sell off their physical gold to all the conspiracy theorists? It seems to me that no matter how bad the news might get for gold or silver that there are still hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of people believing in some kind of gold conspiracy. When, how and why they came to this line of thought is beyond me - going back several years such people did not believe it as gold had been in the doldrums for years. But they all seem to have been converted to this conspiracy idea. They may be right of course - but they may also be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koala_bear Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 bbc now have an article with more plausible reasons than some than have been bought up elsewhere. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22151474 Gold price falls to two-year low of $1,416 an ounce Gold has fallen 8.5% to $1,416 an ounce, its lowest level in two years, as fears of high inflation recede. Gold is traditionally bought by investors to protect against inflation, which erodes the value of cash investments. But investors are now expecting central banks around the world to tighten monetary policy in an effort to curb price rises. Last week, Cyprus undermined confidence when it said it was selling off gold. The price of gold has had a remarkable run in recent years, hitting a record high of $1,800. The US central bank, the Federal Reserve, is expected to stop its quantitative easing (QE) programme this year. Dominic Schnider, an analyst at UBS Wealth Management, said this had tipped market sentiment and sparked a mass flight out of the commodity: "What we now see is panic selling, perhaps triggered by the Fed's stimulus view. The Fed has given the signal that there's a possibility to reduce QE and that took a lot of trust out of gold. "And people recognise that an environment where you have no inflation is a powerful driver to get out of the metal." Another drag on prices come from India, the world's biggest buyer of gold bullion, which introduced a 50% import tax that has triggered a 24% fall in the amount of gold brought into the country in the first quarter of this year. Mohit Kamboj, president of the Bombay Bullion Association, suggested prices may have further to fall: "With more and more countries reducing stocks, the future of gold seems bleak." The fall means Cyprus is likely to raise less than the 400m euros ($525m) it hoped for when it announced it was selling the bulk of its gold reserve. Gold mining company shares fell sharply as a result, with Randgold down 10% on the London stock exchange and Fresnillo down by 14% at noon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shindigger Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) Surely you can read that as the physical dealers now realise that gold is crashing but they know there are plenty of tin foil haters out there... so they will raise their physical prices enough to make a profit and then will sell off their physical gold to all the conspiracy theorists? It seems to me that no matter how bad the news might get for gold or silver that there are still hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of people believing in some kind of gold conspiracy. When, how and why they came to this line of thought is beyond me - going back several years such people did not believe it as gold had been in the doldrums for years. But they all seem to have been converted to this conspiracy idea. They may be right of course - but they may also be wrong. In the wider economy is there ONE factor that is flashing red as the reason why this has happened? I cant see one. No rate hikes anywhere, all the data as usual is "unexpectedly" bearish. All i can think of is if rumours of states needing to sell are gathering momentum in the places that Jonny Punch Clock (ie me) have no access to. Maybe this is the sea being sucked off the beach moment, and a tsunami style spike up is coming... I ******ing hope so.... Ah i see the Fed might be pulling back on QE... Yeah right.... Edited April 15, 2013 by shindigger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenpig Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) It is a bit odd, but then you don't actually need a concrete reason for bubbles to burst. I don't think there was a specific reason the tulip bubble burst, just one day people decided to stop buying them. Incidently, is there any reason why central banks hold gold at all any more? Given the desparate attempts by all the western nations to debase their curriencies, shouldn't they all be selling off gold like mad? Edited April 15, 2013 by BigPig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 It is a bit odd, but then you don't actually need a concrete reason for bubbles to burst. I don't think there was a specific reason the tulip bubble burst, just one day people decided to stop buying them. Incidently, is there any reason why central banks hold gold at all any more? Given the desparate attempts by all the western nations to debase their curriencies, shouldn't they all be selling off gold like mad? Gold isn't a bubble (but we've had that discussion before so let's not go there). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) Marc Faber: “I love the markets. I love the fact that gold is finally breaking down. That will offer an excellent buying opportunity. I would just like to make one comment. At the moment, a lot of people are knocking gold down. But if we look at the records, we are now down 21% from the September 2011 high. Apple is down 39% from last year’s high. At the same time, the S&P is at about not even up 1% from the peak in October 2007. Over the same period of time, even after today’s correction gold is up 100%. The S&P is up 2% over the March 2000 high. Gold is up 442%. So I am happy we have a sell-off that will lead to a major low. It could be at $1400, it could be today at $1300, but I think that the bull market in gold is not completed. Today we have commodities breaking down including gold. At the same time we have bonds rallying very strongly. If you stand aside and you look at these two events, it would suggest that they are strongly deflationary pressures in the system. If that was the case, I wouldn’t buy stocks or sovereign bonds because the stock market would be hit by disappointing profits if there was a deflationary environment" http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.co.uk/2013/04/marc-faber-i-love-fact-that-gold-is.html Edited April 15, 2013 by Errol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFlibble Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 So... North Korea is rattling it's cage, japan's currency is going down the pan, helped by Fukushima, Israel may or may not attack Iran, Syria is a war zone, China's economy may be fragile, the Fed and BoE are having a pi**ing contest to see who can consume the most wood pulp and linen, Cyprus may be the point at which the EZ unravels, if not Portugal, Spain, italy, Ireland or the Netherlands, the ECB treats everyone's cash savings as their own, the NY and London stock exchanges are like a bubble on steroids, Bitcoins have been hammered as a safe haven for money Just the thing to make people sell gold and buy fiat while they can still carry the money they get for it without a wheelbarrow. WTF is going on? Apart from TMT's suggestion that there may be fears