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Ny Times - Many With New College Degree Find The Job Market Humbling

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http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/19/business/economy/19grads.html?_r=1&ref=business

The individual stories are familiar. The chemistry major tending bar. The classics major answering phones. The Italian studies major sweeping aisles at Wal-Mart.

Now evidence is emerging that the damage wrought by the sour economy is more widespread than just a few careers led astray or postponed. Even for college graduates — the people who were most protected from the slings and arrows of recession — the outlook is rather bleak.

Employment rates for new college graduates have fallen sharply in the last two years, as have starting salaries for those who can find work. What’s more, only half of the jobs landed by these new graduates even require a college degree, reviving debates about whether higher education is “worth it” after all.

“I have friends with the same degree as me, from a worse school, but because of who they knew or when they happened to graduate, they’re in much better jobs,” said Kyle Bishop, 23, a 2009 graduate of the University of Pittsburgh who has spent the last two years waiting tables, delivering beer, working at a bookstore and entering data. “It’s more about luck than anything else.”

The median starting salary for students graduating from four-year colleges in 2009 and 2010 was $27,000, down from $30,000 for those who entered the work force in 2006 to 2008, according to a study released on Wednesday by the John J. Heldrich Center for Workforce Development at Rutgers University. That is a decline of 10 percent, even before taking inflation into account.

.....

Meanwhile, college graduates are having trouble paying off student loan debt, which is at a median of $20,000 for graduates of classes 2006 to 2010.

Mr. Bishop, the Pittsburgh graduate, said he is “terrified” of the effects his starter jobs might have on his ultimate career, which he hopes to be in publishing or writing. “It looks bad to have all these short-term jobs on your résumé, but you do have to pay the bills,” he said, adding that right now his student loan debt was over $70,000.

Many graduates will probably take on more student debt. More than 60 percent of those who graduated in the last five years say they will need more formal education to be successful.

“I knew there weren’t going to be many job prospects for me until I got my Ph.D.,” said Travis Patterson, 23, a 2010 graduate of California State University, Fullerton. He is working as an administrative assistant for a property management company and studying psychology in graduate school. While it may not have anything to do with his degree, “it helps pay my rent and tuition, and that’s what matters.”

So more debt is needed to acquire more qualifications is that so you can progress from sweeping the aisles to working the tills with a phd?

Still at least UK graduates will know this is a global phenomena and it's not just UK graduates working in low end jobs that require no qualifications.

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Mr. Bishop, the Pittsburgh graduate, said he is “terrified” of the effects his starter jobs might have on his ultimate career, which he hopes to be in publishing or writing. “It looks bad to have all these short-term jobs on your résumé, but you do have to pay the bills,” he said, adding that right now his student loan debt was over $70,000.

should have highlighted that one

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Now coming to a UK town near you.

Yep. My missus works at a UK university. They cannot conceive at all that student numbers might go down once the fees really kick in and today's teenagers work out that there's no point going to uni, getting into massive debt, and then not finding a decent job. It'll take a few years IMO since they have to see their older brothers/sisters going down that path and then ending up in Macdonald's. But just like landlords who equally don't see it coming, Mr Market is going to teach these people in academia/Government a lesson.

Edited by mikthe20

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“I have friends with the same degree as me, from aworse school, but because of who they knew or when they happened tograduate, they’re in much better jobs,” said Kyle Bishop, 23, a 2009 graduate of the University of Pittsburgh

I'd say to her: Welcome to the real world!

Who you know has always been and will always be at least as important as what you know.

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Classics (whatever that is) Major and an Italian Studies major i can accept as not finding jobs , but a chemistry major?

Read an article saying the UK was screaming for science graduates , he shouldn't have much issue finding a position at home or abroad.

Unless of course he isn't as smart as his grades suggest and the courses are being progressively dumbed down.

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Well, truth be told, even getting a first class honours degree in a soft science, you are still going to be less employable than a C student coming out of a trades or technical institute.

And to top it off, the trades will earn you far more.

There are of course exceptions to the rule, but I don't see the Labour government in charge, employing everyone with a basket weaving degree.

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Jobseekers in Wales face 'frustrating' times despite fall in unemployment

http://www.thisissouthwales.co.uk/news/Jobseekers-facing-frustrating-times/article-3573115-detail/article.html

But Marc, who is also a semi-professional rugby player, is a university graduate who could not find work in his chosen subject.

Degree

He said: "I'm lucky enough to get paid for my rugby but I know what it is like to be unemployed.

"I got a degree in sport and a masters in management and marketing.

"I also have a PGC in sport but I couldn't get a job in any of those fields.

"I looked at teaching jobs for a year and a half and sports jobs for nine months.

"All the qualifications I've got didn't get me a job.

"I didn't need a qualification for this job and that's the one I got.

"When you're not entirely sure what you want to do, looking for jobs constantly and then not getting call backs from people when you have spent hours on your application form can really damage your morale."

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I was 'doing' a girl studying a History Of Art degree.

I'd never heard of it til the post-coitus chat + joint.

I did not ask 'why' as I thought it might interfere with future 'fun'.

Great pair though.

(For those interested, a HoA is something rich gels do before working in daddy's art gallery. I your dad does not own an art gallery then you are scr*wed - quite literally in Tania's case).

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This is what happens when you move to a far more "free" market model. Pretty soon- no jobs, and you are $100,000 in debt to boot.

So if you can't find a job, despite having a college degree. But there is very little social safety net (because your government thinks it makes people too lazy). What are your options. Why invest your last $$ in a tent and move somewhere it doesn't freeze in the winter time.

I bet most of you Brits have never seen the

in the USA before, have you? Edited by mel in w9

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I was 'doing' a girl studying a History Of Art degree.

