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More Action By Another Group

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14060683

And we've seen PricedOut also getting some action and political involvement. Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

Because - contrary to what you'll read here - most people on internet forums are living vicariously?

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I should say there are a fair few who write to MPs, comment on articles and the like - I just feel we have to do something on a grander scale... even if it's just us jumping ship and joining PricedOut for these things. Many others are quick to just dismiss any notion of action altogether.

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Action would require someone to collate a list of where everyone is.

And then assign them to do work locally campaining - visiting MP, writing letters to MP, and paper etc.

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14060683

And we've seen PricedOut also getting some action and political involvement. Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

I couldn't agree more, HPC is all talk and no action. I know that like me one or two are fighting the cause, making derisory offers (not my words, one vendor). I have urged more of us to join in many times, the response is invariably: 'You don't want to do that, you'll only upset the estate agents.' Good! That's exactly what I want to do - undermine the confidence not only of the deluded vendors but the ea's too. And is 25-30% below asking really 'derisory?' After all, they've thought of a number and added ten or twenty percent. It's an opening gambit, trouble with the Brits is we are too compliant, don't know the first thing about negotiating, and think if we've 'beaten down' the vendor by £3k we've done really well, forget about percentages.

Estate agents are obliged by law to pass on any offer, however 'derisory'. Good to hear them grind their teeth. Eg, instructed an agent to offer £250k on £330k asking price (25% derisory discount). The actual boss of the agency phoned me to berate me for 'insulting' his client. When I politely asked what the client actually said, the guy hung up on me.

Get off your bottoms, get out there, don't be shy, give 'em hell. We are up against a huge and powerful army of vested interests, it's time to fight back.

Rant over. For now.

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FP usd to be the spokesman for the website, so it's fair to say plenty high profile stuff has been done in that past. JD continues to do great work at getting the message across.

All said and done, does HPC need to campaign given most of us think a reversion to mean is inevitable? In my view, the last thing HPC needs is to have some d*ckhead politicos 'onside' preaching to the converted in order to gain a few brownie points. Why bother? It's beyong their control.

Edited by cheeznbreed

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14060683

And we've seen PricedOut also getting some action and political involvement. Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

HPC is a louche salon of thinkers musing about life, macroeconomic history, Question Time, the monetary system and twigs in vases amidst a rakish backdrop of fine wines and wenches.

PricedOut just have't got what it takes.

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From what I can see, the purpose of this site is to be a discussion forum. It is not an advocacy or lobbying group. To make that change, we would need a much more formal structure, appointed spokespeople, an agreed and defined summary of objectives etc.

I also think the name of the site is too confrontational and militant to win any support from a public who have been mostly brainwashed to consider a house price crash as some form of armageddon type meltdown. 'Priced Out' as a name, on the other hand, generates a more sympathetic angle.

None of this is an excuse for us as individuals not talking the wisdom from this site and sharing it with others. A lot of these ideas have been raised already - posting on other internet forums (but not taking the lunatic fringe, tin foil hat approach), letters / emails to MPs and local councillors, conversations with friends, family and colleagues....

Six months ago, one of the most blatantly pro HPI sites I came across was estateagenttoday. Several of us have been (politely) plugging away over there. HPCers are now no longer regarded by contributors there as the bunch of whinging binge drinking losers who can't get a deposit together that we once were. We are now seen more along the lines of an informed alternative voice as to why the market is stagnating. As a sign of the progress that can be made (and I'm not trying to blow my own trumpet here), I'll finish this rambling monolgue with a quote that an EA posted over there yesterday:

I have to say I am finding it very interesting to hear the othersides opinion....not the one when they think WE have MADE people buy and borrow, but their reasons for why so many buyers are not stepping forward, lets be fair there are millions who possibly agree with the opinions of Rantnrave...

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14060683

And we've seen PricedOut also getting some action and political involvement. Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

If they want higher interest rates, then why dont they just pull all of their money ? Interest rates would rise double quick, if enough of them did it.

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Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

I get involved with BBC Five Live, been on air once, had the chance to be on another time, had various texts read out all on the subject of HPC. But it would be good if this site had a good reliable spokesperson. Press releases are fairly straightforward to put out ( i put out about one a month for my business) and given the subject matter I'd expect the press would lap them up.

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Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

I get involved with BBC Five Live, been on air once, had the chance to be on another time, had various texts read out all on the subject of HPC. But it would be good if this site had a good reliable spokesperson. Press releases are fairly straightforward to put out ( i put out about one a month for my business) and given the subject matter I'd expect the press would lap them up.