that some Soverign may be forced to dump it's gold on the open market, I can see nothing that even remotely explains the markets. it is entirely contrary to what should happen in a working market. Bizzare. I may well be filling my boots with cheap gold soon. Brilliant summary. Sovereigns selling their Gold to pay off odious debts is bad enough, but to announce it beforehand is just plain stupid, which seems to be what happened with Cyprus. Dumping on the open market isn't required and won't happen. A quick call to China will sort that problem out, we'll take the Gold, here's a pile of US Treasuries, enjoy... The more they push Gold down the more physical China and Russia will remove and the more US Treasuries will be sold. If this is an attempt to save the Dollar then it's a poor job. Given the amount of non US Dollar trade agreements starting up one does have to wonder what the hell is going on here. Maybe it is simply a case of no more printing of money that's driving down Gold, if so, bring it on, a deflationary collapse sounds good to me - the UK housing market desperately needs one that is for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) . Edited April 15, 2013 by Tamara De Lempicka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 i love reading these justifications, its like reading a whos right when being wrong, excluding the reality that when HPC finally joined the emotional bull market in gold, enough to pin it, ignoring the many gold bugs before, when HPC finally joined the party of sentiment and pinned it any post goldbug is in negative equity And yet they still expect to put every negative equity tard in deference because its a conspiracy. , at what point of not making individuals responsible for their opinions did HPC communism/conspiracy seem a good idea I is thick - I've read the above 3 times and still do not know what you are saying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 I is thick - I've read the above 3 times and still do not know what you are saying I think I understood it. But you're right, it's not phrased very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) , Edited April 15, 2013 by Tamara De Lempicka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 in short HPC are the definitive "sheeple" they like to derogatively label, theres no better justification for being on the other side of the trade than HPC confirmation I think not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) I think not. at what price was there enough agreement/excitement/emotion from the majority for this thread to be pinned? Take your time, its not a trick question Edited April 15, 2013 by Tamara De Lempicka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) I am confused now. I no longer know which one of you is a gold bull and which one is not. I think I will look at the avatars. Edited April 15, 2013 by The Masked Tulip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 ZH is reporting that a bank sold 6 billion of gold on Friday and, naturally, on ZH they are saying this is because the bank was worried about the believed lack of physical gold in the paper gold market!!!???? Is it not possible that the bank was having a liquidity issue and needed cash ASAP so was forced to sell gold? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) ZH is reporting that a bank sold 6 billion of gold on Friday and, naturally, on ZH they are saying this is because the bank was worried about the believed lack of physical gold in the paper gold market!!!???? Is it not possible that the bank was having a liquidity issue and needed cash ASAP so was forced to sell gold? precisely, its also possible my elbow is my anush if thats what i want to believe However from a sensible POV the return of coke snorting tory had it right, for whatever reason on a planet of a few billion selling pressure outweighed buying pressure at that moment in time, just as buying pressure outweighed selling pressure before PS: are JP Morgan bankrupt yet? Edited April 15, 2013 by Tamara De Lempicka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CokeSnortingTory Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 The Swiss man speaks the truth. Next week Gold may go up, or it may go down. Whatever the reason, it won't be due to the "inevitable" arrival of hyperinflation, as per the prophecy of the pseudo-religion of Austrian economics. (It's more likely to be the bear market in Fijian dong-rats). Also, are people still taking Zero Hedge seriously? It's so long since I've been here...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deckard Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Don't waste your time arguing against the goldbugs' dogma, they are as fanatic as the Jesuits. Theirs is a faith, and as such they can never be wrong. Your wealth is measured in gold ounces, it does not matter what the paper price does. Much better to poke some fun at them, I'll start Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Sadman Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Don't waste your time arguing against the goldbugs' dogma, they are as fanatic as the Jesuits. Theirs is a faith, and as such they can never be wrong. Your wealth is measured in gold ounces, it does not matter what the paper price does. Much better to poke some fun at them, I'll start Mock if you wish. Price will be back up near $1700 by the end of the week. 100% guaranteed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Much better to poke some fun at them, I'll start Is that one of those exploding vibrators? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panda Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 All the Gold lovers out there, you want me to be poor today, lets think back, when Gold was what at $1750.00,you were buy buy buy, its going to the moon, if i had bought at this price with Sterling, which was what at $1.55, on a 100 grand Sterling, a round figure, how much would i be the poorer today if i had to sell to buy cash, to pay for my tarts and beer? Math....I am not, will never be in the Gold camp, too manipulated, but i bet i would be very cash poor....Today, tart poor, beer poor? Had a few beers, what would be my cost on 100k Sterling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Zerohedge has this article: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-15/gold-crush-started-400-ton-friday-forced-sale-comex I think it is saying - as I often do not understand these things - that a bank sold 6 billion of gold last Friday because they believe that the North Korean crisis, Japanese mass printing, Cyrpus, etc, did not send gold soaring so that means, de-facto, that the inflationists are wrong and that the deflationists are right. Apparently a bank worked this out and then dumped 6 billion of gold in one day. Did I read that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shindigger Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Mock if you wish. Price will be back up near $1700 by the end of the week. 100% guaranteed. Do go on. Its just pissed straight through £900 by the way. What in the name of Christ is going on?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 This is epic and exceedingly welcome. The lower the better. It just means you get more ounces for the paper. Bring on zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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