I'd never heard of it til the post-coitus chat + joint.

I did not ask 'why' as I thought it might interfere with future 'fun'.

Great pair though.

(For those interested, a HoA is something rich gels do before working in daddy's art gallery. I your dad does not own an art gallery then you are scr*wed - quite literally in Tania's case).

:D

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Yes, Denninger et al have been mentioning this too.

Our 'brightest' banksters all got their harvards and yales. Heck, even bush got one, that should tell you enough about the 'quality' of education offered there.

I went to a top ten university UK, and frankly the level of tutoring was well below what i got at A-level, and barely equal to GCSE stuff.

Personally, i think upping tuition fee's to £30k a course is the kindest thing the coalition could have done.

Learn a skill (or how to say 'shine your shoe, sir?' in chinese)

Edited by Sadman

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It'll take a few years IMO since they have to see their older brothers/sisters going down that path and then ending up in Macdonald's.

McDonalds are apparently moving into automation in a big way- another career path blocked :lol:

The scary thing about US student debt is that it's totally unshakeable- you cannot get out of it without producing an authentic death certificate- or the US version of one.

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This is what happens when you move to a far more "free" market model. Pretty soon- no jobs, and you are $100,000 in debt to boot.

So if you can't find a job, despite having a college degree. But there is very little social safety net (because your government thinks it makes people too lazy). What are your options. Why invest your last $$ in a tent and move somewhere it doesn't freeze in the winter time.

I bet most of you Brits have never seen the

in the USA before, have you?

A number of people borrow more money and abscond. You have a walk around Taipei, Beijing, Hong Kong, Bangkok, Ho Chi Minh, Tokyo, Seoul etc and I'd say 90%+ of the white folks are ESL types who have no intention of ever going back and have effectively absconded from their loans.

Edited by ken_ichikawa

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McDonalds are apparently moving into automation in a big way- another career path blocked :lol:

The scary thing about US student debt is that it's totally unshakeable- you cannot get out of it without producing an authentic death certificate- or the US version of one.

They aren't you borrow money to pay off the student loan THEN go bankrupt.

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It is about the world was honest to young'uns.

That lad wants a career in publishing or writing. Well, there is zero money in publishing in the West, and most writers barely make a living wage.

And I suspect uni numbers will not go down by much when the new funding regime comes in. A few of the weaker ex-Polys may go under, but the majority of students that go to Russell Groups come from private schools and grammars where parents have money and, in many instances, have paid up to £30K a year in public school fees.

And I have seen the monthly payment amounts for the new loans that roll tuition fees and student loans together; they are unbelievably low.

For example, you don't start paying until you earn over £21K, and if you earn £21,500, you pay £3.75 a month. Yep, that's right: £3.75 a month, no matter how much you have borrowed. It rises in increments; if you earn £30K, you pay £68 a month.

My student loans repayments kicked it at over £15K, and were £109 a month -- I only orginally borrowed £5K.

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It is about the world was honest to young'uns.

That lad wants a career in publishing or writing. Well, there is zero money in publishing in the West, and most writers barely make a living wage.

And I suspect uni numbers will not go down by much when the new funding regime comes in. A few of the weaker ex-Polys may go under, but the majority of students that go to Russell Groups come from private schools and grammars where parents have money and, in many instances, have paid up to £30K a year in public school fees.

And I have seen the monthly payment amounts for the new loans that roll tuition fees and student loans together; they are unbelievably low.

For example, you don't start paying until you earn over £21K, and if you earn £21,500, you pay £3.75 a month. Yep, that's right: £3.75 a month, no matter how much you have borrowed. It rises in increments; if you earn £30K, you pay £68 a month.

My student loans repayments kicked it at over £15K, and were £109 a month -- I only orginally borrowed £5K.

Well, most writers never make much until they are long dead, and usually the goods ones are tortured souls who drink themselves to an early grave.

My brother is a successful writer and he went to college for film studies in Canada, dropped out in 2nd year, and never looked back once he figured out what he was good at.

If you lad can write now, and people are interested in reading it, I would suggest he do it as a hobby and keep submitting it. There is no university or college on this planet that will make you a good writer.

All a writer needs is a bottle of booze, some paper, and an idea.

Publishing is just a big w@nkfest of salesmen and wannabe's.

Journalism pays peanuts.

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Mr. Bishop, the Pittsburgh graduate, said he is “terrified” of the effects his starter jobs might have on his ultimate career, which he hopes to be in publishing or writing. “It looks bad to have all these short-term jobs on your résumé, but you do have to pay the bills,” he said, adding that right now his student loan debt was over $70,000.

...he's picked the wrong moment for having his mind in reverse as publishing in the US is being rocked to the foundations by the revolution of self ePublishing....and the revolution is in full swing ....if he would like to be a writer a degree is not necessary but the art and craft is a skill which needs time to cultivate.....and self publishing is the way forward...he needs to start writing ...lots of hard work ahead ....no degree will do it for him..... :rolleyes:

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A number of people borrow more money and abscond. You have a walk around Taipei, Beijing, Hong Kong, Bangkok, Ho Chi Minh, Tokyo, Seoul etc and I'd say 90%+ of the white folks are ESL types who have no intention of ever going back and have effectively absconded from their loans.

...become a bounty hunter and recover on behalf of UK taxpayers for a fee ....an honest business helping the poor taxpayer who is being defrauded... :rolleyes:

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^ don't low repayments just mean you take even longer to pay it off?

Yes, tell me how this credit/debt crisis started again?!?

Spin such as that smacks of desperation.

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  • 311 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
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      • Even
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      • up 5%



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