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I get involved with BBC Five Live, been on air once, had the chance to be on another time, had various texts read out all on the subject of HPC. But it would be good if this site had a good reliable spokesperson. Press releases are fairly straightforward to put out ( i put out about one a month for my business) and given the subject matter I'd expect the press would lap them up.

Agreed. I write one a month as well that have all received some coverage. Imagine if alongside the Halifax spokesperson's VI blurb, we could get a HPC perspective quoted on one of their monthly surveys in the MSM.

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TBH the last thing the cause of lower housing costs needs is a bunch of us lot turning up, blathering about fiat, LIAR LONES, call centres, immigrants, sheeple, zanulabor, laffer curves and sibley.

And that's before they catch wind of erranta.

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From what I can see, the purpose of this site is to be a discussion forum. It is not an advocacy or lobbying group.

Absolutely; and long may it remain just that.

Edited by CrashConnoisseur

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I also think the name of the site is too confrontational and militant to win any support from a public who have been mostly brainwashed to consider a house price crash as some form of armageddon type meltdown. 'Priced Out' as a name, on the other hand, generates a more sympathetic angle.

PricedOut release press statements full of wisdom and I don't think the powers-that-be take any notice. Nor the wider home owning public or those aspiring to buy.

Before the war, a committee was discussing names for the new fighter plane coming into service. Someone suggested the designation Spitfire, being the nickname he had given his daughter. There was all sorts of objections about it being too aggressive and confrontational a name, but it later got passed. That name projected fear into all approaching enemy as they made the flight into our airspace.

PricedOut conjures up an image of a group of young, whiny and financially poor types, even if that's not the truth of it. Housepricecrash is much scarier a name and difficult to classify members. Much more of an unknown for those looking on. Includes older STRs and lots of people who just think house prices have to fall. It's an in your face name. It's an event that most members expect, what too many vested interests fear, wish to avoid, and which seemingly government apparatus is by printing billions, interest rates at 0.5%. We can see what you're doing and we don't like it. House prices are way too expensive and market prices are being artificially supported.

So you might be right about the site name not going hand-in-hand with political campaigning or education campaigns to the wider public. That in itself should rule out the option of ever taking some action, even if we're mostly lazy and vent off anger in discussion. Perhaps alternative and challenging action, or publicity stunts, providing it's all kept safe and legal and with good taste. When JD was a spokesman for HPC I always enjoyed his hostile and unapologetic stance about the housing market, economy or whatever. 'These are the facts.' He never tried to politely educate or garner support from the public for HPC, or ask them to consider why HPC can be a good thing. He just bluntly told them to expect a big HPC.and gave them the reasons for why it will happen.

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I second Erranta for our official spokesperson.

Hold on... E R R A N T A = 5 18 18 1 14 20 1

5+18+18+1+14+20+1 = 77

77 - 13 (the number of the lost ancient tribes [pointless link here] ) = 64

64 reversed is 46

Spooky...

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Good replies!

I presented the idea in another thread of printing out masses of flyers to post through doors - why not? Can you IMAGINE if you got one through your door unexpectedly? You'd grin and rush to the computer in order to post about it here. It'd get people thinking. It's the local people we've got to reach as much as the media/politicians - a lot of them are still ignorant.

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I second Erranta for our official spokesperson.

Hold on... E R R A N T A = 5 18 18 1 14 20 1

5+18+18+1+14+20+1 = 77

77 - 13 (the number of the lost ancient tribes [pointless link here] ) = 64

64 reversed is 46

Spooky...

You need to reverse the 64 twice, you dolt.

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I couldn't agree more, HPC is all talk and no action. I know that like me one or two are fighting the cause, making derisory offers (not my words, one vendor). I have urged more of us to join in many times, the response is invariably: 'You don't want to do that, you'll only upset the estate agents.' Good! That's exactly what I want to do - undermine the confidence not only of the deluded vendors but the ea's too. And is 25-30% below asking really 'derisory?' After all, they've thought of a number and added ten or twenty percent. It's an opening gambit, trouble with the Brits is we are too compliant, don't know the first thing about negotiating, and think if we've 'beaten down' the vendor by £3k we've done really well, forget about percentages.

Estate agents are obliged by law to pass on any offer, however 'derisory'. Good to hear them grind their teeth. Eg, instructed an agent to offer £250k on £330k asking price (25% derisory discount). The actual boss of the agency phoned me to berate me for 'insulting' his client. When I politely asked what the client actually said, the guy hung up on me.

Get off your bottoms, get out there, don't be shy, give 'em hell. We are up against a huge and powerful army of vested interests, it's time to fight back.

Rant over. For now.

Round here i wouldn't pay a penny over 50% of most of the asking prices, less on some, so i'm not running round telling people i'd pay 75%.

I don't really see the point of offering anything though as if the sale comes in the sale comes in, if it doesn't it doesn't and that will send the message to the vendor. Fact is we are at the mercy of the market and while there are muppets out there furthering the illusion, and while most vendors are willing and able to wait for one of them to take a fancy to their house, we'll just have to wait.

Edited by athom

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TBH the last thing the cause of lower housing costs needs is a bunch of us lot turning up, blathering about fiat, LIAR LONES, call centres, immigrants, sheeple, zanulabor, laffer curves and sibley.

And that's before they catch wind of erranta.

LIAR LOANS IS SUB-PRIME. Without liar loans we'd all be on freaking DIY forums discussing the relative merits of egg shell over emulsion as we lovingly heap care on our homes. Its smoking gun NUMBER ONE for HPI

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LIAR LOANS IS SUB-PRIME. Without liar loans we'd all be on freaking DIY forums discussing the relative merits of egg shell over emulsion as we lovingly heap care on our homes. Its smoking gun NUMBER ONE for HPI

No disrespect to wots-his-name, but liar loans were merely the mechanism, the tool for HPI. If, for some reason, they'd not been possible, something else would have been used.

It's like saying the concentration camps couldn't have happened without Zyklon-b.

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No disrespect to wots-his-name, but liar loans were merely the mechanism, the tool for HPI. If, for some reason, they'd not been possible, something else would have been used.

It's like saying the concentration camps couldn't have happened without Zyklon-b.

Such as?

You say it's the tool for HPI but HPI wasn't the goal, they just wanted to get the debt out there and get that fake fiat money sloshing around the system. Liar loans allowed the quiet passing off of huge amounts of credit which clearly fitted New Labours agenda, they were going to make us feel rich no matter what the consequences, they wanted sub-prime to happen, the liar loan scandal (obtaining huge amounts of money by deception lets not forget. Epic scale fraud. People lying and then walking out of banks with the sort of money any self respecting bank robber would have been glad of from a job) was highlighted very clearly to government and allowed to continue unchecked for another 5 years (have you seen the BBC doc?). Everyone whose business it should have been to know about it MUST have known about it and it carried on. Therefore it was officially sanctioned.

Would the government/banksters have been able to spread this credit so quickly and so completely around the public without liar loans for houses? They couldn't force the money on us, we'd have to ask for it and there is no similar sized asset we'd have got into so enthusiastically and so widespread, only by inflating the price of an essential commodity could we all be forced to join in the fraud. So that was the motivation for us to do it nicely locked in.

While joe public could take out a fraudulent 10-15 x salary mortgage pretending it was 3x salary i very much doubt even Browns labour (as chancellor) would have officially backed this level of lending openly and if it was open and obvious i suspect enough of the unwitting investors in sub-prime would have got cold feet a lot sooner bringing the credit crunch on, maybe by 2004. It was cover for the government and bankers who denied knowledge of it, it screened the reality from the end lenders and best of all we did it to ourselves so have only ourselves to blame (sic).

Liar loans were essential to this game.

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Such as?

I dunno - "deferred intended salary multiples"? Also, I wouldn't be so sure that huge salary multiples wouldn't have flown. For that matter, given that self-certified loans were only a percentage of all mortgages, what was everyone else doing?

You say it's the tool for HPI but HPI wasn't the goal, they just wanted to get the debt out there and get that fake fiat money sloshing around the system.

Agreed (ish). I used HPI as a shorthand for expanding the debt - however, HPI forms part of that strategy (to maximise debt in order to be able to sell on more MBSs, etc.). I'd also partly dispute the idea that Labour was the main beneficiary - governments all over the world liked it (and I doubt the Tories would have stopped it had they been in), but the main force pushing it forward were the financial markets. Governments all over the world colluded, but it was business driving it, not politics.

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14060683

And we've seen PricedOut also getting some action and political involvement. Why is it we are so bone idle here, that whenever any sort of action is suggested all we get are quick jibes and comments like 'it's not worth it' or 'it wont do any good'?

This is a discussion forum. If you want to do something no one is stopping you, knock yourself out. Build a web site, it's cheap, advertise it on here and anyone interested can join in with whatever you're proposing. Everyone will have an opinion on how effective it will or wont be, but until you do it you wont know, and It might lead to something else in the future. I'd like to count myself out of any terrorist activity, as i have a bad back.

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  • 316 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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